Help me choose a subwoofer driver for home theater

[Onebean]

I’d like to build 2 subwoofers in custom cabinets to look like furniture. I’m thinking about firing the subwoofer down towards the floor, but it could be side firing too. Rough cabinet dimensions would be 18” wide x 18” deep x 24” tall. 1-12” or 15” per cabinet, 2 cabinets total. Something like this.



I have a class d Crown XLS 1502 amp to power them, and my home theater receiver has sub out with bass management and cross over.



The amp give me some options on speaker choice. I assume I would want them wired in parallel to help play more even throughout the room.

Room size is 30’ wide and 20’ deep. Actual theatre space is 15’ wide and 20’ deep, but the side is open to a wet bar and game table area. This space is primarily movies and TV, with only background music while playing games or cards.

I’ve looked at Dayton audio drivers a bunch, but I figured I’d throw it out to the speaker forum for advice or comments.

Front speakers are CCS 2TDx left right and center. Surround speakers are Speakercraft mounted in the ceiling. Sony HT receiver and an ATI 5 channel amp. Yes, just old school 5.1.

My approximate cabinet size works out to 2.6 cubic feet without the driver space. I’d be fine with Ported out the bottom/side or sealed. Is there a driver that can get into the low 30’s or high 20’s with my cabinet size and amplifier? What do I have to spend on a driver to accomplish this? I’d like to stay under $300 per driver if possible, but I’d consider spending more if there is a strong return on investment.

Let me know what you think.

 

[Nyjblbob]

So you have a good amp to use.
What about an electronic Crossover, the basic with the basic sub controls.
Phase, X-over point, ect.
For size 2.8 cu ft is not really big enough, for a ported design, unless your using small drivers.
You have a big space, so I would go with 15"s in a built like a brick, sealed cabinets!
Do the research on how to build a solid DIY sub cabinet!
using a 4 ohm driver will get you plenty of power, from that Crown amp.
Spec's for the speakers. what ever the brand or price point, Ask the seller specifically,
I need it to work in a Small sealed cabinet!
I doubt 300$ each will get you what you want unless you buy used,
and know the spec's and health of the woofers.
Good luck
bobhorn

 

[krautmaster]

I use two REL Classic 98 subs in my main system. They are 18.5" tall, 13.75" wide, 11.75" deep have 10" down firing woofers with 300 Watt amps. They provide more than enough bass (I have them a not quite 1/4 volume). You can easily turn that cabinet into a sub using the same sizing (you don't need 15" woofers).

 

[Nyjblbob]

And those REL 98's cost 1,499$ each.
Pretty sure Onebean is looking at DIY

 

[Onebean]

And those REL 98's cost 1,499$ each.
Pretty sure Onebean is looking at DIY

Yeah, I am looking at DIY.

@Nyjblbob are you suggesting a 15" sub in a sealed 2.8 cu.ft. box? I see some of the Dayton subs can fit that criteria, but I've never used one, so I don't know the reliability of them.

I assume the bass management of my home theater receiver will handle the cross over, phase, etc., is that a dangerous assumption? It has room EQ correction built in.

 

[homebrew]

Parts Express will have everything you need.

 

[Nyjblbob]

I doubt very much that your HT Receiver has a built in adjustable Xover.
There’s no doubt that the REL POWERED SUBSare very high quality with impeccable performance and finishes.
But if you Set up the diy subs right with quality 15’s and that Crown amp,
It would take 4 of those Rels to keep up with them.
I don’t have any experience with the Daytons. I’m more of a JBL collector.
Just make sure it’s a dedicated Subwoofer with 1,000 watt capabilities

 

[krautmaster]

And those REL 98's cost 1,499$ each.
Pretty sure Onebean is looking at DIY

Yep, and he can copy RELs idea using his cabinets,10" woofers and small plate amp for cheap money... no need for a huge 15" flabby sounding woofer

 

[Pete B]

This sub is in a very big box, but see my last post in this thread where I conclude that building
a pair of subs might be the best way to go:

https://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/1510766-rsl-speedwoofer-12s-interesting-slot-loaded-design

Since the primary use is for HT it is all about moving as much air as possible due to the very low LFE content.

 

[whoaru99]

I doubt very much that your HT Receiver has a built in adjustable Xover.

@Onebean

As with any somewhat specific technical feature question it's always helpful if the exact make and model number is provided.

That said, generically speaking, if the OP has a HT receiver and the receiver has dedicated subwoofer/LFE output, almost certainly it will have some degree of adjustable bass management including LPF setting for the sub and HPF (if desired) for the mains.

 

[whoaru99]

Personally don't know all that much about the Dayton drivers but my impression based on reading is they are OK/decent.

Quick perusal suggested the Max-X MX15-22 15" drivers are good for F3 25Hz in a 3cf vented box (per the "specs" on the webpage). $245 each. I'm sure there are better, but at similar price point I can't say.

 

[pboser]

The discontinued NHT 1259 12" driver in 2.5-3 cubic feet sealed has been a successful and reliable way to get down into the low 20s at least. Your Crown amp with its onboard lowpass option will be a good fit.

 

[whoaru99]

Unlikely to actually need the LPF in the amp coming from a sub/LFE output on HT receiver. But, shouldn't hurt to turn it on as long as it's set an octave or two above the HT receiver LPF setting.

 

[Onebean]

@whoaru99 good point, I'll grab the model off the HT receiver tonight, I don't remember it off the top of my head.


Talking to the guys at CSS, they are recommending this speaker in a sealed box as small as 1.25cu.ft. It's a little more that I weas hoping to spend, but it seems like a really nice driver.

https://www.parts-express.com/CSS-SDX12-XBL2-12-Subwoofer-290-3006?quantity=1&msclkid=5a6a69be27741d57ea24031a3d216db2&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Standard%20Shopping%20-%20Speaker%20Components&utm_term=4583314296536342&utm_content=Hi-Fi%20Woofers%2C%20Subwoofers%2C%20Midrange%2C%20Tweeters

This kit also has me interested. With the flat pack, it saves me a bunch of time. I wonder if the performance would be similar to the CSS driver???

https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-15-Ultimax-II-with-3-Ft-Cabinet-DIY-Home-Theater-Subwoofer-Kit-300-7222?quantity=1

 

[whoaru99]

This is what it says, but is only one parameter albeit an important one for subwoofage.

• Excellent sealed low frequency extension: F3 = 35 Hz and F10 = 22 Hz

 

[Nyjblbob]

This is what it says, but is only one parameter albeit an important one for subwoofage.

That's the winner right there!. the Ultramax 11 flatpack kit
Good search Whoaru99.

 

[Mr Boochie]

I DIYed two subs using the JBL 136A woofer. 3/4-inch MDF. Bolted internal bracing. Woofer mounted off-center. 4.5 internal cubic feet. 4-inch-cubed fiberglass sound insulation, loosely placed in the cabinets. DIY 12dB/octave passive crossovers. Driven by an Anthem 250 watt/CH amp.

DIY grille.

DIY choke and insulation cubes.

A sample tune. Subs on.

Take Five.
Dave Brubeck. "Time Out." Columbia Records CS 8192. STEREO. Pitman pressing. Second variant. 1961.
Run-out: XSM47855-2BA [small] P [scrawled] II

 

[Onebean]

My home theater receiver is a Sony STR ZA3100ES. At a quick glance of the manual, it appears to have a user selectable sub crossover starting at 40hz and moving up to 200hz in 10 hz increments. I can’t tell if it has any eq features to bump bass at very low frequencies.

 

[Mr Boochie]

For whatever it's worth, I made my crossover at 100Hz.

 

[Nyjblbob]

My home theater receiver is a Sony STR ZA3100ES. At a quick glance of the manual, it appears to have a user selectable sub crossover starting at 40hz and moving up to 200hz in 10 hz increments. I can’t tell if it has any eq features to bump bass at very low frequencies.

that is great news that it has the sub X-over. Does it also limit the main speakers from getting the lower bass?
Now that Mr Boochie brought up his JBL’s, that’s something I can speak about.
While not technically Subwoofers, the foam edge 15’s can be used as subs.
The main issue with them is they require 5 cu ft and ports.
I would be concerned about using Mr B’s Alnico 136a’s with your 500+ watt crown amp
My JBL 4343’s use the same woofer,although with the 2231a designation
The Alnico motors can loose some of their magnetic strength when pushed beyond say 200 or so watts
Now if you happen to see a great deal on a pair of
More modern JBL 2235’s like my JBL 4430’s use, and you can deal with the larger 5 sq very dense cabinets .
Like JBL used in their older B380 sub. Their output is very substantial. And they would be keepers.
I use just the bass on my 4430’s and as stands and Subs for my Altec 604’s. Strictly for 2 channel stereo. Tubes on the Altec’s.
My tv Ht is really just a 2 channel set up, cable box directly to my power amp. A Qsc 400 watt+ pro sound
Using my 4435’s with 4 15’s. Full range. No subs are needed to shake my house.
Btw the second woofer in them passively is only for 100 hz and below.
Bobhorn