• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Choosing a silent power amp for control room

M

morganomega

New Member
I always loved my HAFLER P5000. What a powerful clean sound. One day a channel went out (the cooling design isn't so great). So I bought a crap alesis amp to get something quickly, but I hate it with a passion.

So I'm looking now to find an amp, but I'd love to find something without a fan that sounds as good or better than my old hafler. Or I could just get that hafler repaired, that's always an option. That thing runs HOT though. HOT and loud. I'd probably have to get it out of the control room and into a separate room, and that might be what I'll wind up doing...

But if anyone can suggest a quiet amp that sounds comparable to my old beefy Hafler I might go for that. Budget is limited but i can find great deals on ebay...hopefully under 200, but I realize I may have to spend a little more...
 
Register to hide this ad
Does it need to be rack mounted? Sounds like an Adcom 545 or 555 might be right up your alley. No fan is going to be expensive for large wattage however.
 
Thanks for the responses...I am interested in the adcoms but I think I'm just going to repair the hafler pro5000, I was very happy with the punch and power of that. So now I have to get some long speaker wires, about 20 feet. one pair with bare wires and one pair with 1/4" cables. Which gauge should I get? I'm thinking 14 or 16 gauge is fine, or will I get more low end with 12 gauge? some people have told me it's just silly and the gauge doesn't even matter that much...in which case 18 gauge would be fine I guess.
 
Knowing what speakers you're driving would help. I run 12 AWG everywhere, but for 20 feet runs assuming your speakers are 8 ohm 16 AWG is just fine. Losses are ignorable.
 
thanks Ivan. I have alesis monitor one mk2, and KRK ST6 and some old JBL 4408's that I almost never use anymore they just sound muddy. Surpringly I like those alesis monitor one mk2. what a surprise those are. I pretty much hate anything else ever made by Alesis, but those are actually not too bad. I don't have 1000's of dollars for monitors so that's what I have right now. I'd love some westlake or high end tannoys and even some ns-10's would be dope, but I don't have the budget for that stuff yet. I guess 16 gauge it is! it's only 20 feet, but that amp is pretty high power. You don't think 12 gauge would get me more low end or is that just competely absurd. (many schools of thought on this I realize). Probably nothing the ear could notice.
 
would those jbl 4408's be worth reconing? I wonder if they sound muddy because the cones are just ancient. There's no visible damage or tears, but I remember loving those at one time (a different set of them). I have a feeling, they will just never sound as crisp and punchy as the alesis monitor one mk2 speakers. Maybe it's time to retire those old jbl's...I thought they might be good overheads, but they just sound muddy and distant...there's a guy in Hollywood (Stephen) that does a mod for speakers, he swears it brings the low end to life! (with a money back guarantee)...I'm thinking about bring in the KRK"s and see if they are suddenly way beyond the Alesis...At the moment, the alesis is only slightly better sounding than the KRK, they are about the same really...he swears by this mod he does and he really stands behind it firmly with a money back guarantee, why not check out his amazing mod right?. I wonder what he does (big secret I think). If his mod suddenly makes those KRK's sound WAY better than the ALESIS, then I'll probably get the mod on everything. it's 80 bucks per speaker...might be a great investment, this guy has been doing speaker repair for over 40 years...do tweeters go bad over decades of use like old woofers? those jbl's are just not very bright or crisp on the high end, and the low end is muddy AF. I used to LOVE these jbl's but then times have changed and my ears have changed, maybe it's time to retire those suckers. OR...woofers just get tired after decades, not sure about tweeters.
 
Last edited:
I wouldn't spend $1 on anything with the KRK badge on it. I don't think investing $160 in those speakers is a good idea. Save those 160 to buy better speakers if you need.

My Infinity Speakers are 40 years old and sound powerful and crispy and perfectly fine, I don't think the woofers on your JBLs went bad (check the surrounds). Probably the tweeters (if they use ferrofluid) or the crossover capacitors, or just the way they are designed. If you have a home studio, it's quite easy to do some freq response and SPL measurements.

Regarding the amp, if you already have an amp that you like, I'd say get it fixed.

If not, crown D75 are low profile silent amps, (sometimes the transformer hums a bit), and the Samson Servo 120 / 240 /260 are also little powerful amps used in studios. Not the power of your Hafler, but widely used.
 
Last edited:
morganomega said:
thanks Ivan. I have alesis monitor one mk2, and KRK ST6 and some old JBL 4408's that I almost never use anymore they just sound muddy. Surpringly I like those alesis monitor one mk2. what a surprise those are. I pretty much hate anything else ever made by Alesis, but those are actually not too bad. I don't have 1000's of dollars for monitors so that's what I have right now. I'd love some westlake or high end tannoys and even some ns-10's would be dope, but I don't have the budget for that stuff yet. I guess 16 gauge it is! it's only 20 feet, but that amp is pretty high power. You don't think 12 gauge would get me more low end or is that just competely absurd. (many schools of thought on this I realize). Probably nothing the ear could notice.
Click to expand...
Those JBL’s should still be killer, need power though. Don’t recone anything, they should be fine. The foam is still good on the woofers?
Nah 12 awg won’t do anything for bass. Just a nice thought.
 
The hafler runs HOT because it was designed to. Research what MEHSA is at it applies to the thermal design.
 
elnaldo said:
I wouldn't spend $1 on anything with the KRK badge on it. I don't think investing $160 in those speakers is a good idea. Save those 160 to buy better speakers if you need.

My Infinity Speakers are 40 years old and sound powerful and crispy and perfectly fine, I don't think the woofers on your JBLs went bad (check the surrounds). Probably the tweeters (if they use ferrofluid) or the crossover capacitors, or just the way they are designed. If you have a home studio, it's quite easy to do some freq response and SPL measurements.

Regarding the amp, if you already have an amp that you like, I'd say get it fixed.

If not, crown D75 are low profile silent amps, (sometimes the transformer hums a bit), and the Samson Servo 120 / 240 /260 are also little powerful amps used in studios. Not the power of your Hafler, but widely used.
Click to expand...


thanks man. Yea, the krk's underwhelmed me, I might just sell those. Surprisngly the alesis monitor one mk2 isn't that bad, I like it way better than the krk's (not saying much apparently). What is a speaker you would recommend that is way better the the krk sk6 (passive monitors, I don't like powered monitors).

what is the model of your infinity's, those are intriguing (and maybe super hard to find I bet)

re: my jbl's. I might bring those to stephen to do his mod, and he can check everything, I bet you're right, do tweeters go bad after decades and decades..who knows how much use those jbls had, probably a lot over 40 years right. There were given to me cheap years ago by a friend who probably played them a lot. Maybe they could be revived and might be the star player. They SHOULD blow away the alesis and the KRK right? I knew I wasn't crazy. Those tweeters are probably tapped out. I remember those speakers sounding AMAZING (different pair I used to have that fried out in an electrical fire and just smelled too horrible so I got rid of those). Why did they fry out? Under powered home stereo amp foolishly connected. That's when I got the hafler, so that will never happen again, it just so happened the HAFLER also sounds incredible, especially with those jbl's those should be BANGING right? Those can be revived i bet, I forgot that tweeter can go bad, I think those are shot. That might be an expensive repair damn...I think Stephen could make this sing again for me, then with his mod, they could be spectacular monitors...I'm excited about fixing those jbls now, those should blow away just about any speaker made today right? if they are full serviced and working right.
 
ivandezande said:
Those JBL’s should still be killer, need power though. Don’t recone anything, they should be fine. The foam is still good on the woofers?
Nah 12 awg won’t do anything for bass. Just a nice thought.
Click to expand...

ok, you guys have convinced me to get those jbl's serviced. although... is there a speaker set I could get for 250 bucks (about what fixing those jbl's might cost) it might even cost me 300 to fix 2 tweeters plus 80 bucks each for his mod. might be close to 500 bucks...

are there areny spectacular speakers I should consider buying and just retire those old jbl's...I bet those could be dope af if I fixed them up and mod'ed them...

not sure about the foam on the woofer, Stephen might tell me all both woofers and both tweeters are very weak...THEN then it's time to retire them maybe, or buy 2 new 8 in. woofers and 2 new tweeters, maybe I could find better components and make them better than the stock 4408's...lots of options here, at least it's FUN. I love this stuff. I'm going to deoxit the hafler today, see if that fixes the dead channel..haha, I heard half the time, deoxit will fix it and the channel isn't even blown, although with these hafler pro5000 amps, I wouldn't be surprised at all if one channel fried, the ventilation in the rack isn['t great and that amp runs super hot. I'm moving that amp to it's own nice cool room once I get it working, I don't want to hear the fan or feel the heat of that sucker anymore in the control room. I didn't realize how super easy it actually is to move an amp out of the control room, once I thought about it for a minute more, I realized it was a SUPER easy upgrade just need a long high quality speaker wire and a long quality 1/4" cable. I can hardly wait to hear that hafler again, that I am fixing for sure not sure about the JBLs..guess it depends on how much it's going to cost. If I decide NOT to do it, I have to pay 80 bucks for the diagnosis...

Is there an easy way for me to test the jbl's to see what's what? I should feel the tweeters vibrating with a touch of the fingers right? but is that enough to tell if they are ok...something is definitely not right with those jbl's, maybe as you say they neeed a lot of power and they are just underpowered right now with the temporary **** alesis RA150....(it actually crashes! and I have to restart the amp). maybe they used to sound spectacular because I was running the HAFLER~! hahah That also makes perfect sense. I want to throw this alesis RA150 amp out the window it's so horrible....even the other speakers are going to sound WAY better with the hafler back online soon...still, those jbl's sound muddy I think one or both tweetersare not tweeting too good
 
There are many mini fans.. designed to run quiet and cool that would help that Hafler along, since it seems you are going to keep it :thumbsup:
 
50nstillhifi said:
There are many mini fans.. designed to run quiet and cool that would help that Hafler along, since it seems you are going to keep it :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

another compelling reason to bring it in for a service, he could probably swap in some way quieter fans in 2019 than the ones available when this amp was born. Really good point.
 
I blasted one of the volume pots, but the other one I can't get the knob off, it's a VERY tiny screw or hex in there, not sure which...I think I need to also blast that one...so I need to get fricken knob off, it only has one knob and I can't seem to get it off (so far). I'm going to get a magnifying glass and see what screw that is, it's tiny and way in there...screw is so very TINY...arg
 
Maybe you need powered speakers. JBL LSR 2325, 2328, or newer 305 or 308s. Dump the amp.

Currently mixing on Mackie powered 8 inchers, don’t know the model number, impressive!
 
morganomega said:
those should blow away just about any speaker made today right?
Click to expand...
Definitely no. For sure there are many many speakers made today better than those JBLs (even if I never heard them, and haven't seen all the speakers in the world, it's simply not possible what you say, your little JBLs being beter than any other speaker)

Spending someone else's money is not easy, but I would think a lot before spending $500 in your old JBLs plus $$ to fix the hafler.

With that budget , + money you can get selling some of your stuff, I'm sure you can get some very good powered monitors.

Try to diagnose the JBL by yourself: Check for rotten surrounds, and measure with a microphone the woofer and tweeter output.

Mackie is a very good budget option. I've heard 8" powered monitors, not critical listening, but they sound very good indeed.

I see you have still many options, think a bit more about it, focus on what you really need, try to listen the speakers you think to buy. Don't discard powered monitors. Almost all (if not all) the recording studios are using powered monitors today. They offer a very accurate active crossover at line level, much more accurate than a passive crossover at the speaker side. The "downside" I see is they are not made to last. Chinese components that will last around 10-15 years if you are lucky, and then (or before 10 years) they will need to be repaired or replaced.

My daily speakers are Infinity Qb. A budget Infinity speaker at its time.
 
elnaldo said:
Definitely no. For sure there are many many speakers made today better than those JBLs (even if I never heard them, and haven't seen all the speakers in the world, it's simply not possible what you say, your little JBLs being beter than any other speaker)

Spending someone else's money is not easy, but I would think a lot before spending $500 in your old JBLs plus $$ to fix the hafler.

With that budget , + money you can get selling some of your stuff, I'm sure you can get some very good powered monitors.

Try to diagnose the JBL by yourself: Check for rotten surrounds, and measure with a microphone the woofer and tweeter output.

Mackie is a very good budget option. I've heard 8" powered monitors, not critical listening, but they sound very good indeed.

I see you have still many options, think a bit more about it, focus on what you really need, try to listen the speakers you think to buy. Don't discard powered monitors. Almost all (if not all) the recording studios are using powered monitors today. They offer a very accurate active crossover at line level, much more accurate than a passive crossover at the speaker side. The "downside" I see is they are not made to last. Chinese components that will last around 10-15 years if you are lucky, and then (or before 10 years) they will need to be repaired or replaced.

My daily speakers are Infinity Qb. A budget Infinity speaker at its time.
Click to expand...
 
I dislike powered monitors, they always sound like plastic boxes. I think those are great for the mp3 generation, but can you imagine if Steely Dan and Led Zeppelin had mixed on plastic self powered mackies? they always sound like chit. maybe there are some good ones nowadays, I have not listened to self powered monitors in a long time. Professional recording studios in LA never have self powered monitors, that's a home studio thing. the jbl 4408 is a pretty large wooden cabinet, I wouldn't call them little)...

I found a pair of Infinity Qb in my hood! They have a weird looking port cover, wait that's the tweeter!!. They actually look similar to the JBL 4408, probably the same era, but these Qb's are 3 way!. I might just buy those if you say they are amazing, I bet they sound great. These are all setup and ready to go! no repair required. I might have to pick those up...just haggling a bit on the price with him. I like the 10' woofers, I bet they have a big sound. i can't afford TADS for my "overheads" but those infinity's might do (for home studio)

I could leave my old jbl's behind (repairing them will probably cost more than buying these Infinity Qb).

Will those Infinity Qb handle the power from my HAFLER? sounds like they would be perfect with the HAFLER!
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom