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Zebra,

For our benefit, could you start with several dots and give us your impressions as you add, ending at the final setup that you've shown?

Is that a pattern or random? I'm having trouble telling.

Thanks.
 
jgordon said:
Zebra,

For our benefit, could you start with several dots and give us your impressions as you add, ending at the final setup that you've shown?

Is that a pattern or random? I'm having trouble telling.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I'm a little ways off from listening to my 208. But I will be more than happy to throw in my impressions of the spot mat, once I do get to the point of spinning the vinyl. I know it is hard to tell, but there is a pattern to the spots on the pic of the 208's platter.
 
im thinking of trying this on my Pioneer PL-112D. Does the height of the cork dots matter, I mean, does it have to be an exact height?
 
delfam said:
im thinking of trying this on my Pioneer PL-112D. Does the height of the cork dots matter, I mean, does it have to be an exact height?
Click to expand...

If you could use a thickness of material that is equal to what your current mat thickness is, then you should have no problem. If not then you would probably need to re-adjust your VTA to compensate for the change in thickness.
 
I didn't try anything described here, but I tough that the "dots" could be glued on a round piece of paper that fits your platter. That way you could "save" your configurations and rapidly switch from one to another and enhance your comparison process. Just an idea...
 
minimax said:
I didn't try anything described here, but I tough that the "dots" could be glued on a round piece of paper that fits your platter. That way you could "save" your configurations and rapidly switch from one to another and enhance your comparison process. Just an idea...
Click to expand...

And a damn good idea it is at that, minimax. :thmbsp: I was going to say something in my original post about doing this, but the train pulled out of the station too quick. I will be using some heavy watercolor paper to place the cork spots on.

Thanks again for bringing this up minimax.
 
It's important to record your findings per set up - record to audacity or similar using the same levels each time (make a note of them). That way you have a way of direct comparison without resorting to tricky vague memories. NB also use the same tracks.
 
The paper idea is a great one - I haven't seen the product, but my understanding is that this is exactly what ringmat does. One piece of round paper, two cork rings on either side.

My main reference album is Paul Simon - Graceland. The album's extremely well-mastered, and has a great combination of treble, bass (whoever told you the sondek is shy on bass never tried my setup) and a broad range of vocals. I typically use the introduction of either boy in the glass bubble or Call me Al, and then delve into other tracks for their specific points of focus.

Glad to see the thread going and getting so many good results.
 
I tried this with some shelf liner today on my Rega P5. It sucked the bass and drive right out of the music, I much prefer the sound of the felt. I'll try it again when I run into some cork, and see what the difference is.
 
After reading this thread I decided to try using some fabric backed foam headliner material in place of the hard rubber mat on my PL-51a. It seems to lay flat and the record spins without visible up/down movement. Soundwise I'm still listening for changes. Music sounds really good but I'll have to a/b with the different "platters" to listen for suck outs, volume changes etc. Maybe nothing noticable will occur but you never know.
 
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cmb3366 said:
I tried this with some shelf liner today on my Rega P5. It sucked the bass and drive right out of the music, I much prefer the sound of the felt. I'll try it again when I run into some cork, and see what the difference is.
Click to expand...

Was the VTA the same? What thickness of Shelf liner to Mat thickness?

How did the vocals & cymbals compare?
 
Same VTA, the batteries in my calipers are dead at the moment, so I don't have a accurate means of measuring the thickness, but in a side by side comparison they are very, very close.

The only difference in the upper registers was that they stood out more with the dots than the felt, mainly due to the lack of low-end. There wasn't much change in the actual sound/timbre of the highs.
 
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Final update. This is really a tweak, or should we call it a design improvement, that takes the music to another level. It cannot be compared with all the different mats I have tried before, the musicality is so much better.

I compare this with when I bought my latest full range loudspeaker, it took a little time to get used to the absence of distorsion. I feel that a full range speaker can more take benefit of a tweak like this. If the speaker can´t handle really low frequences, it´s possible we will have a little lack of energy from 100 to 30Hz, because some boomyness will disappear.

If I should draw some conclusions it would be: use as few dots as you possibly can, just so the record isn´t bending to much. I finally ended up with nine (9). Use dots of mtrl with some damping effect(hard pressed wool is a fantastic mtrl for this). If using cork or similar there is big risk that the contact to some dots will be weak. Use a mat between the platter and the dots, a thin cork mat or a slip mat works fine for me.
Than You for this thread.

gusten
 
Well, tweaked the KD-550 this time, and used felt discs instead or cork, as was said before probably better contact with a slightly uneven record.

Unbelievable improvement over stock rubber mat or wool over rubber mat configurations.

Cleaner sound, barely no transfer of noise in the lead-in groove before the music starts. Once again, awesome unexpensive tweak!
 

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I was in the hardware store today and picked up a dozen of those cork dots .Set them up on my TD160 , guessing at placement from earlier pics . I recorded a clip(Diana Krall) with my normal mat (vinyl bliss aka shelf liner ) and the cork dots . there was a difference . I flipped back and forth in audacity from 1 track to the other . First thing , cork dots brings out more detail ,the vocal is more up front , the soundstage seemed to diminish though ? spent about 20 mins switching from one track to the other and the differences came out . More detail with the cork dots , up front presentation . Normal mat , a more laid back approach on the vocals but the bass was better , seemed deeper and tighter . I didn't stick them on so I will fool more with this . I closed Audacity without saving , duh !!! Great way to spend a Sunday afternoon .
And the thickness seemed to be about the same for the 2 , looking at the tonearm on the record that is . More research is required I think.
 
ARJohn said:
I was in the hardware store today and picked up a dozen of those cork dots .Set them up on my TD160 , guessing at placement from earlier pics . I recorded a clip(Diana Krall) with my normal mat (vinyl bliss aka shelf liner ) and the cork dots . there was a difference . I flipped back and forth in audacity from 1 track to the other . First thing , cork dots brings out more detail ,the vocal is more up front , the soundstage seemed to diminish though ? spent about 20 mins switching from one track to the other and the differences came out . More detail with the cork dots , up front presentation . Normal mat , a more laid back approach on the vocals but the bass was better , seemed deeper and tighter . I didn't stick them on so I will fool more with this . I closed Audacity without saving , duh !!! Great way to spend a Sunday afternoon .
And the thickness seemed to be about the same for the 2 , looking at the tonearm on the record that is . More research is required I think.
Click to expand...


That's quite interesting, thanks for testing and posting... Looking forward to your further testing results!
 
I'm not going to discount that some of you have heard an improvement of sound from X-platter mat to dots of various makeups, diameter and spacing.....but I just did a series of tests myself and can't make out ANY sonic difference.

My TT is a Technics SP-15 with the heavy-thick rubber mat. I have some felt circles 1 1/2" dia and almost as thick.....may be 1/32" or less thinner. I also have some 3/4" square rubber feet that are the same thickeness as the mat. For each test, I used five of each "dot" and spaced them in a pentagon.

Granted, maybe the thickness between the original mat and the replacement dot needs to be within .0001, but to my eye and looking at how parallel the tonearm was with the rubber mat, the felt dots and the rubber squares, the tonearm looked extremely parallel and level to me. Basically, I didn't alter the VTA much if at all.

Maybe my TT isn't in the same league as you guys' where I should be able to discern tweeks as this thread suggests? Perhaps it's the other elements in the signal chain within my system, who knows? I do know that the orginal rubber mat sounds dang good in my system and I think I'll keep it :thmbsp:
 
Funny how my B&O table comes with a radial pattern of "stripes" that put a lot of air under the record :)
 
I had previously tried this on a Sansui SR-535 without success, sucked the life out of the bass and the soundstage, but upon seeing this thread agian I just tried the 5 dot setup on my Dual 1246 (belt drive light platter) and all I can say is WOW!! No background noise, very 3d sound, really impressed! Defiantly worth a try:yes:
 
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