JBL L300/136a Help

K

Kazanski

New Member
Hi - first time posting here so apologies if I didn’t get this in the right place or don’t have enough info. I was gifted a pair of JBL L300 speakers by my father-in-law a few years back as he and his wife downsized from a house to a condo. As I already had way too much gear they went into storage until I could finish my basement and set them up in a proper space they deserve. I am just getting around to refurbishing them and noticed that the cone on one of them had been repaired in the past, and I cant tell if it was done well or not (looks pretty shoddy to me). My OCD sometimes gets the best of me so was hoping for some guidance from the rest of the group before I go down a path that I will regret. I know they do not make recone kits for these and I would be using a 2235H cone kit, but wanted some feedback on some of my questions below:

- Do I even need to replace the cone? Is this affecting the sound of the speaker enough that it is worth it?
- If it does need to be replaced should I do both speakers at the same time?
- Is this something I can do on my own (I have done foam jobs and some lightweight repairs on my gear in the past)
- Should I just have them shipped off and have a full refurb of them since the magnets are probably in need of a zap? If so where is the most reputable place? (I am in Chicagoland area)
- Should I just replace it wholesale with a 2235H (or any other recommendations) if I can source one in good shape and just skip all the hassle and risk of shipping it out?
- Similarly if I replace one should I replace both with 2235H?

Unrelated (and I know I am opening up a can of worms) anything else I should be doing to the L300’s while I have them opened up? Like I said I can have some OCD issues with this stuff, and I am trying to keep myself from opening everything up and replacing all the parts (diaphragms, crossovers, etc). I did hook them up prior to pulling them apart and to my ears they operate and sound fine with no audible distortion or issues. They will be on full display, which is mainly why I am concerned with the cone damage - it just looks bad.

These are currently hooked up to a Yamaha CR1020, but will eventually be hooked up to McIntosh MC2105/C29 combo once I get those cleaned up and refurbed.

I guess that is a good place to start for now (I know, lots to unpack here). Appreciate any feedback from the group and thanks in advance.
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Several questions regarding the cone, I’ll start with the “zap” of the magnet:

Most people, including Greg Timbers (JBL - retired speaker designer of significant note and reputation) have said that the Alnico magnets typically don’t degrade with time alone, it takes quite a bit of power (magnetism) to degrade them. That having been said, you don’t really know if these were driven hard or overdriven, but chances are that they were not. If you can find out what amplifier(s) your father-in-law used to drive them and how he listened to them you should be able to surmise whether they might have been driven hard. If he drove them with the 2105 that you’ve mentioned I’d say probably not.

About the cone: Yes, I too would need to replace it. If not on measured performance, just on the obsessive part of my brain, and appearance. However, no need to do it immediately. There are a couple of reputable JBL re-coners here on this forum and you’ll certainly soon find their names, I believe looneytunes is one (old guy memory here). <edit> Don’t trust my memory here, I’m starting to think I bought bulbs from looneytunes?. Either way others will eventually chime in, there are a couple of well-known JBL re-coners.

The recommended (only) cone replacement is the 2235H as you already know. However, this is significantly different from the original so you WILL need to replace in a pair. If that bothers you, it wouldn’t be a bad idea to keep the good woofer original, and either find another good original woofer (unlikely and expensive) to replace the damaged one, or I would instead put the good one in storage, find another bad one and send them both out for remag and recone. Or, you can look for a pair of 2235Hs to replace both woofers (the L300A is unchanged other than the 136H (ferrite) woofer which is the same as the 2235H motor). This is actually what I’d do, I prefer the ferrite version, looked for a while to find them (the L300A), and also note that the power handling of the L300A is twice that of the L300.

Mine are running two 136H with OE C8R2235H recones, which is the recommended recone for the 136A and 136H. I prefer the extended bass of the 2235H cones but there are a couple of people over at the Lansing Heritage site that prefer the 2234H (which is the 2235H cone without the mass ring installed). I guess you would only give up a couple of Hz at the bottom, but the (measured) response of the L300A with 2235H cone is so flat I wouldn’t do it any differently.
 
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Actually, another look at the photo and it appears to be already a 2235 cone. Check the other one, it probably is also. IIRC the original 136A has a longer tinsel/glue-line for the voice coil wires leading out from the dust cap when viewed from the front of the speaker, or you can remove the driver and see whats written on the back.

I looked for / at L300s for a couple of years before finding the ones I wanted, and have not yet found 136As with original cones, FWIW. Besides, the foam on that sucker is past its freshness date, ...
 
When I got my L300s, one of the original 136A was missing, so I sold the other one on ebay, and installed 2235H woofers into them. IMO, that is the way to go.
 
Says right on the cone, it's a 2231 replacement. This was the pro version of the 136A and is a bit different than the 2235.

At this point in time, you would be lucky to find a pair of original 2235 cones, let alone 2231 or 136A cones. :no:

If you can find 2235 cones, have a pro redo the both of them. Always do what ever you do in pairs.
 
SaturationPt said:
Actually, another look at the photo and it appears to be already a 2235 cone. Check the other one, it probably is also. IIRC the original 136A has a longer tinsel/glue-line for the voice coil wires leading out from the dust cap when viewed from the front of the speaker, or you can remove the driver and see whats written on the back.

I looked for / at L300s for a couple of years before finding the ones I wanted, and have not yet found 136As with original cones, FWIW. Besides, the foam on that sucker is past its freshness date, ...
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Thanks for quick response, the marking on the cone is actually 2231A which I believe was the original? I will pull the other and take a look since I need to tear it down anyway just to confirm. I was actually going down the path of just doing a full 2235H swap on both after doing some reading here and on LH, but my conscience got the best of me and I figured I would check here first to make sure I am not missing anything...

Will check back with a few pics of the other woofer later.
 
Reference @toddalin above on the 2231A cones, if the other is also a 2231A I’d consider not changing the cone but buying another 136A to recone and saving that speaker as-is with the original type cone (rare these days).

Or the 2235H swap, are you considering buying complete drivers? The 136H with 2235H (C8R2235) recones is exactly the same if you find them, and only a few of us who know the serial-number break point from 136A to 136H will be able to tell they’re not original drivers to your serial-number (for what that is worth, I’d be happy with either label on the magnet). I vote for the 2235H driver swap.

Do note before you do it though, there are vintage JBL fans who prefer Alnico-magnet drivers so your choice whether you sell those to cover the cost of the 2235Hs or keep them.
 
Is it just me or the foam surround looks abnormaly wide on that woofer?.
The 2235's are very narrow...
 
Swollen from age.

This is a new D8R2235:

95F22E88-842F-4B95-8CB9-BF2D35CEBBB1.jpeg

I have found that the Simply Speakers foam matches it exactly in dimensions/thickness/compliance. Others might also.
 
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A couple of folks have swapped out the old woofers from the similarish L200 for the much newer 2216Nd-1 (or 2216Nd) used in the JBL 4367 (M2). Not cheap but something to think about particularly if you have any thoughts about implementing DSP for active crossovers. Not much choice except to buy them new.

Last but not least, welcome to AK :beerchug:
 
People have reported good results with swapping the 2216 in for the 2231/2235 in these old systems. And it has an accordion surround, no more re-foams. A real C8R2235 is going to cost north of $200 ea, $100 ea to install, probably $100 ea way for freight on the pair, you are past halfway to the cost of a new driver that has quite a bit lower distortion in the 2216Nd, and should have support for some time -

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index...l-2216-le15b-vs-jbl-2216nd-1-in-l200s.830641/
 
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donprice said:
A couple of folks have swapped out the old woofers from the similarish L200 for the much newer 2216Nd-1 (or 2216Nd) used in the JBL 4367 (M2). Not cheap but something to think about particularly if you have any thoughts about implementing DSP for active crossovers. Not much choice except to buy them new.

Last but not least, welcome to AK :beerchug:
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Jeffery said:
People have reported good results with swapping the 2216 in for the 2231/2235 in these old systems. And it has an accordion surround, no more re-foams. A real C8R2235 is going to cost north of $200 ea, $100 ea to install, probably $100 ea way for freight on the pair, you are past halfway to the cost of a new driver that has quite a bit lower distortion in the 2216Nd, and should have support for some time -
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My L200's have had the 2216Nd1's added. These are in the 4367,s and the Nd (no 1) come in the M2. As I understood it, there is not a lot of difference between the two, the M2 is a biamped speaker I believe whereas the 4367 has a internal crossover.
I am still quite gaga over the difference these modern woofers can bring to the L200/300!
 
When I put together the 2235s for my L300s, the baskets cost me $50 apiece, and the kits were ~$325 for the two, being able to do the re-cone myself saved me some $$.
11 years later, I still love 'em, but the call of the 4367 or M2 is definitely reaching me. Or, maybe the 2216 swap might be the way to go....
 
Alobar said:
My L200's have had the 2216Nd1's added. These are in the 4367,s and the Nd (no 1) come in the M2. As I understood it, there is not a lot of difference between the two, the M2 is a biamped speaker I believe whereas the 4367 has a internal crossover.
I am still quite gaga over the difference these modern woofers can bring to the L200/300!
Click to expand...

I have a buddy who owns about everything JBL has ever made as far as high end and top notch pro gear, and has the measurement equipment and chops to make sense of it all. He says these new low distortion JBL woofers are the real deal, maybe most people don't consider the woofer in the distortion equation but it matters. I was lucky enough to land some other JBL low distortion woofers and can confirm that they are killers.
 
thanks for heads up on that... at this point if they aren't going all stock/oem, then I am open to options and will do some research on the 2216Nd. I am not in it for the resell, I just want to use them and enjoy them. Finally got around to pulling the other woofer, pics are below. All original, just needs a refoam most likely. Hoping that can offset the price of some replacements....

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Jeffery said:
I have a buddy who owns about everything JBL has ever made as far as high end and top notch pro gear, and has the measurement equipment and chops to make sense of it all. He says these new low distortion JBL woofers are the real deal, maybe most people don't consider the woofer in the distortion equation but it matters. I was lucky enough to land some other JBL low distortion woofers and can confirm that they are killers.
Click to expand...
I have to agree.. I have never experienced bass this clear before! They are a great upgrade for these older L200/300 models, particularly as vintage replacement drivers and parts are drying up. The only way I know of to implement them is to biamp or triamp using also a DSP engine of some kind which is a drawback for many.. The 2216Nd1,s can really dig deep with DSP properly added. Mine go flat into the lower 20's hz and can do that at significant SPL. I have rattled things in the house, windows and such, with no sign of them giving up anything! Would love to hear 4367's or M2's but they are out of my $ league at this point.. This is the closest I can get!
 
Although the 2216ND-1 sounds like it is a nice woofer, it will require a different crossover or DSP. The 2235H isn’t a 2216ND-1 but in an L300 it is only down 3dB at 26Hz, ... a completely different response from the L200 woofers or even the L300/L300A woofer.
 
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