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CD player recommendation

Mr. Lin said:
I love the CD92 a friend has that I've spent a lot of time listening to over the years. In the modern day hi-fi forum I have a whole thread about it from not that long ago. Fantastic CD player.



My money's on the Arcam. :D
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I read that earlier today actually...it was a great read.
 
MeatInStereo said:
I read that earlier today actually...it was a great read.
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Thanks! It's been one of those rare and wonderful opportunities where I've had at this point probably hundreds of hours to listen to another person's CD player by myself, with my music.

I wish Arcam still used the Ring DAC, but I guess, based on what some of you are saying about the newer players, it doesn't really matter.
 
JohnVF said:
My money's on the Marantz. A 7k+ Marantz player from 2000 is going to be hard to beat, unless they sunk all the money in the SACD playback. But it's going to be interesting hearing how it all goes down! Do you think you can get a home audition?
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It will come down to matter of preference. The SACD playback of the Marantz is exceptional. The Arcam is a far better redbook player...no contest. I remember back in 2004 when a good friend of mine (a Marantz dealer, coincidentally) put an NAD C542 against his late 90's 8K DAC/transport and the NAD out performed it...he weren't pleased. During the last decade redbook playback has come a long way. Designers became aware, in the last 5 years, that the DAC isn't as important as the execution of the design.
 
The SACD playback is great...actually excellent but with modern recordings being so advanced a newer CD with upsampling sounds just as good as a SACD from a few years ago....and you get a better library of music too. Not everyone releases an SACD version of their album so sometimes you feel like you are listening to an SACD because it sounds good not so much because you like the music.
 
You can look up the weight, the specs, and the chipsets internally both of these CD players but what matters most is how they sound.
I first became interested in getting the best source I could to get the most out of my system. I did some trading again with my friend whom I traded gear with to obtain the Beveridge system I currently am testing.

This is a very revealing system. The best way to sum them up is everything seems live. Piano’s don’t sound like piano’s coming out of speakers….but actual keys being played….drums don’t sound like a beat….but actually the sound of a drumstick hitting them….a cello not just a bass noise coming out of a box….but the sound of a cello being played. You hear each individual instrument separately and imaged right in front of you. This is why I need a very good source…A DVD player isn’t cutting it so I obtained the Marantz SA-1. WOW….what a difference!! A veil was lifted from my head and I can hear everything the way I described it earlier. It got me thinking is this the best source I could get for my system? After all the Marantz is 10 years old. Its built like a tank….actually moved in yesterday and crushed my finger underneath it….how many can say they smashed their finger under their CDP?? It weighs 41 pounds? Ever drop a 25 on your finger at the gym….this was almost like dropping two of them on your finger.

I ordered the Arcam after reading reviews and listening to opinions from this forum and the web. The Arcam CD17 seemed like the best CD player to compare the Marantz too. The Arcam has the latest DAC’s , separate power supplies, and has a good insulation system.
So how does it sound?

Listening to Gavin Degraw’s Stripped CD…an acoustic studio production was the first test. It has piano, drums, guitars, and vocals. The Marantz sounds more true to life…The Arcam sounded like a better version of the DVD player I was using…Now I am not putting down the Arcam, it sounds very good but not as live as the Marantz. The vocals are very strong on both but the lower bass notes sounds unrealistic…and the highs are ok but don’t have the sparkle of the Marantz.
For my next test I am using Warren Bernhardts Hands On….pretty much just piano for the most part but it was recorded very excellently and is a great test CD besides being a great piano CD.

Again the bass is boomy on the Arcam as the lower keys sound not as realistic as the Marantz. The high keys are on the Marantz are sometimes harsh…but if someone was banging on the high keys in the same room as you it would be harsh. The Arcam smoothes them out…which makes it easier to listen too but again not as realistic as a live performance would be.

I played many more songs from CD’s noticing the same characteristics…the highs seemed to be smoothed out in the Arcam taking away from the reality….more boomy bass but not bad with the Arcam and the mids were just as strong as the mids of the Marantz.

I thought this duel would be close and it was a very great duel but the prize goes to the Marantz. Maybe that’s why they put it in their reference series because it’s what other players need to be compared to. I learned that the older DAC’s of Marantz are very good. I was thinking about upgrading to an external DAC if I kept the Marantz but I don’t think I could afford the right one that would make a difference after hearing the Arcam with the latest DAC’s. I know the Marantz sold for $7800 when it came out and this Arcam sells for about $1000….I don’t know what the Marantz goes for today but if you looking to upgrade definitely don’t think just because its 10 years old it can’t hang with the latest players. I have to score the Marantz a 10/10….it’s perfect…like I said it’s in the reference line. I will cry the day it doesn’t work anymore. I score the Arcam an 8.5/10. It’s a very good player and should definably be in your list if you are looking to upgrade if you can’t find a Marantz.
 
Thank you for the detailed write up. I'm a lifelong vinyl fan and never thought I'd love a CD player, until I got my Marantz SC-11s2, only a month ago, also from their reference series but a bit newer, and less expensive than the SA-1 was new. They have another one above mine (SA-7s1) that might be more comparable to what you have, unless a lot has trickled down over the years. I only auditioned a few, Musical Fidelity, Cary, NAD Master Series something or other..and never got to hear an Arcam though I've heard good things. I didn't spend too long with any of them, but none sounded bad. The Marantz is just what I wanted, though. Anyway...like you, I hope mine never goes away. It's caused my VPI to gather some dust for he first time since getting it. I haven't played it in almost 2 weeks (there's also the 'new toy' syndrome going on).

41lbs! What a beast. And not a bad looker, either. Either way, you have what sounds like two very good candidates and it's great that you got to make the comparison at home, with your Beveridges. I'm sure they are revealing of anything lacking. Have fun listening. I will be on the lookout for an SA-1 for my second system, as my Cambridge 640p v2 just isn't doing it for me. It lacks that 'realness' that you describe. I have had the hardest time finding that in a CD player.
 
No problem...it was my plesure sharing my review and take on the two players. The best way to describe what I mean by realness is i have a piano in the same room where my system is located. If someone was to play the piano and i was in the other room I know what that sounds like....with the Marantz it sounds like some is playing a live piano in the room...with the Arcam its not as real....but still really, really good. The Beveridges really do sound great ven if you are upstairs....the music travels with you.

Well my next item to look into is a preamp...and to tell you the truth I haven't heard one that doesn't take away from not using one. The RM-3 crossover is doing a great job all by itself.
 
Electrostatics usually do well on the LIAR (Listening In Another Room) test.

For a preamp give an ARC, CJ or Audible Illusions a listen.
 
JoeESP9 said:
Electrostatics usually do well on the LIAR (Listening In Another Room) test.

For a preamp give an ARC, CJ or Audible Illusions a listen.
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Thanks for the suggestion....I'll see what i can do to get those in my hands. Right now a few I have tried don't sound as good as just the crossover...Yamaha, Kenwood, and NAD....I'm thinking about Meridian, Linn, and Parasound as well.
 
I asked the preamp question to two friends of mine who've heard about everything and one said Sonic Frontiers Line 3 (or 2) , the other a Levinson #32. One of them manages an audio store, the other is a rep for a high-end home installation company.

Neither of which I've heard and neither of which I have the money for (especially the Levinson which is crazy money). I was told these were both journey-ender preamps, you'd never want another. That's what I'd like to find. I like my Marantz but it might be a little on the euphonic side if you're used to nothing at all.
 
If my crossover had a remote volume control Id probably just stick wih it....I keep the tone controls at 12. If they need adjusted then its not a good recording and i'll probably listen to it less anyway because if thats off the Beveridges will just exploit the bad production. For the most part....90% of the music that i have played so far is good. Thanks for the suggeestions and gathering the info for me!! i really appreciate it. I will see how much those are....probably out of my league but the Bev;s were too and I got those.
 
MeatInStereo said:
If my crossover had a remote volume control Id probably just stick wih it....I keep the tone controls at 12. If they need adjusted then its not a good recording and i'll probably listen to it less anyway because if thats off the Beveridges will just exploit the bad production. For the most part....90% of the music that i have played so far is good. Thanks for the suggeestions and gathering the info for me!! i really appreciate it. I will see how much those are....probably out of my league but the Bev;s were too and I got those.
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I made my suggestions based on what I've heard about the Beveridges, including a few people who said they were the best speakers they had ever heard, period. I'd list preamps that I've more experience with but what I'm familiar with is outclassed by those speakers, with the exception of my current preamp. It might be too 'euphonic' for your tastes, but it is an excellent preamp (Marantz SC-11s1), dead quiet and tonally accurate, if you are looking for one with a remote that can be found easily. But not sure if it would be best for the ARC amp, being solid state. I wanted the Sonic Frontiers but didn't feel like waiting for the right one to show up when I bought my Levinson amp. So it will wait. There are many options and many people who know much much more than I do about that level of truly stellar performance from a preamp that those speakers deserve.
 
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Im going to go to a different crossover with gain...so its like a preamp/crossover. Its made by John Curl who was with Levinson for a while. Symmetry acs-1 crossover is the model I am considering. This should allow me to change my cutoff frequency and have "gain" control as well without another piece of gear in the line.

I think I am also going to go with a higher power amp as well... 50 watts per channel is ok....but I would like to see 100 to 200 wpc. Maybe a Dyanco amp as thats what they tested the crossover I mentioned with.
 
Well looks like I lost the bet, huh John? It is admirable that the Arcam held its own, considering the price gap. I think that really just speaks to the substantial improvements in CD players during the last decade. This is why I can't wait until people start to unload the current generation of CD players in favor of music servers, and then the CD players I dream about will be attainable. As it stands now the newest one I could afford was about 5 years old, not bad I guess.

So MeatInStereo, are tubes out of the question for your preamp? If it were me I'd be looking at something from Audio Research, especially if you're going to buy new, based on some of the reviews I've read lately. Just a thought.
 
Nice write up. Always liked Marantz SACD playback and still am not fond of their redbook playback (never offensive but never exciting either). A little too much meat on the bones for me. Arcam has a very good hifi sound but always comes up short relative to the "realness" factor. That's why I have never owned one. I'm in love with Naim and Rega relative to redbook...and will give Marantz another listen. I did enjoy my CD63 many moons ago.
 
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