• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

From Pioneer CS-99 to CS-99A .... Yes?

I'm attempting to replace the binding posts in mine. One speaker was missing posts completely and I really don't care for the original spring loaded ones anyway.

I like the basic ones that @Wardsweb used here, but evidently, you have to drill out the hole and the crossover PCB to get the base to sit flush against the black plate.
There's the threaded "bulkhead" portion that butts up against this black plate because pretty much flush with the face of the plate is a #4 nut that the small gold plated solder end threads into.
Anyone done this and can point me in the right direction? I'd hate to drill that hole and tear up a trace...but maybe there's NOT a trace there and I'm good to drill. ???

index.php
 
Both pairs would fall into the category of some of the worst sounding speakers I ever owned. I was all excited when I found the first pair 15 years ago for $10 at a yard sale....until I hooked them up. The happiest times I had with the CS-99's of any iteration was when I sold them; maybe 10 pairs over the last 15 years. Buy 'em cheap, sell 'em high, get something that sounds good. 2 pairs of Dynaco A25's stacked, which I still own, blew any iteration of these speakers away in SQ, bass, etc. But just my opinion, of course. (which is shared by many)
 
I'm attempting to replace the binding posts in mine. One speaker was missing posts completely and I really don't care for the original spring loaded ones anyway.

I like the basic ones that @Wardsweb used here, but evidently, you have to drill out the hole and the crossover PCB to get the base to sit flush against the black plate.
There's the threaded "bulkhead" portion that butts up against this black plate because pretty much flush with the face of the plate is a #4 nut that the small gold plated solder end threads into.
Anyone done this and can point me in the right direction? I'd hate to drill that hole and tear up a trace...but maybe there's NOT a trace there and I'm good to drill. ???

index.php

Yep. I just went through that on a pair of CS-77A speakers. Chose a bit size which matched my speaker posts, drilled, added more flux to the tracings then soldered a lockwasher and tacked a keeper nut to the board. Masking tape on both sides of board, drill from tracing side. You may want to add additional spacers to the corners to keep things level. you will need an additional pair of nuts as you use three for each post, one on the inside, one on the outside and the keeper nut sandwiched. My thinking was the current would travel on the post to the nut threads to the lockwasher to the board. The only other way I could think of was coming off the inner end of the board to a jumper block or junction. was worried about current eddies so that would require isolating the post from the tracing.
https://audiokarma.org/forums/index...a-input-terminals-where.856394/#post-12512046
 
Last edited:
Crazy the kind of $$ the Pioneer CS series achieves. The Realistic Nova series are excellent sounding speakers (and look alikes) for far less cash. The Nova 6's, 7b's and 8b's I highly recommend.
 
Both pairs would fall into the category of some of the worst sounding speakers I ever owned. I was all excited when I found the first pair 15 years ago for $10 at a yard sale....until I hooked them up. The happiest times I had with the CS-99's of any iteration was when I sold them; maybe 10 pairs over the last 15 years. Buy 'em cheap, sell 'em high, get something that sounds good. 2 pairs of Dynaco A25's stacked, which I still own, blew any iteration of these speakers away in SQ, bass, etc. But just my opinion, of course. (which is shared by many)

This. I had the CS77's, and they were absolutely gorgeous, but the sound was hideous. Sounded like 90% of the work was done by the mid-range (more appropriately, a squawker), the tweeter was very beamy and I thought the gorgeous lattice grilles caused interference issues. I knew they needed a recap, but I wasn't moved enough to give them a shot. I sold 'em for double the price I paid for 'em within a week, and wound up buying some HPM40's. Actually blows my mind to think that those came from the same company, and are probably less than a decade apart.

Crazy the kind of $$ the Pioneer CS series achieves. The Realistic Nova series are excellent sounding speakers (and look alikes) for far less cash. The Nova 6's, 7b's and 8b's I highly recommend.

What's weird is that I don't see any real hype around these things. If I took a shot for every KLH Model 6 thread on here or reddit in the last few months, I don't think I'd be drunk enough to convince myself that these things sound any good. And those are still fairly common and cheap, at least until we've talked them up to the stratosphere.
 
I just don't have any feelings for those groups of speakers anymore. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. If I happened to run across a set for cheap, I'd only be buying them to resell them. They were fun to tinker with but some, like the AR2ax in particular, sounded like crap even after redone and a complete pain in cleaning up those rheostats. I sure enjoyed selling those, too, all 3 pairs of them I've been through. Now, the AR11's were a completely different animal....loved those.
 
I can understand why a lot of people don't like the CS99a. Unlike the HPM 100 they don't have a spike at 80, a valley from 100 to 500, and a mountain from 1500 to 18000.
The CS99a response from 80 to 20,000 doesn't deviate more than 4 db at any time. The HPM 100 deviates 12db.
From the HPM 100 spike at 80 down to 30 the HPM is down 17 db. From the CS99a roll off at 80 down to 30 the CS99a is down 19 db.
The HPM 100 needs no smiley EQ, it's built in.
The CS99a has a very flat response. And some people don't like it. I do.
 
I can understand why a lot of people don't like the CS99a. Unlike the HPM 100 they don't have a spike at 80, a valley from 100 to 500, and a mountain from 1500 to 18000.
The CS99a response from 80 to 20,000 doesn't deviate more than 4 db at any time. The HPM 100 deviates 12db.
From the HPM 100 spike at 80 down to 30 the HPM is down 17 db. From the CS99a roll off at 80 down to 30 the CS99a is down 19 db.
The HPM 100 needs no smiley EQ, it's built in.
The CS99a has a very flat response. And some people don't like it. I do.
Actually taking a look at the HPM100's frequency chart, I'm actually kind of stunned at how bad it is on axis. 30 degrees off, it looks okay but still rather ragged, and then it just goes to hell at 60 degrees. Definitely meant to impress in the store, where the listener wouldn't be perfectly on-axis relative to all the other speakers. The smaller second-gen HPM's seem to fare much better, being roughly flat +/- 4-5dB across the board, but the 1st gens are peaky just like their big brother. The second-gen HPM40 seems to have the flattest response of the bunch, both on and off axis.


Published HPM-100 specs, from here https://www.usahifi.com/sites/default/files/product/892/manuals/Pioneer HMP-100 Speaker Brochure.pdf
Screen Shot 2019-04-03 at 10.23.26 AM.png

HPM 100's and gen 2 HPM 60's, from here http://www.tvcaudio.com/tvc/Pioneer/Ressources/Pioneer-HPM-Manual.pdf
Screen Shot 2019-04-03 at 10.38.18 AM.png

HPM 40's, gen 2

Screen Shot 2019-04-03 at 10.39.14 AM.png
 
My long winded two cents worth :

Over the past 3 years I've gone a little crazy tasting the fruit of everything Pioneer Speaker, some have been a pleasure and others not so much.

Until recently I had 3 pairs of CS-99A, currently 2 pair. Somebody made an offer that I couldn't refuse and I sold a pair, likely gonna let go of another, but keeping a like new pair for grins.
My thoughts on the 99A are that it's by no means a horrible speaker as some claim, it's can be a wonderful speaker, but it must be paired with the right amp, and musical genre.

Listening to Thrash, Heavy Metal, Techno or Rap ? Yeah this is not the speaker for you,
Putting music of it's production era through them, be it pop, country, light rock, motown, easy listening, big band , new wave or alternative music, anything that does not require bass kicking you sideways, this speaker can be wonderful, especially if you are running 2 pairs of them. Everything is heard, in far more detail than many other Pioneers including the HPM's,

Like the HPM-100 this speaker needs to be pushed to begin doing its thing.
I read countless threads stating that there is no bass, that's nonsense ! There is plenty of tight punchy bass at mid to higher volumes, it's simply not the MTX gut punching make you sick to your stomach bass that so many grew accustomed to
during the mid 80s.

I will agree that at lower volumes, bass seems non existent, the mids being so upfront, I believe that perceived bass is diminished some. It's there, it's just not throwing you out of your chair.
Now I'll admit that I seldom listen to music at dinner table volumes, and if I do my HPM-40s' and 60's get the nod on a secondary system.

If you are looking for a stand alone, one and done speaker that can do everything well, the 99A is probably not that, but no speaker is that to me, including the big names dropped here on a regular basis, no matter what you have to spend.
I have friends that have $12-15k systems, that I thought sucked.
If you really want 99a's, then get 2 pair as they can sound glorious..A third pair for me was silly.

The earlier CS-99 really does nothing for me, boomy ,inarticulate, and lifeless comes to mind, maybe a recap would help, but the ones I've personally heard, I know that I wouldn't get spendy for a pair or put money into them.
The plain 63's, 77's and 88's to me are more or less the same as the 99's, pretty boring almost like someone threw a blanket over them, foam surrounds don't appeal to me, but they might shine with the right amp and genre of music. They are also quite a bit cheaper than the A series, so for some maybe a good starting point, but I wouldn't expect to get your money back should you get spendy then decide they aren't for you.
Every ear is different, tone is subjective at best , and we don't all have the same amps etc, and for someone they may be the ticket, and thats what makes the world go around. If we all wanted the same speaker, supply and demand would chase many out of the hobby.


CS-88A's were mentioned... They were the first pair I bought when I ventured into the Pioneer lattice style speakers. I really like my pair, the cabs aren't perfect but the drivers are mint. Again another speaker that gets a bad rap for lack of bass
and yeah, I'd tend to agree on this particular speaker, yeah it's tight and punchy, but the 12 doesn't really thump like a 15" in the A series. The mids are truly wonderful at all levels open and airy . I put Men At Work's first album through them and heard things in the song that I had never heard before.
It's another that I believe is not a stand alone speaker, but depending on what you listen to they can be wonderful.. I put a Rat Pack cd, Marty Stuart, The Fixx and a bunch of other music through them and they were nice in a smaller room.

CS-A700's were mentioned, I have a pair by default that I had to take to get my first CS-99A's. Very similar to the 88a's {same size cab I believe} however the bass extension seems / feels a little deeper than the 88A, I don't like or dislike them and have them listed, I prefer the 88a's over them .Though the A700 biamp triamp option is nice if thats what you are after.

Love my 63DX's, what wonderful speaker... The tweeters are the weak link, and if you want more bass than the 99A's this is it, and about half price of 99a's [aside from ebay.]
It's too bad Pioneer did not have a walnut veneered baffle on these, imagine the prices if they did !!

For me, none are stand alone speakers, I've run 2 & 3 pair of 99a's which can be nice, 88A's with 99A's , they compliment one another well.

I prefer the 88a's or 99a's with HPM-60s on top, as you still get the clarity and open airy sound of the CS mids, but you get just enough punch from the 60's to bring it all together, especially at lower volumes.

I was hesitant about buying them at first, but grew to love my quad of HPM-40's for lower volume listening, and 40's a top 60's is very nice as well. They take everything you put into them music wise. They are not the end all be all, but for the current prices they are still a great value.

In my main system I run an octet of HPM-100's with a Yamaha MX-1000U / CX-1000U , MX-800 /CX800 , MX-600U CX-600U.
I love them for many things, despise them for others.

Venturing down the Polk road soon, it will be interesting going from west to east coast sound.

It's all subjective, I've truly appreciated the tips and help I've received here and on other sites, so many good people eager to help, it's been a fun ride thus far.
 
Back
Top Bottom