Connection Advice

[A/V Dude]

I'm relativity new to a decent AV setup and I just purchased an Integra DHC-9.9 pre/pro and an AudioControl Pantages G3 amp. I use Tidal music on my IPhone 16 pro-max as my main source for music and have it hooked up with a 3.5mm to standard RCA cord (and a USB-c to female 3.5mm adapter) to the CD input on the back of the pre/pro and my old Lenovo t540 laptop the same way to the aux input.

I know this isn't the best way to go about it but not sure what to do to achieve the best quality sound. I have some older Paradigm Studio 100 V.2 and Studio 40's V.2 speakers and I'm sure they arent performimng close to their capasity.

Any advice for this old guy wopuild be greatly appreciated!!!

 

[Sandman1221]

So are both computer and iphone giving you underperforming speakers? And has this occurred just with the new preamp and amp? And what is the ohm rating for the speakers and amp?

I use a 3.5 mm to dual RCA cable to connect my ipad to preamp, and it sounds great! So my next question is what brand cable are you using? I use a 25' KabelDirekt cable from Amazon, only $12 but well made.

I know on my old NAD 317 the preamp RCA connections were all the same in terms of sensitivity (no phono), but that is something to check on your preamp.

Lastly, I would check the compatibility between your "technically" mismatched preamp and amp. Is the amp looking for a stronger input signal than preamp is providing, and are there any adjustment switches on the back of the amp for that issue?

 

[A/V Dude]

I was just browsing the internet and came across the Wiim mini and the Wiim pro. Wondering if something like this would improve performance over iphone and old CPU 3.5 outputs?

 

[swechsler]

You can get external DACs for both devices. This would likely give you a significant improvement in sound quality. Bluetooth is another option; better than what you're using now but probably not as good as a separate DAC since there'd be digital compression involved (although Bluetooth 5 is quite good). But since you'd need to get a Bluetooth to RCA adapter anyway, better off with the DACs unless you want the convenience of being able to carry the devices around while they are connected to the system.

Here's an article about DACs for iPhones with USB C. For the Lenovo, search Amazon for a standard USB DAC (since I'm assume your laptop doesn't have USB C, although it can be easily converted).

 

[Sandman1221]

I was just browsing the internet and came across the Wiim mini and the Wiim pro. Wondering if something like this would improve performance over iphone and old CPU 3.5 outputs?

Like I said, I use an ipad using a good cable and get great sound quality, so I think you may have other issues as stated above. But if you want to try other solutions, let us know how it works out.

And your iphone should have a better DAC than any of the options you are looking at.

 

[RunOutGroove]

I think that you'd notice a difference using a DAC, rather than simply plugging in the analog connection of the phone into the amp. The Schit Modi is supposed to be vevry good and is pretty cheap. I owned the slightly more expensive Modius model and I was quite happy with it. Since you said "AV" I'm assuming that you're talking about a TV, and you could do double duty with a DAC by also running the TV audio through it as well.

Any DAC that you're considering though, I would make sure works with the iPhone becuase I'm not sure that all of them do. My current DAC, a Chord Qutest works with my Andriod phone, but unfortunately isn't compatible with my iPod, though the iPod is older tech and so is probably less likely to be supported...

 

[BmWr75]

I was just browsing the internet and came across the Wiim mini and the Wiim pro. Wondering if something like this would improve performance over iphone and old CPU 3.5 outputs?

Do you have WiFi at your house? WiiM devices work best if they can connect to WiFi and be controlled via the WiiM app on a phone. The DAC in the WiiM Mini and WiiM Pro is not that great. Many "dongle" DACs are sold for iPhones for not much money. This one tests well and sounds good too, click on Amazon link below, cost is $10.

EDIT: both the WiiM Mini and Pro have digital outputs via an optical cable and can feed an optical input on your Integra. I highly recommend WiiM products for Tidal and the other streaming services they support.

Amazon.com

 

[Sandman1221]

Do you have WiFi at your house? WiiM devices work best if they can connect to WiFi and be controlled via the WiiM app on a phone. The DAC in the WiiM Mini and WiiM Pro is not that great. Many "dongle" DACs are sold for iPhones for not much money. This one tests well and sounds good too, clock on Amazon link below, cost is $10.

Amazon.com

There is no way a $10 dongle is going to have a better DAC than an iphone imo. Also, isn't the iphone putting out an an analogue signal from the USB port? If you can connect iphone to a preamp using a regular usb-c to 3.5 mm adapter (like that made by Apple w/o a DAC), then it has to be putting out an analogue signal from the usb-c port. And that means the output cannot be processed by a downstream DAC, since it is an analogue signal.

 

[BmWr75]

There is no way a $10 dongle is going to have a better DAC than an iphone imo.

You are wrong it seems.

As far as I know my iPhone 12 doesn't even have an internal DAC, at least not one that can be used with wired headphones/earbuds.

iPhone 6 was the last model to have a headphone output. Apple sells a dongle DAC to people can use them with wired headphones/earbuds via the Lightning or USB C connection.

Edit: actually all iPhones have an internal DAC, or they wouldn't be able to play sounds via their crappy internal speaker. But like I said, iPhone 7 and later don't have an internal DAC that can be used with wired HPs or other devices via any cable lacking a built-in DAC.

 

[swechsler]

Edit: actually all iPhones have an internal DAC, or they wouldn't be able to play sounds via their crappy internal speaker. But like I said, iPhone 7 and later don't have an internal DAC that can be used with wired HPs or other devices via any cable lacking a built-in DAC.

I'm pretty sure they do. There are many cheap headphones (earbuds) with a USB C connector that an iPhone (and Samsung phones as well; not sure about others) will recognize as an analog device and play sound through them. Same thing with earlier iPhones and the Lightning connector. Presumably the OP has a cable that does the same to a 3.5mm jack.

ETA: here's one for 3 bucks. There's no way that has a DAC built in at that price, or size.
ETA2: I stand corrected. From the listing:

High-Fidelity Sound Quality: USB c to audio jack adapter with an advanced DAC chip, ensure aux to usb c adapter achieves high audio output capacity, improves the signal-to-noise ratio, decreases frequency range rata, and maintains original sound quality

 

[swechsler]

I'm not going to edit my last post again, but this article says the iPhone has a good DAC built in. Which means that the listing for that cheap cable was lying. What a shock.

There's actually too much conflicting info online to decide whether or not that's correct.

 

[BmWr75]

This comes directly from the Apple Support web site (see picture below). Here is the link I copy/pasted from:

About lossless audio in Apple Music - Apple Support

Learn about lossless audio in Apple Music and how to turn it on or off for your device.

support.apple.com

 

[swechsler]

OK, I'd say that's definitive.

 

[BmWr75]

I'm not going to edit my last post again, but this article says the iPhone has a good DAC built in. Which means that the listing for that cheap cable was lying. What a shock.

There's actually too much conflicting info online to decide whether or not that's correct.

That article says an iPhone can play FLAC files. That is definitely news to me and am 99.9% sure is incorrect.

As hard as it is to believe, the USB C and Lighting to 3.5 mm adapters do have a built in DAC.......all for $9-10.

 

[Sandman1221]

This comes directly from the Apple Support web site (see picture below). Here is the link I copy/pasted from:

About lossless audio in Apple Music - Apple Support

Learn about lossless audio in Apple Music and how to turn it on or off for your device.

support.apple.com

View attachment 3489906

From the same Apple Music page, it says you can listen to lossless audio WITHOUT an eternal DAC as long as the sample rate is 48 kHz or less.

How to listen to lossless on your iPhone or iPad​

What you need​

You can listen to lossless on an iPhone or iPad updated to the latest version of iOS or iPadOS using:

• A wired connection to headphones, receivers, or powered speakers
• The built-in speakers
• An external digital-to-analog converter to listen to songs at sample rates higher than 48 kHz

 

[BmWr75]

From the same Apple Music page, it says you can listen to lossless audio WITHOUT an eternal DAC as long as the sample rate is 48 kHz or less.

How to listen to lossless on your iPhone or iPad​

What you need​

You can listen to lossless on an iPhone or iPad updated to the latest version of iOS or iPadOS using:

• A wired connection to headphones, receivers, or powered speakers
• The built-in speakers
• An external digital-to-analog converter to listen to songs at sample rates higher than 48 kHz

iPhones later that model 6 don't have a way to connect a pair of wired headphones or any other device needing a wired connection. The user has to use a Lighting or USB C dongle to get a wired connection. The OP specifically mentioned an iPhone.

You replied with an answer about how you listen via an iPad. The ninth generation iPad was the last with a headphone jack, which was discontinued May 2024.

 

[Sandman1221]

iPhones later that model 6 don't have a way to connect a pair of wired headphones or any other device needing a wired connection. The user has to use a Lighting or USB C dongle to get a wired connection. The OP specifically mentioned an iPhone.

You replied with an answer about how you listen via an iPad. The ninth generation iPad was the last with a headphone jack, which was discontinued May 2024.

What?, you can use the Apple USB-C to 3.5 mm adapter to connect to headphones with a 3.5 mm cable, or an amplifier using a 3.5 mm to dual RCA cable. And that adapter does not have a DAC, it is just an adapter according to the Apple website!

But if you want music at greater than 48 kHz, then you need an external DAC so you can listen to music with higher resolution that you cannot hear difference compared to 48 kHz, because it is above the limits for "most" of us, except for those who believe they have super human hearing!

 

[BmWr75]

Peace and out.

Review: Apple vs Google USB-C Headphone Adapters

This is a review, detailed measurements and comparison of Apple's USB-C adapter to the current and last version of Google Pixel headphone adapters. The Apple adapter costs just $9 including one day shipping for free. The Google dongle costs $12. Not that any of these are large by any stretch...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[BmWr75]

X-rays reveal IC chip in Apple dongle.

Inside Apple’s New Audio Adapter

The decision to axe the iPhone’s built-in headphone port and simply put an adapter in the box has provoked reactions ranging from amusement to near panic. Why did they do it? Was it worth it?

www.ifixit.com

 

[Sandman1221]

X-rays reveal IC chip in Apple dongle.

Inside Apple’s New Audio Adapter

The decision to axe the iPhone’s built-in headphone port and simply put an adapter in the box has provoked reactions ranging from amusement to near panic. Why did they do it? Was it worth it?

www.ifixit.com

Show me a screen shot from the Apple website showing the specifications for the Apple USB-C to 3.5 mm adapter that says it has a DAC, you cannot, I already looked on the Apple website!

You and others resort to internet BS from non-Apple sources to support your mythical claims.