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Felt Diskwasher not cutting it… Looking for RCM advice

Froggy5326

Froggy5326

Active Member
Hey all. Got into vinyl in the last few years after inheriting my father’s Oracle Delphi, which is now playing very nicely with my system.

I inherited his vinyl, which while it has some great stuff and is in primo condition, also isn’t primarily what I listen to in general, so I have been buying used records in my genres from eBay.

The cleaning standards of my father, and what he instilled in us kids clearly haven’t been a universal thing throughout all vinyl owners.

I’ve been laboring through cleaning at least half of the purchased vinyl with a paint pad and the Triton based cleaning solutions recommended elsewhere on this forum. Half of the purchases are in good enough shape to take a quick wipe and dry and be good to go.

I’ve used ultrasonic cleaners on tons of machine parts and carburetors etc… and think pretty highly of the results. There are some extremely inexpensive (Sub $200) ultrasonic record cleaners on the market, and in general the principle seems perfect.

Then, after a spot of research I stumbled upon the Degritter, which seemed absolutely perfect and when I went to buy one got significant sticker shock… as there was an extra zero compared to what I was expecting to pay.

Kind of landed on an Okki Nokki as a reasonable RCM that is vacuum based and such, but can’t pry myself off the idea of how much I like ultrasonic cleaners, and how well they “should” work in this environment with no detergent needed, no contact and no residue. I also like the idea that both sides are done at once, you can dry it off and be ready to roll.

What am I missing? Why aren’t these the “final answer” to the RCM problem, especially given the seriously low price?

Thanks in advance.
 
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Froggy5326 said:
What am I missing? Why aren’t these the “final answer” to the RCM problem, especially given the seriously low price?
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Washing a record involves 3 steps: wash, including a surfactant plus agitation to suspend dirt; rinse, which flushes the surfactant plus dirt off the record; and dry, which removes the clean rinse water. A UCM can do the first two steps reasonably well but requires 2 tanks to do both efficiently, and it can't do the last step at all unless equipped with a dryer which ups the cost considerably.

A typical vacuum RCM is better equipped to do all 3 steps but requires more input from the user and is generally costlier than the simple UCM tank.

There's no ideal 1 step cleaning system IME, but a PVA peel comes closest if one is patient.
 
ripblade said:
Washing a record involves 3 steps: wash, including a surfactant plus agitation to suspend dirt; rinse, which flushes the surfactant plus dirt off the record; and dry, which removes the clean rinse water. A UCM can do the first two steps reasonably well but requires 2 tanks to do both efficiently, and it can't do the last step at all unless equipped with a dryer which ups the cost considerably.

A typical vacuum RCM is better equipped to do all 3 steps but requires more input from the user and is generally costlier than the simple UCM tank.

There's no ideal 1 step cleaning system IME, but a PVA peel comes closest if one is patient.
Click to expand...

Does the Okki Dokki seem to check all the boxes as a stand alone RCM?

what I’m considering is using the OD, then getting one of these $170 US cleaners to use as a distilled water ultrasonic rinser….

Or, alternatively to reverse that. Hit it with the US and then the Okki Dokki…

Thoughts?
 
illini said:
I ignored the US cleaner debate and focused on what actually worked for me; Nitty Gritty Record Master RCM and the KAB EV-1.

https://www.nittygrittyinc.com/product/record-master-1

https://www.kabusa.com/frameset.htm?/ev1.htm
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What he said.

I've used an EV-1 for 10 years now. I always intended to buy something 'better', but it gets my records clean and has rescued many 2nd hand finds as well as cleaning my not so dirty own stuff.

I haven't seen a reason to upgrade. Try the Okki Nokki first, if you feel it's not working as well as you hoped, buy a US machine.

I'd always vacuum last if using the latter.
 
Froggy5326 said:
Does the Okki Dokki seem to check all the boxes as a stand alone RCM?

what I’m considering is using the OD, then getting one of these $170 US cleaners to use as a distilled water ultrasonic rinser….

Or, alternatively to reverse that. Hit it with the US and then the Okki Dokki…

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Try it both ways to see what works for you. I do the tank first but most do it the other way around.

Get the Pro-ject RCM, not the Okki Nokki. Platter is a liability not an asset .
 
ripblade said:
Try it both ways to see what works for you. I do the tank first but most do it the other way around.

Get the Pro-ject RCM, not the Okki Nokki. Platter is a liability not an asset .
Click to expand...

Too late…. I just found an Okki Nokki with a cover and accessories for $300 and jumped on it. I like the way it looks a little better than the NG, and it will be in my listening room so that matters. The Pro-Ject wasn’t on my radar until just now.
 
ripblade said:
Washing a record involves 3 steps: wash, including a surfactant plus agitation to suspend dirt; rinse, which flushes the surfactant plus dirt off the record; and dry, which removes the clean rinse water. A UCM can do the first two steps reasonably well but requires 2 tanks to do both efficiently, and it can't do the last step at all unless equipped with a dryer which ups the cost considerably.

A typical vacuum RCM is better equipped to do all 3 steps but requires more input from the user and is generally costlier than the simple UCM tank.

There's no ideal 1 step cleaning system IME, but a PVA peel comes closest if one is patient.
Click to expand...
I’m familiar with Poly Vinyl Alcohol as a mold release agent for fiberglass, but haven’t heard of a PVA peel.

Any how-to on that for seriously fouled records?

Also, I found two types of PVA’s, one being the mold release and another on Amazon that is a book binding glue.

Having used the green mold release, I’ve never put it on thick enough (usually sprayed lightly) that I could peel it without adhering a backing to it.

What type of PVA do you use?
 
Froggy5326 said:
Too late…. I just found an Okki Nokki with a cover and accessories for $300 and jumped on it. I like the way it looks a little better than the NG, and it will be in my listening room so that matters. The Pro-Ject wasn’t on my radar until just now.
Click to expand...

TBH any RCM is worth its weight. MIne has paid for itself many times over - not including less stylus wear due to clean LP's.

Have fun with it. And get some Nagaoka inner sleeves for post cleaning.
 
Looking up Nagaoka sleeves now. I have some paper ones that I bought, but will check on these.

Edit: Looks like those are outer sleeves. Is that what you meant? I have been taking all of the sleeves off (when they come with them) because I don’t like the way they look or dealing with them.

I thought you meant inner sleeves.
 
Froggy5326 said:
Looking up Nagaoka sleeves now. I have some paper ones that I bought, but will check on these.

Edit: Looks like those are outer sleeves. Is that what you meant? I have been taking all of the sleeves off (when they come with them) because I don’t like the way they look or dealing with them.

I thought you meant inner sleeves.
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Aye. Inner sleeves Nagaoka 102.

upload_2022-11-17_18-55-46.jpeg
 
I have A pre-owned VPI 17 that works very well. But for a lot less money I think you should try a Groove washer system, starting out small with just the brush and G2 cleaner and maybe the stylus cleaner brush and stylus liquid. The LP cleaning fluid is much much better than VPI's fluid. Clean the record and dry thoroughly like you would with the Discwasher brush and then let the record rest over night and try it the next day. You will be pleasantly surprised. I replaced all my paper sleeves for my records with the plastic type with the rice paper inserts. You will find using the more Advanced record sleeves will bring you MANY YEARS OF SUPERIOR LP SOUND.
 
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