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Do I really not need more than 1 watt?!?

MKG

MKG

Elvish-mark’d abortive, rooting hog
For shits and giggles and because I like soldering things, I built a velleman k8098 audio analyzer kit.
I hooked it up to my system and got really confused.

According to it I’m averaging 166 to 200mw peak.

According to an iPhone decibel meter, when I’m “blasting it” (as loud as I can stand comfortably at my workbench in my shop) I’m averaging 82.9db.

My shop system is active bi-amped NLA econowaves-
Bridged Hafler dh-200’s (300w/channel for woofers),
and a stereo 25w/channel organ pull tube amp pushing the horns.

If any of these readings are even remotely accurate, my entire system is serious overkill and I might as well rebuild a flea watt Maggie and sell off the rest of my gear.

My workbench is about 1 meter from the speakers.

Do I need to completely rethink my mindset of more watts is better?
 

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I've been using an F5 for years now and I've never used all of what it can do, and I'm not using especially sensitive speakers. I can't imagine putting 10 watts through a pair of horns in even the largest residential room. When I look at amp specs I pay close attention to the first 1 and 2 watts because that's the majority of what you're listening to. I'm a hardcore believer in quality of power over quantity of power.
 
The meters on my amp never indicate more than 2 watts, even when I have my most inefficient speakers hooked up.
 
GChief said:
Does not require a mindset change. But you did learn something a lot of us already know :D

My 6ishwpc Maggie amp easily does over 95db at my listening position. Efficient speakers are suggested :)
Click to expand...

Maybe repeating myself and others is the theme for the day...

It's about good clean power, not really how much you've got in reserves. There are plenty of low power amps that sound like poo, and deliver a watt of crap. There's also plenty of high power amps that by virtue of the high power, do low watts pretty nicely. But unless it's a tube, low power often means crappy power too. I've 120 or 250 wpc depending on my mood, but using more than 5w into the dq-10s will hurt like a mofo.

So no, more isn't always more. It's just harder to find less, that adds up to more.
 
crouse said:
The meters on my amp never indicate more than 2 watts, even when I have my most inefficient speakers hooked up.
Click to expand...
The meters on most amps have a trimmer for calibration, are your meters correctly calibrated. OK, it's a trivial
point, being don't believe everything you see/read/... But the point of the thread is taken, you don't need a megawatt
amp. Some speakers have 130dB efficiency, altecs around 100db, a few watts is plenty...
 
It sounds like you may only need a few watts to keep everything happy.
My listening room is 15x30ish, the speakers are about three meters away and are not very efficient so I'm gonna have to stick with my higher wattage stuff. I measured in the low-mid 90s* with my db meter when I was having a lively (boozy) session but I usually listen at a lower level.

*I have noticed those db meter apps for phones can be a bit all over the place. I had three on my phone at the same time and they were all spread out at least 5db from each other with the same amount of racket coming from the hi-fi. I should get a proper meter one of these days.
 
loudnoises said:
Maybe repeating myself and others is the theme for the day...

It's about good clean power, not really how much you've got in reserves. There are plenty of low power amps that sound like poo, and deliver a watt of crap. There's also plenty of high power amps that by virtue of the high power, do low watts pretty nicely. But unless it's a tube, low power often means crappy power too. I've 120 or 250 wpc depending on my mood, but using more than 5w into the dq-10s will hurt like a mofo.

So no, more isn't always more. It's just harder to find less, that adds up to more.
Click to expand...

Actually, class AB amps, which tend to be the high power amps, tend to deliver a worse 1 watt / low watt performance. Google "Stereophile class AB measurements" and take a look. Many, if not most, will have their worse distortion inside the first watt, and it's not a lot of pretty second and third order stuff either. In a lot of those measurements the first quarter watt has the highest distortion the amp makes. You don't see that in low power class A or high bias amps. They make their lowest levels of clean, simple distortion at 1 watt.
 
GChief said:
The one in the Audio TechnIca App on my iPhone reads exactly what my calibrated meter reads.
Click to expand...
That's one of the apps I use but it always read lower than the others. I'll have to hang onto it and ditch the others since they seem to be inaccurate. Thanks!
 
My systems have been updated since I posted the following last fall in another thread, but my opinions haven’t changed:

My first comments on power requirements ...

My second set of comments on power requirements ...

This Blu-ray of a modern performance of Mahler Symphony 2 places a significantly greater demand on a hi-fi system …

81H3aldwvHL._SX385_.jpg



… compared with this CD of Eva Cassidy:

511eUFzlUiL._SX425_.jpg



FYI, this is an emotive topic. The thread that I referenced above was closed by a moderator ... hopefully not because of something I wrote … :)
 
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It all depends on what you consider loud. I listen at low levels most of the time. Right now my office system is cranking out at 60 dB at one meter. That is a fine level as I work. My normal background sound level for a quiet room is about 42 dB.

But I have been known to turn the volume to up to 100 dB for certain songs. Listening at that sound level requires power, about 10,000 times as much power (40 dB). My 120 watt amp is more than adequate to drive my speakers at that level, with lots of headroom available.

PS: I switch between KLH Model Six (low sensitivity ~ 88 dB) and Klipsch KG-4 (high sensitivity - 95 dB) speakers in my office.
 
One watt gets pretty loud in my apartment. Generally I don't push past one watt. Usually power consumption is much lower than that.
 
the answer is most definitely not a Bose system.
However, I may need to work on my bias.
My car system can be heard from blocks away, and car audio is where I started- maybe that’s why I equate quantity with quality.

...but, when I honestly analyze all of my gear, my favorite system is a pair of ads L810’s powered by a 60w/channel amp. That should probably tell me that there’s more to it than watts per channel. :oops:
 
ReactiveLoad said:
I've been using an F5 for years now and I've never used all of what it can do, and I'm not using especially sensitive speakers. I can't imagine putting 10 watts through a pair of horns in even the largest residential room. When I look at amp specs I pay close attention to the first 1 and 2 watts because that's the majority of what you're listening to. I'm a hardcore believer in quality of power over quantity of power.
Click to expand...
I’ve been looking for my next project- would you suggest an F5 (or F6)?
 
robert_kc said:
This Blu-ray of a modern performance of Mahler Symphony 2 places a significantly greater demand on a hi-fi system …
Click to expand...
A little off post but...

How does the modern performance of Mahler Symphony #2 compare with earlier
"versions". I was given a rough CD with a Rafael Kubelik/Bavarian radio symphony
and was blown away, these guys have serious anger management issues (in a nice way).
I'm not into classical but I've since been trying to find a higher quality
recording. Listened to a London Symphony "version", neutered! complete waste
of time...
 
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