Classic High-End Gear

[THEWEREWOLF]

When are you going to invest in some "real" gear"? You know, separates. They allow you to have more gear to show off and they sound better.

I noticed you haven't mentioned any speakers. I'm quite curious as to what you're using. They are, after all, the most important part of any system.

I don't like separates so that train will never enter my station. If separates make your heart pound I won't berate your love. My speakers are just basic SONY, Polk and Pioneer floor standing towers. I've been blessed with cerebral palsy and other cognitive defects so speakers all pretty much the same to me. I enjoy the music from any speaker that is not cheap and tinny. Heck I even have some huge Fisher speakers most audiophiles say are junk but I love em. I'm no audiophile thank goodness as a result a good $300 SONY tower speaker off Amazon.com is all I need. I have no need or desire to buy $3,000 speakers because my ears don't need whatever motivates audiophiles to spend insane amounts on speakers. I buy top end receivers because I enjoy twiddling the knobs to get the best sound. I love the connection to my youth. Most of all I love the old technology in vintage gear. If I like the sound a speaker makes then that's all I need nothing more.

Growing up all I wanted were receivers. ONLY Separates I'd want is a really nice really expensive McIntosh. When I must scale down to one system I might buy a single McIntosh to replace my 9 receivers. Till then I am having a blast with the receivers I have now.

 

[Ds2000]

I don't like separates so that train will never enter my station. If separates make your heart pound I won't berate your love. My speakers are just basic SONY, Polk and Pioneer floor standing towers. I've been blessed with cerebral palsy and other cognitive defects so speakers all pretty much the same to me. I enjoy the music from any speaker that is not cheap and tinny. Heck I even have some huge Fisher speakers most audiophiles say are junk but I love em. I'm no audiophile thank goodness as a result a good $300 SONY tower speaker off Amazon.com is all I need. I have no need or desire to buy $3,000 speakers because my ears don't need whatever motivates audiophiles to spend insane amounts on speakers. I buy top end receivers because I enjoy twiddling the knobs to get the best sound. I love the connection to my youth. Most of all I love the old technology in vintage gear. If I like the sound a speaker makes then that's all I need nothing more.

Growing up all I wanted were receivers. ONLY Separates I'd want is a really nice really expensive McIntosh. When I must scale down to one system I might buy a single McIntosh to replace my 9 receivers. Till then I am having a blast with the receivers I have now.

Great answer. The hobby is about what makes you happy.

 

[Ds2000]

The amp on the right wants to know why you wont take the box off of it.

Was/is part of a shipping disaster.

 

[JoeESP9]

I don't like separates so that train will never enter my station. If separates make your heart pound I won't berate your love. My speakers are just basic SONY, Polk and Pioneer floor standing towers. I've been blessed with cerebral palsy and other cognitive defects so speakers all pretty much the same to me. I enjoy the music from any speaker that is not cheap and tinny. Heck I even have some huge Fisher speakers most audiophiles say are junk but I love em. I'm no audiophile thank goodness as a result a good $300 SONY tower speaker off Amazon.com is all I need. I have no need or desire to buy $3,000 speakers because my ears don't need whatever motivates audiophiles to spend insane amounts on speakers. I buy top end receivers because I enjoy twiddling the knobs to get the best sound. I love the connection to my youth. Most of all I love the old technology in vintage gear. If I like the sound a speaker makes then that's all I need nothing more.

Growing up all I wanted were receivers. ONLY Separates I'd want is a really nice really expensive McIntosh. When I must scale down to one system I might buy a single McIntosh to replace my 9 receivers. Till then I am having a blast with the receivers I have now.

Sheesh, man. Lighten up. Are you always this defensive?

I added the big green grin to indicate I was "yankin" your chain about the separates. I'm sorry you didn't understand.

I merely asked what speakers you are using. They make a bigger difference than any other part of a system. You can usually get a pretty good idea about someone's taste by the speakers they use.

Your cerebral palsy has absolutely nothing to do with anything I posted. In addition, nothing that I posted mentioned one single word about the cost/price of anything.

I will think twice before I respond to any more of your posts.

FWIW Separates still sound better! So there!

 

[Morgan D]

I like the receivers that can be separated with pre in and out put jacks. I just ordered a Frenzel tube integrated amp that has that function.

 

[Uncle Paul]

What an awesome thread!

I'll add that anything VFET is high end.

What makes a VFET special is that they have the linearity of a tube with the low noise, low distortion, and stability of solid state. Basically most of the advantages and few of the drawbacks of each type, though many do enjoy the inherent distortion of tubes, which is likely akin to me singing in the shower almost never causes glass to break or my dogs to try to bury their ears.

The main reason that there weren't a lot of them and that they haven't been made since ~1980 is cost. A set of replacement VFETs was almost the same price as an entire conventional amplifier.

They also have a three dimensional sound stage that is second to none. You have to experience it to fully understand it. Pair them with the right speaker like a JBL-XPL200A or a Yamaha NS-10000 and it's mesmerizing. IMO both of those speakers belong in this thread.

If you run across any of these do not let them get away. Do make sure you have them serviced by someone who has worked on VFETS before you power them up to prevebt damaging these no longer made and magical devices. Great info at The Vintage Knob, where I purloined these photos: http://www.thevintageknob.org/ Go to Specials, then V-Fet.

JVC JM-S7


Sony TA-N7B


Yamaha B-1

Yamaha B-2


Yamaha B-3

 

[just dave]

Great gear and the Vintage Knob is an awesome site!

 

[THEWEREWOLF]

Sheesh, man. Lighten up. Are you always this defensive?

I added the big green grin to indicate I was "yankin" your chain about the separates. I'm sorry you didn't understand.

I merely asked what speakers you are using. They make a bigger difference than any other part of a system. You can usually get a pretty good idea about someone's taste by the speakers they use.

Your cerebral palsy has absolutely nothing to do with anything I posted. In addition, nothing that I posted mentioned one single word about the cost/price of anything.

I will think twice before I respond to any more of your posts.

FWIW Separates still sound better! So there!

Dang dude I was not even mad. Having cerebral palsy might make me less aware of the fine points of sound audiophiles care about. I'm no audiophile I don't know anything about what sounds good based on audiophile standards. Does cerebral palsy affect how I experience sound compared to typical humans. Hell if I know so I said as much. I am fine with being autistic and having cerebral palsy. I'm just clueless about speakers is all. I was trying to answer your question honestly nothing more. I was NOT trying to be defensive because what speakers I like hardly matter to me or you.

I see people here talk about the build, acoustic and other qualities of particular speakers in such detail here. It all flies over my head at warp speed. I know nothing about speakers. All I know is what I like. I don't like cheap tinny sounding speakers. I like a speaker that has room for a lot of base. I like floor standing speakers. I like bigger rather than small speakers. I like speakers that are not made of particle board. I like the look of speakers with mesh that let you see the drivers.

All of that is likely meaningless to you because I value these basic or cosmetic things. My writing style is often misunderstood and thus assumed as "defensive or harsh" by those who do not know me. I don't know you hence I have nothing to become defensive about. I answered the question to the best of my ability. I informed you of my autism and cerebral palsy because I am aware that these things might render my opinions unique among responses. I inform you of same so you are forewarned. If being honest makes me defensive in your eyes I disagree, but gladly accept your judgment and move on!

 

[JoeESP9]

The actual and only deal with speakers is how they sound to you. Speakers sound sufficiently different that almost anyone can hear the difference between various brands and models. I always suggest that making the effort to hear different speakers usually helps with selecting speakers.

In that vein, I've ridden the train from Philly to NYC, Wilmington DE and Washington DC to audition gear. For NYC it's an all-day affair. For DC it's an overnighter. Wilmington is a most of the day excursion. It's also via the train.

Please don't denigrate your own ears. Your hearing is probably a lot more acute than you think.

I can't speak without either a voice prosthesis (TEP prosthesis) or an electrolarynx. However, that doesn't make my listening to vocals any less acute than when I could speak.

Anyone who is interested in getting the best sound out of their system is by definition an audiophile. It has nothing to do with how much one spends or what gear they have. It's all in the desire and intent to achieve the best sound one can within their personal restrictions of cost and circumstances. Just about everyone who contributes to this site is by definition and action an "audiophile", although some will say they're not. I disagree, they are audiophiles. They're just denying the truth.

It's rather unfortunate that the term "audiophile" has developed the "snob" connotation it now has for many. In my 50+ years with this hobby (passion) the only snobs I've met have all been salesmen who were only interested in how much money one was willing to spend. Those salesmen have all but disappeared with the death of so many B&M audio emporiums.

The term "audiophile" means only one thing, "Lover of sound", just that and nothing more. The term HiFi is actually a shortening of the term, "To reproduce with a high degree of fidelity".

IMO/E to properly judge a speaker and its sound you need some sort of reference. My reference is the Philadelphia Orchestra at the Kimmel Center. I don't believe that any sort of concert/show with a PA system is an accurate way to determine how a speaker sounds. What comes out of a PA system is what someone thinks sounds good. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with reality. Besides, electrified instruments can and often do sound very different from instrument to instrument and concert to concert.

Live unamplified music is IMO the only true reference for determining the accuracy of one's playback. Violins and French horns always sound the same regardless of the orchestra. I'm aware that different violins and other instruments sound very slightly different. No matter. The differences are very small. A Stradivarius and a Guarneri may sound very slightly different. However, they both sound like violins.

 

[THEWEREWOLF]

The actual and only deal with speakers is how they sound to you. Speakers sound sufficiently different that almost anyone can hear the difference between various brands and models. I always suggest that making the effort to hear different speakers usually helps with selecting speakers.

In that vein, I've ridden the train from Philly to NYC, Wilmington DE and Washington DC to audition gear. For NYC it's an all-day affair. For DC it's an overnighter. Wilmington is a most of the day excursion. It's also via the train.

Please don't denigrate your own ears. Your hearing is probably a lot more acute than you think.

I can't speak without either a voice prosthesis (TEP prosthesis) or an electrolarynx. However, that doesn't make my listening to vocals any less acute than when I could speak.

Anyone who is interested in getting the best sound out of their system is by definition an audiophile. It has nothing to do with how much one spends or what gear they have. It's all in the desire and intent to achieve the best sound one can within their personal restrictions of cost and circumstances. Just about everyone who contributes to this site is by definition and action an "audiophile", although some will say they're not. I disagree, they are audiophiles. They're just denying the truth.

It's rather unfortunate that the term "audiophile" has developed the "snob" connotation it now has for many. In my 50+ years with this hobby (passion) the only snobs I've met have all been salesmen who were only interested in how much money one was willing to spend. Those salesmen have all but disappeared with the death of so many B&M audio emporiums.

The term "audiophile" means only one thing, "Lover of sound", just that and nothing more. The term HiFi is actually a shortening of the term, "To reproduce with a high degree of fidelity".

IMO/E to properly judge a speaker and its sound you need some sort of reference. My reference is the Philadelphia Orchestra at the Kimmel Center. I don't believe that any sort of concert/show with a PA system is an accurate way to determine how a speaker sounds. What comes out of a PA system is what someone thinks sounds good. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with reality. Besides, electrified instruments can and often do sound very different from instrument to instrument and concert to concert.

Live unamplified music is IMO the only true reference for determining the accuracy of one's playback. Violins and French horns always sound the same regardless of the orchestra. I'm aware that different violins and other instruments sound very slightly different. No matter. The differences are very small. A Stradivarius and a Guarneri may sound very slightly different. However, they both sound like violins.

I love everything you shared and for that thank you so much. I actually have a template I use when determining if a speaker is "right for me!" I know it sounds silly but, I close my eyes and listen intently. If the sound feels as if the object associated with that sound is in the room with me I love the speaker(s). I have a blu ray DVD of Star Trek the Wrath of Khan. There is a scene where doctor McCoy is in a bar talking to an alien. On my 7-1 surround sound system it feels as if I am in the center of multiple conversations going on all around me.

Good speakers make that environment feel so real with my eyes closed I almost feel paranoid. Also for me good speakers don't hiss when nothing is being played. Finally there are certain passages of classical music I love. I know these passages completely and know exactly how they should sound when reproduced clearly. All speakers don't reproduce this passage exactly so I don't like them as much. However some speakers that are horrible for classical and terrible for disco or house music.

It is actually very funny that this whole issue of expensive speakers involves me here. I just committed to buy 2 transparent speakers today and the bleeding things cost $3,000 for two. They are see through and I like them. These large clear speakers are the last things I am buying for my vintage audio collections. I think these clear speakers are the dumbest expensive thing I've ever purchased but I like them. I will post pictures of them once I have them set up. I feel such a fool buying $3K speakers when so many are having troubles making ends meet and I'm wasting money on weird hobby items. It is just very rare to see BIG clear speakers that are also better quality.

I just want to have systems that make people go wow you don't see that often if at all! I love this stuff. Again thank you for being the voice of reason. I enjoyed reading every word you shared. I love everyone here. People think I'm dour and mean. Nope, I don't understand many humans but I love your company. I've learned more by sharing myself than I had when I self isolated. There are times when I want to self isolate but that path leads only to dark places. This is where the fun is among you. Those who think I am angry just don't know how to understand my writing style.

 

[Morgan D]

The actual and only deal with speakers is how they sound to you. Speakers sound sufficiently different that almost anyone can hear the difference between various brands and models. I always suggest that making the effort to hear different speakers usually helps with selecting speakers.

In that vein, I've ridden the train from Philly to NYC, Wilmington DE and Washington DC to audition gear. For NYC it's an all-day affair. For DC it's an overnighter. Wilmington is a most of the day excursion. It's also via the train.

Please don't denigrate your own ears. Your hearing is probably a lot more acute than you think.

I can't speak without either a voice prosthesis (TEP prosthesis) or an electrolarynx. However, that doesn't make my listening to vocals any less acute than when I could speak.

Anyone who is interested in getting the best sound out of their system is by definition an audiophile. It has nothing to do with how much one spends or what gear they have. It's all in the desire and intent to achieve the best sound one can within their personal restrictions of cost and circumstances. Just about everyone who contributes to this site is by definition and action an "audiophile", although some will say they're not. I disagree, they are audiophiles. They're just denying the truth.

It's rather unfortunate that the term "audiophile" has developed the "snob" connotation it now has for many. In my 50+ years with this hobby (passion) the only snobs I've met have all been salesmen who were only interested in how much money one was willing to spend. Those salesmen have all but disappeared with the death of so many B&M audio emporiums.

The term "audiophile" means only one thing, "Lover of sound", just that and nothing more. The term HiFi is actually a shortening of the term, "To reproduce with a high degree of fidelity".

IMO/E to properly judge a speaker and its sound you need some sort of reference. My reference is the Philadelphia Orchestra at the Kimmel Center. I don't believe that any sort of concert/show with a PA system is an accurate way to determine how a speaker sounds. What comes out of a PA system is what someone thinks sounds good. It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with reality. Besides, electrified instruments can and often do sound very different from instrument to instrument and concert to concert.

Live unamplified music is IMO the only true reference for determining the accuracy of one's playback. Violins and French horns always sound the same regardless of the orchestra. I'm aware that different violins and other instruments sound very slightly different. No matter. The differences are very small. A Stradivarius and a Guarneri may sound very slightly different. However, they both sound like violins.

Barry Tuckwell might have had other opinions.

 

[JoeESP9]

Who the Hell is Barry Tuckwell, and why would he object to auditioning speakers before buying?

 

[goodolpg]

Barely Tuckedwell is/was a new style of swimming wear Target got lambasted for last month.

 

[Morgan D]

Oh, I was just referring to the " violins and french horns sounding the same regardless of orchestra "
Barry Tuckwell was one of the best horn players of his time.
probably shouldn't have posted . Sorry

 

[JoeESP9]

I love everything you shared and for that thank you so much. I actually have a template I use when determining if a speaker is "right for me!" I know it sounds silly but, I close my eyes and listen intently. If the sound feels as if the object associated with that sound is in the room with me I love the speaker(s). I have a blu ray DVD of Star Trek the Wrath of Khan. There is a scene where doctor McCoy is in a bar talking to an alien. On my 7-1 surround sound system it feels as if I am in the center of multiple conversations going on all around me.

Good speakers make that environment feel so real with my eyes closed I almost feel paranoid. Also for me good speakers don't hiss when nothing is being played. Finally there are certain passages of classical music I love. I know these passages completely and know exactly how they should sound when reproduced clearly. All speakers don't reproduce this passage exactly so I don't like them as much. However some speakers that are horrible for classical and terrible for disco or house music.

It is actually very funny that this whole issue of expensive speakers involves me here. I just committed to buy 2 transparent speakers today and the bleeding things cost $3,000 for two. They are see through and I like them. These large clear speakers are the last things I am buying for my vintage audio collections. I think these clear speakers are the dumbest expensive thing I've ever purchased but I like them. I will post pictures of them once I have them set up. I feel such a fool buying $3K speakers when so many are having troubles making ends meet and I'm wasting money on weird hobby items. It is just very rare to see BIG clear speakers that are also better quality.

I just want to have systems that make people go wow you don't see that often if at all! I love this stuff. Again thank you for being the voice of reason. I enjoyed reading every word you shared. I love everyone here. People think I'm dour and mean. Nope, I don't understand many humans but I love your company. I've learned more by sharing myself than I had when I self isolated. There are times when I want to self isolate but that path leads only to dark places. This is where the fun is among you. Those who think I am angry just don't know how to understand my writing style.

I want a system that makes me go wow. Please note, I have judiciously stayed away from mentioning the price/cost of anything.

When you hear hiss, it's not generated by the speakers. Hiss is almost completely amplifier related. Some speakers such as some horns accentuate whatever hiss is in the recording or the gear. IME those awful piezoelectric tweeters that are in many PA speakers also accentuate hiss. They also make me want to cut off my ears and run away.

I reiterate, cost is not directly related to sound. In addition, I refer back to my comment about what one's reference is. IME the closer I've gotten to what I hear at The Kimmel Center (Philadelphia Orchestra) the better my system sounds on everything else.

FWIW: I do not consider $3K for a pair of speakers to be all that expensive. I've been exposed to systems that cost way north of $500K. IMO they do sound better.

 

[JoeESP9]

Oh, I was just referring to the " violins and french horns sounding the same regardless of orchestra "
Barry Tuckwell was one of the best horn players of his time.
probably shouldn't have posted . Sorry

That's exactly why I use unamplified orchestral music performed completely acoustically (no PA sweetening) as my reference.

I'm still curious. Who the Hell is Barry Tuckwell and why should I listen to what he has said or written. What instrument did/does he play. The term "horn" could refer to anything from a French horn to a Trumpet, to a trombone or to a saxophone. Which is it.

 

[Morgan D]

French horn. Google him. He is just a highly regarded musician. Nothing more.

 

[sunrayjack12]

Macintosh 1900 preamp with dynaco st70 hooked to vintage Altec A7's.
And a vintage pioneer dvd player for the cd's.
I have vintage TT but like a no hassel listening experience and those old thin silver faced Sony and pioneer dvd players sound really good.
I have a high-end Cambridge blue ray dvd player and you would be hard pressed to hear a noticeable difference between the two.

Altec A7's are not just for sound reinforcement, tweaked a little they are amazing.

 

[Diego Ted]

Sorry for the repeated pictures but I'd add the following. I love the vintage silver face audio gear that hails from the 1970's War Of The Receiver Watts!. I have these 8 pieces in my collection and love it. Hope you can appreciate it too.

Marantz 2330B,
Pioneer SX-1980,
Pioneer SX-1280
Pioneer SX-1250
Pioneer SX-950
Sansui G9700
Hitachi SR-2004
Onkyo TX-8500-MKII

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I can dig it!!

 

[beardsley]

I appreciate the old monster receivers, for sure.

family know about my stereo-centric interests, and someone offered me a receiver for free. All I knew was it was an old Kenwood with a light-up dial in excellent cond. I said HELL YES I want it! Who cares which old Kenwood. I was expecting a modest item, maybe a KR-4070, which is a very common piece. Nope- it was an Eleven G, sold exclusively in military base shops. Absolute monster, gigantic, all the bells and whistles. Lovely piece of gear and history for that matter. I accepted it humbly, didn't freak out too much at the time, but was giddy and felt like a kid all over again exploring its various features.

We've moved a lot over the past several years and on one of them it just wasn't feasible to take a lot of extra gear. I unloaded some good stuff for ridiculous prices, sometimes free. I did sell the Eleven G and got a pretty good price but sure wish I still had that old beauty.