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ESS AMT 1 Towers- Tales of the Restoration

Monad

Monad

AK Subscriber
Subscriber
So I was perusing.. saw something I couldn't unsee.

Not to far away (it never really is) there were these fully restored ESS AMT 1 Towers.. the only thing original was the TL line.. all new speakers, crossovers and Great HEIL.

Q-

with the new ESS 10" driver that wasn't made specifically for the original tower, will it suck?

Will the new driver, HEIL and crossover work well together?

A- IDK what they sounded like before.. I have some partially restored AMT3 here now, so I can guess.

IDK but man, are these things nice. I'm still sorting placement, wall treatments behind as that hasn't been a consideration recently but.. but couldn't be more pleased. ;D. They are different enough to the AMT3 to keep both.. size is great when not in use.

<3

Here's some pics from the seller 1789574252312.png

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On the back you can see where he redid the 5way and a clever solution for the often loud, crunchy, sound robbing +/-db options on the orig unit.

1789574406486.png
 
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the current crossover was redone end to end.. he used some respectable Jantzen(edited) Cross-Caps.. but I have a sickness and near-term plans to swap those out for something really special. . . give that HEIL and TL something to tough love.
 
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If you've never heard the HEIL, imo make some plans to. It may be my favorite top/ mid section I've heard. the old units can be had for hundreds to thousands for restored. the new issue units that look amazing.. $1800+

i absolutely scored on these with the price.. the cost of unrestored, with literally hours of love, years of skill, knowledge and craftsmanship dumped into them.
 
Monad said:
the current crossover was redone end to end.. he used some respectable Jupiter Cross-Caps.. but I have a sickness and near-term plans to swap those out for something really special. . . give that HEIL and TL something to tough love.
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You probably mean Jantzen cross-caps, which are fine, especially compared to stock electrolytic caps that used to be in there. AMT1 Towers are crossed at 800Hz/12dB slope, which is probably a good compromise for the 10" and AMT unless playing very loud. If it were me, instead of spending $$ on more exotic capacitors, etc, I would buy another pair of great Heils when on 50% sale (they are on sale now for $250/pair!) and double-stack the Heils, then go with active crossover/biamp. I am using triple-stacked Heils..
 
Jon L said:
and double-stack the Heils, then go with active crossover/biamp. I am using triple-stacked Heils..
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What are the advantages of double/triple stacking?

We certainly don't need the volume and it seems that this could result in some vertical lobing.

I just turned down a brand new set for $100 plus $40 shipping because I didn't see the need nor need the clutter.
 
toddalin said:
What are the advantages of double/triple stacking?

We certainly don't need the volume and it seems that this could result in some vertical lobing.

I just turned down a brand new set for $100 plus $40 shipping because I didn't see the need nor need the clutter.
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When I double-stacked, I heard a significant jump in clarity, effortlessness, and even subjective detail resolution. Other positives were increase in vertical sweet spot and ability to cross the AMT lower. Adding the triple stack did not yield anywhere near the improvements, so double seems like the sweet spot IME.
 
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Jon L said:
When I double-stacked, I heard a significant jump in clarity, effortlessness, and even subjective detail resolution. Other positives were increase in vertical sweet spot and ability to cross the AMT lower. Adding the triple stack did not yield anywhere near the improvements, so double seems like the sweet spot IME.
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Is there any way that you can demonstrate this?

Thanks
 
Jon L said:
You probably mean Jantzen cross-caps, which are fine, especially compared to stock electrolytic caps that used to be in there. AMT1 Towers are crossed at 800Hz/12dB slope, which is probably a good compromise for the 10" and AMT unless playing very loud. If it were me, instead of spending $$ on more exotic capacitors, etc, I would buy another pair of great Heils when on 50% sale (they are on sale now for $250/pair!) and double-stack the Heils, then go with active crossover/biamp. I am using triple-stacked Heils..
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stop reading my mind.. ;D

i was literally just reading that thread on adding wings and double stacking the HEIL.. Already planning to pick up another pair of HEIL for a future bass bin project.. thank you for reminding me before they all slip into the mark up secondary.

please tell me more about how you wired it all up.. any change in caps, coils?

pics?

I'm looking at another pair right now, non-ESS config, with HEILs that have a single, but room for a double, with built in bi amping and needs DSP or sub to tie it all down.
 
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Monad said:
stop reading my mind.. ;D

i was literally just reading a thread on adding wings and double stacking the HEIL.. Already planning to pick up another pair of HEIL for a future bass bin project.. thank you for reminding me before they all slip into the mark up secondary.

please tell me more about how you wired it all up.. any change in caps, coils?

pics?

I'm looking at another pair right now, non-ESS config, with HEILs that have a single, but room for a double, with built in bi amping and needs DSP or sub to tie it all down.
Click to expand...
I have various dsp and analogue active crossovers at my disposal, so I just play with things. In fact, this thread has me itching to buy another pair of Heil AMT's on 50% sale for the Quad-stack, allowing me to series-parallel it to 4 Ohms.. Or two of the double-stacks for two different systems. Alright, just ordered the fourth pair of Heils' :rockon:
 
Ugh, $85 for shipping on the $250 HEIL pair. Worth it at some future point for sure.. almost bought 2 pr.
 
Jon L said:
I have various dsp and analogue active crossovers at my disposal, so I just play with things. In fact, this thread has me itching to buy another pair of Heil AMT's on 50% sale for the Quad-stack, allowing me to series-parallel it to 4 Ohms.. Or two of the double-stacks for two different systems. Alright, just ordered the fourth pair of Heils' :rockon:
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I have limited familiarity w DSP. Only have 1 option, Driverack PA2. I'll need to use it on the other HEIL speakers I'm considering. Similar to these, the asking $ is less than the sum of the bass drivers and HEIL.. not to mention the build materials and XOVER.

I was able to hear them with, without DSP. .. but the boost seller was using was a Shiit Lokius, which imo is actual Schiit. Sounded like a heavy, constipated, wool tank top, covering up a nice top/ mid.

..but outside of the tank top.. it was big, airy and magical in an less than ideal listening space.

My goal with either the double HEIL towers or other speakers would be to go passive as I'm mistrustul of non-passive.. seems like I put a lot of $ into my clean audio line, only to mash it through a device that costs less than the XLRs I'm using to connect them. ;D (probably a secret Luddite, suggesting we smash the DSP presses)..
 
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Your location must be far. I just got charged $33 for shipping, but I live in the same state. Coincidentally, I also have a Driverack PA2 around and strongly advise against its use. Compared to a couple of analogue active crossovers using discrete components, PA2 sounds so veiled and colored to my ears. It does have a nice functionality of room measurement and correction, but I end up generating room correction filters with PA2 but apply the filter settings elsewhere (e.g. audio PC).
 
Jon L said:
One can search the web for various DIY'ers do have done this. Here's one thread with measurements:

I should add that line-array beaming issue cannot be avoided, but the number one thing I do is to make sure my ears are in the middle of the array..
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Thanks. I'll check it out.

Beaming/middle is not a problem for me, and Heils perform better when "head on", because I have them on stands with their centers at my ear level. It was just a matter of putting longer feet on the backs. I used to make/market these until the cost of acrylic went through the roof.

I 3D printed the "wave guides" with the upper and lower sections following something I saw on Mythbusters. Hobbyists do that sort of thing, as opposed to manufacturers and..., because if there is possible improvement to be had, there is more to the hobby than just the music.

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Monad said:
i was literally just reading that thread on adding wings and double stacking the HEIL.. Already planning to pick up another pair of HEIL for a future bass bin project.. thank you for reminding me before they all slip into the mark up secondary.
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I have the original wings but have never used them. If you want them, they are yours for the cost of shipping (From 92705), but they are quite large.

These are the originals made for single Heils. The gent who made them was a member of the JBL Forum and lived close by. When he moved, he didn't want to have to move them and gave them to me. There is an article(s) on the 'net on how he constructed them.

Don't recall his name off-hand.
 
toddalin said:
What are the advantages of double/triple stacking?

We certainly don't need the volume and it seems that this could result in some vertical lobing.

I just turned down a brand new set for $100 plus $40 shipping because I didn't see the need nor need the clutter.
Click to expand...
where are those $100 gems?
 
Jon L said:
Your location must be far. I just got charged $33 for shipping, but I live in the same state. Coincidentally, I also have a Driverack PA2 around and strongly advise against its use. Compared to a couple of analogue active crossovers using discrete components, PA2 sounds so veiled and colored to my ears. It does have a nice functionality of room measurement and correction, but I end up generating room correction filters with PA2 but apply the filter settings elsewhere (e.g. audio PC).
Click to expand...
yep, i actually hate how it sounds.. i have some UREI 813, thought the crossover was off.. wired up the drive rack and .. just awful. so much worse. the DIRAC MIC didn't help..

it's possible my expectations were too high, my ears are made of gold, or even following the directions, using the ipad app, there was still some user error in there.

but yep, crap.
 
Monad said:
where are those $100 gems?
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Long gone. Was just to me. When I turned them down, they were gone that day. JBL Forum member. At one time when the sale was on, a bunch bought in and he never used his and offered them to me recently.
 
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