Crown power amp for studio and hifi use

[kconnor]

Currently I'm using two D-75 amps one per channel in the mono mode. I paid about $235 for both. Gives me 110wpc and the sound is as clean as anything I've ever owned.

 

[kevzep]

Current Crown equipment meets the current quality standards of the industry for Public Address equipment. Problem is that the current specs of the industry suck. In the old days, Crown used to exceed the quality standards and specs of the industry.

On the first page of this thread I provided a reference to the Vintage and current Crown equipment specs. The vintage high end Crown stuff has vastly superior specs to the new stuff in every way except power level and ability to play to very low impedience loads.

For example, the current stuff has an S/N of 100 dB at rated power (103 dB on the "good stuff") whereas in the old days, this was >112 dB at rated power for a PS-400 and >115 dB at rated power for a PSA-2. That's 13 times quieter for a PS-400 and 32 times quieter for a PSA-2. (Hiss bugs the he11 out of me and there is none to be heard in a PSA-2.)

Some of the old specs aren't even provided anymore (e.g., slew rate) leading me to believe that they may not be so good anymore either.

You can still buy gear to meet these standards, we do with our company.....Crown still make it too.........you guys are talking the lower end of Crown, if you want a Macrotech, they still make them.....I-tech and the likes meet these standards......
The lower cheaper end of Crown and others do not meet these standards, and it reflected in the price you pay......

 

[iloveamps]

Sounds like you're already set on Crown, but you might take a look at BGW amplifiers. Talk about sleepers. Powerful with amazing sound quality. Not much to look at, but that's not what matters. They're not all that expensive either, but it depends on the model.

 

[kevzep]

Sounds like you're already set on Crown, but you might take a look at BGW amplifiers. Talk about sleepers. Powerful with amazing sound quality. Not much to look at, but that's not what matters. They're not all that expensive either, but it depends on the model.

Yeah 750B would see you right, although the fan might be a bit noisy.......
But you could put a modern low speed job in there........

 

[Bigears]

Yeah 750B would see you right, although the fan might be a bit noisy.......
But you could put a modern low speed job in there........

As for BGW's and fans...it is completely acceptable to run them without the fan PROVIDED that you don't have them in a closed rack and they are not on 24/7, which is exactly what they were designed for. I ran a 750D as a sub amp for my B-380 for several years in my home system...sans fan. I pulled the top cover to let out the trapped heat from the T-03's but that wasn't necessary so I put it back on.

 

[BMWCCA]

You can still buy gear to meet these standards, we do with our company.....Crown still make it too.........you guys are talking the lower end of Crown, if you want a Macrotech, they still make them.....I-tech and the likes meet these standards......
The lower cheaper end of Crown and others do not meet these standards, and it reflected in the price you pay......

Very true. The Big Macs are the heart of the S/R system I get to work with on occasion. They are real beasts . . . both in weight and power. Still made in USA, too. Not your common DJ amp sold at a compelling retail price-point.

 

[Fred Sanford]

Very true. The Big Macs are the heart of the S/R system I get to work with on occasion. They are real beasts . . . both in weight and power. Still made in USA, too. Not your common DJ amp sold at a compelling retail price-point.

:yes:

Firing these up (+ PS200 & others) on Tuesday...

je

 

[kevzep]

:yes:

Firing these up (+ PS200 & others) on Tuesday...

je

Real amps I see......:thmbsp:

 

[beemer]

A great Crown option for studio use would be a Crown K1. No fan, very musical.

On my Studio/DJ desk I have powered Genelec 1032A's. If I were to go to passive monitors, the K1 would be my first choice.

Best,

Paul

BTW Fred Sanford....nice rack......I have Macro-Tech 5002, 5000, pair of 2402's plus I-Tech 4000 & I-Tech 8000 and a pair of K2's. Crowns make it happen for me.

 

[Fred Sanford]

Real amps I see......:thmbsp:

Yep, heavy little beasties, too. These will power 2 (or maybe 4) 18" subs, two SRX 712s and two MR938s.

In your experience, do you think they'll be OK in these cases in this config? I don't remember how much they vent out the sides, so I tried to leave a good bit of room above & below instead of cramming all 3 into the 6RU rack. I have two other 3 or 4 RU passively-cooled amps (for wedge monitors) going in a 12RU rack so they get plenty of room to cool off.

je

 

[toddalin]

A great Crown option for studio use would be a Crown K1. No fan, very musical.

On my Studio/DJ desk I have powered Genelec 1032A's. If I were to go to passive monitors, the K1 would be my first choice.

Best,

Paul

BTW Fred Sanford....nice rack......I have Macro-Tech 5002, 5000, pair of 2402's plus I-Tech 4000 & I-Tech 8000 and a pair of K2's. Crowns make it happen for me.

Yes, these are VERY NICE, very powerful, and maintain the TOTL vintage specs. But they are probably well beyond the stated price range unless he gets REAL LUCKY. Same goes for the other current TOTL Crown gear. The price range only allows for PA quality if purchased new.

 

[JoeESP9]

You sound like a fast-food ad: Parts is parts.

Nearly every modern electronic failure I've experienced in the last two years is linked to unreliable failed caps in Chinese-made products less than two-years old. That includes clock radios to HD-TVs to H-K audio equipment.

On the contrary, I do not believe "Parts is parts". The Hafler amps I recently put in the closet were rebuilt (by me) with fully regulated power supplies (that I designed), Vishay resistors, Wonder Caps and WBT connectors and many other premium parts. My modified Dyna MKIII's have even more radical mods. The only parts left from the originals are the transformers. I also use Silver plated copper IC's and speaker cables.

I don't have an irrational bias for "vintage" electronics at the expense of new alternatives. I want the best performance and yes, aesthetics for my money.
When and where a given piece of gear was manufactured is IMO unimportant.

You have my sympathies about all your premature equipment failures. My own and my friends experiences have been quite different.

 

[beemer]

Yep, heavy little beasties, too. These will power 2 (or maybe 4) 18" subs, two SRX 712s and two MR938s.

In your experience, do you think they'll be OK in these cases in this config? I don't remember how much they vent out the sides, so I tried to leave a good bit of room above & below instead of cramming all 3 into the 6RU rack. I have two other 3 or 4 RU passively-cooled amps (for wedge monitors) going in a 12RU rack so they get plenty of room to cool off.

je

I-Tech rack with 20AMP power strip...You see ground fault light, my workshop needs some rewiring!:

IMHO:

You won't have any trouble with the Macro-Techs. They draw air from the front. I rack all of mine in individual SKB cases. 2 space for the 2402's, 3 space for the 500/5002 for easier carrying. as you know, these are not light. I use the ATA cases, not the cheap roto-rack SKB. Never had a problem even in real warm weather. The pair of K2's I rack in a 6 space allowing room as these have no fans. The I-Tech rack together, as they are super light and very efficient.

The older Macro's like power. That's the biggest issue I have. Most clubs/halls in my area leave me wanting, so I built a portable distro and make sure in my contract they have an electrician to set a breaker in their panel for my distro.

Best,

Paul

 

[ToneAlive]

You can still buy gear to meet these standards, we do with our company.....Crown still make it too.........you guys are talking the lower end of Crown, if you want a Macrotech, they still make them.....I-tech and the likes meet these standards......
The lower cheaper end of Crown and others do not meet these standards, and it reflected in the price you pay......

K2, K1, macrotech, I-tech, psa-2... totl, and between what-$700 and thousands? So I just bought a PS-400 for $190 that has the same specs as some of the totl modern and recent crown amps. This is for an indoor hifi setup, so I don't need 1000 watts. Will it sound as good as the modern totl?? I don't know, hopefully most of the way there. Hopefully it will sound better than the modern botl that is in my price range!! - That is the risk I am taking. I feel like my soon-to-arrive PS-400 will be a great representative of high quality solid state amps and will be a great compliment to my Dynaco ST-70 when I want to hear SS instead of tube. With a budget of $300, and ending up spending $110 less than that, I feel like I have one of the best possible outcomes for a SS amp under $300. I got bit by the hi-fi bug about a month ago and since then, have acquired 4 different amps and integrateds and a pair of BA-A150's, so I won't be able to give my own comparisons to a lot of other gear. But thanks to everyone for helping me make a well informed decision!

 

[Fred Sanford]

I-Tech rack with 20AMP power strip...You see ground fault light, my workshop needs some rewiring!:

IMHO:

You won't have any trouble with the Macro-Techs. They draw air from the front. I rack all of mine in individual SKB cases. 2 space for the 2402's, 3 space for the 500/5002 for easier carrying. as you know, these are not light. I use the ATA cases, not the cheap roto-rack SKB. Never had a problem even in real warm weather. The pair of K2's I rack in a 6 space allowing room as these have no fans. The I-Tech rack together, as they are super light and very efficient.

The older Macro's like power. That's the biggest issue I have. Most clubs/halls in my area leave me wanting, so I built a portable distro and make sure in my contract they have an electrician to set a breaker in their panel for my distro.

Best,

Paul

Thanks for the info. Of course, the other consideration is whether the handles on my 6RU case could even lift all three at once! This looks like a good compromise for this particular rig. Venting should not be an issue, and where this will be located backstage I can even put a large fan to either feed them fresh air or vent any accumulated warm air.

I did check of the venue & ID all available circuits in anticipation of loading up these breakers. I should have three 20 amp circuits broken up as some combinations of FOH/house amps/monitor amps. Band & lighting are on their own three circuits.

je

 

[Fred Sanford]

K2, K1, macrotech, I-tech, psa-2... totl, and between what-$700 and thousands? So I just bought a PS-400 for $190 that has the same specs as some of the totl modern and recent crown amps. This is for an indoor hifi setup, so I don't need 1000 watts. Will it sound as good as the modern totl?? I don't know, hopefully most of the way there. Hopefully it will sound better than the modern botl that is in my price range!! - That is the risk I am taking. I feel like my soon-to-arrive PS-400 will be a great representative of high quality solid state amps and will be a great compliment to my Dynaco ST-70 when I want to hear SS instead of tube. With a budget of $300, and ending up spending $110 less than that, I feel like I have one of the best possible outcomes for a SS amp under $300. I got bit by the hi-fi bug about a month ago and since then, have acquired 4 different amps and integrateds and a pair of BA-A150's, so I won't be able to give my own comparisons to a lot of other gear. But thanks to everyone for helping me make a well informed decision!

Sounds like you'll be fine to me. If the PS400 isn't dogged or defective, you'll either like it or be able to re-sell it.

je

 

[kevzep]

I-Tech rack with 20AMP power strip...You see ground fault light, my workshop needs some rewiring!:

IMHO:

You won't have any trouble with the Macro-Techs. They draw air from the front. I rack all of mine in individual SKB cases. 2 space for the 2402's, 3 space for the 500/5002 for easier carrying. as you know, these are not light. I use the ATA cases, not the cheap roto-rack SKB. Never had a problem even in real warm weather. The pair of K2's I rack in a 6 space allowing room as these have no fans. The I-Tech rack together, as they are super light and very efficient.

The older Macro's like power. That's the biggest issue I have. Most clubs/halls in my area leave me wanting, so I built a portable distro and make sure in my contract they have an electrician to set a breaker in their panel for my distro.

Best,

Paul

AH HA!! More real amplifiers........:thmbsp:

Yes the Macrotechs like power alright..the are one of if not the most musical sounding amplifier out there.....Im a big fan of the 5000/5002VZ......

 

[whoaru99]

Current Crown equipment meets the current quality standards of the industry for Public Address equipment. Problem is that the current specs of the industry suck. In the old days, Crown used to exceed the quality standards and specs of the industry.

On the first page of this thread I provided a reference to the Vintage and current Crown equipment specs. The vintage high end Crown stuff has vastly superior specs to the new stuff in every way except power level and ability to play to very low impedience loads.

For example, the current stuff has an S/N of 100 dB at rated power (103 dB on the "good stuff") whereas in the old days, this was >112 dB at rated power for a PS-400 and >115 dB at rated power for a PSA-2. That's 13 times quieter for a PS-400 and 32 times quieter for a PSA-2. (Hiss bugs the he11 out of me and there is none to be heard in a PSA-2.)

Some of the old specs aren't even provided anymore (e.g., slew rate) leading me to believe that they may not be so good anymore either.

My point was component quality/reliability specs, not performance specs.

As for the rest I'd have to speculate Crown is providing what the industry wants and what puts food on the table. If not, their market research folks and product management should be canned.

 

[whoaru99]

You can still buy gear to meet these standards, we do with our company.....Crown still make it too.........you guys are talking the lower end of Crown, if you want a Macrotech, they still make them.....I-tech and the likes meet these standards......
The lower cheaper end of Crown and others do not meet these standards, and it reflected in the price you pay......

Afaik, the big iron Macros everyone is swooning over are in the discontinued products list.

Pretty much everybody's high end, and even lower to middle line stuff is switching power these days....either output, power supply, or both.