Jensen Model 5 - HELP!!

[Gunslingers]

Hi All!

Short term lurker here with my first post.

Recently got into the audio game and started scouring CL. Found a set of speakers needing some TLC, Jensen Model 5's for $20 and thought they were good candidates for my first refurbish.
Just went ahead redid the cabinets with Howard's Restore a Finish and Feed and Wax. They look great! It was night and day.

The woofers badly needed a reform so I removed the woofers from the cabinets. Started removing the old foam and it came off with some work.

At that point I turned the woofer over and noticed they were not original. I already ordered new surrounds (link below) for the original Jensen model 5 12" woofers.

http://www.simplyspeakers.com/jensen-speaker-foam-edge-repair-kit-fsk-12f.html

I just wanted some feedback on a few things.

1. Will the surrounds I ordered work for these other 12" woofers?
2. Should I keep the non-original woofers/are they any good?
3. Any other advice / steps forward are appreciated?

Thanks for reading.
Disheartened newbie

 

[xero-D-hero]

JMO here:

1. See answer 2.
2. I would'nt no / to me it simply does'nt matter if they're ok woofers or not,they're not originals so I would'nt wanna use them in these speakers.
3. Going forward I'd keep an eye on that auction site (or elsewhere) and find a pair of useable/refoamable OE Model 5 woofers to put in these speakers.

These Jensen speakers are fairly common and I've seen those often enough for reasonable $ so that should'nt be too big a deal.

I have a pair of Model 4 that are waiting their turn for this sorta attention,so for awhile I was checking on this Jensen stuff pretty regularly (mine needed 1 tweeter,grill emblems & the woofers refoamed),I mean sure it make take a little while,but a pair of these will show up sooner or later.

HTH

Bret P.

 

[tubeampking]

I'll play Devil's Advocate here... Some of Radio Shack's older USA made drivers were manufactured by Oxford or Utah and not bad speakers. If the foams work and you redo them, you might as well drop them in and see how they sound. It may turn out that the tweeters are not that great...better to find that out before buying new woofers. As to whether or not the foams will work, its a crap shoot. Are they for angled or flat cone attachment. Since you got them from SS its possible they are a generic " one size fits all" as they are prone to selling. Ultimately the choice is yours since you're the one who will be listing to them.
TIP: become an AK subscriber and make use of Barter Town. People here are less apt to mislead you about the item you're buying.

 

[Gunslingers]

Thank you all for your feedback.

I have a hard time believing the seller misled me on purpose as he seemed very genuine, but he may have.

He did say however that he had tested the speakers at a low volume and the tweeters and mids sounded ok. I have not yet verified that though.

It is a little disappointing to hear that Simply Speakers sells a generic foam surround. For future reference where would you recommend sourcing foam from?
The surrounds I ordered are for flat cone attachments. These realistic for radio shack woofers look to have angled attachments?

 

[xero-D-hero]

I've been getting all my foams from Rick Cobb (looneytoon2001 on that auction site).

My recent surround (foam) purchases from him include those Jensen Model 4,as well as some JBL LX-44 & JBL MR25,and a pair for my Infinity RS-5001.

FWIW

Bret P.

 

[stickman]

Since those Rat Shack woofers were made in the USA and look like good quality units, I would definitely refoam those even if it meant purchasing new foams. If they didn't sound decent after a refoam, at least you could re-sell them in working condition.

 

[Drumolator]

I agree that you should refoam them and try them out. Peace and goodwill.

 

[Gunslingers]

Thanks guys!! The foam I ordered just came in.

I'm going to go ahead with the refoam and see what happens. I'll post some pic's after if it looks like the foam is going to work.

I'd be interested to see what you all think of my refoam job.

Edit:

Just laid the foam on to see if they would work with these different woofers I was not expecting and it looks pretty good to my untrained eye (see photos).

 

[Gunslingers]

Hi All, went ahead with the refoam. I think it came out well, testing the woofers I can feel no rubbing.

I was taking a look at the internals. I'm going to go ahead and clean the potentiometers, but I was wondering if I should replace the rest of the internals?

If so can anyone help me identify the components. One appears to be capacitor of 25 v 82uF. The other two components I'm less sure about. I think one is a transistor? and the other with the wire wrapped around it is a resistor of some sort?

 

[stickman]

The two cylindrical black objects with red end caps are capacitors which should be replaced due to their age. I've read comments here on AK over the years that those caps if fed too much power can pop like a firecracker! (lol) These should be replaced with film capacitors of a similar capacitance rating (usually purchased by most AKer's from Parts Express or Madisound). Most tweeter caps are in the 8 to 2 ohm range depending on their resistance and the cross-over frequency. Midrange caps usually have much higher capacitance again depending on the resistance of the midrange drivers and the cross-over frequency, but I'll admit that 82 uf seems really high even though the Model 5 has two midrange drivers. Make a diagram showing where the two current capacitors are connected and cut their lead wires right where they enter the caps so you can connect/solder the new cap lead wires to the old leads. Maybe you can get a better reading of the cap values once you've carefully pried them off of the cross-over board. If the one cap really is rated at 82 uf, then a replacement film capacitor would be really expensive so a non-polarized electrolytic capacitor would be the way to go to keep it affordable.

The item with the wire wrapped around it is an iron core inductor choke coil usually used to roll off the woofer's upper frequency response (and they are sometimes used on midrange drivers as well). These typically never go bad, so that can be left alone.

Have fun!

 

[Gunslingers]

Thanks for the info. I can confirm they caps are definitely 82uf @ 25v and 2.2 uf @ 30. Just uncovered a bit more bad news though. Seems to me that one of the tweeters does not work as well as one of the mid's on one speaker. The other speaker seems to be fine. I went ahead and cleaned the pots very well hoping that would fix the issue, but no such luck. Staring to think it's time to cut my losses, had fun though and glad to have a refoam under my belt. The one full speaker that does work sounds pretty good.

Would there be any merit in replacing the mids and tweeters with new equivalents, as short of buying other model 5's to pull from I have a hard time believing they are out there for a reasonable price?

 

[xero-D-hero]

These midranges are very common and usually dirt cheap (like $20.00 +/-),as they're the same mids for the Model 4/5/6.
Tweeters are a little harder to find,but they're out there,and not crazy expensive,I got the one I needed from a fellow AK'er for a very reasonable price.
And like I said earlier,even the OE woofers pop up for not too much $$$$,sometimes you even see them refoamed and ready to go.

If the ultimate goal is to flip them,then putting money into them is likely not a good investment,because even in good working shape,these Jensen Model_ speakers dont command big money in the used audio marketplace.

If the goal is just to get some refurb experience & end up with a decent sounding vintage speaker,then put into them whatever you are comfortable putting into them.

Me,once I commit by making the initial purchase,I'm in it for the long haul,so to me whatever it takes to bring them back to functional shape is what they get.
Then I gotta get my investment back by listening to them a good long while before even considering selling them.

FWIW

Bret P.

 

[Gunslingers]

Definitely the later goal, but I also just wanted to get the most bang for my buck. I like your perspective on things.

You were spot on with $20 lol (auction listing) I should have looked before I posted.
but these model 4 mids look a tad different the the mids in mine (see photo). Do you think these are comparable?

Also is this the tweeter without front and rear covers (see photos)?

Also realized I hadn't yet posted a picture of the cabinets.

 

[xero-D-hero]

Yes that's the tweeter w/o the cover.

Part number on your mids is mostly the same as those black cover mids except yours ends with an R suffix (C9637 vs. C9637R),my guess would be those are a later/revised midrange maybe,with the R suffix added to designate such & a different color cover to further differentiate them. I honestly dont have the remotest idea what the difference maybe between the black can mids and these lighter can "R" mids you seem to have.

My instincts would be to keep them all the same if @ all possible,but that would suck if to do so meant replacing the other mids in you speakers just to match the mids you can find elsewhere. All that aside,for what these mids typically cost,it probably would'nt hurt much to grab one of the black cover mids and give it a try and see how it sounds.

Also FYI: There is currently a pair of tweeters on the auction site as well (no affiliation),just note that they're not listed under Jensen Model_ or such ,they're listed under the more generic "Jensen tweeters" (that tweeter's part number is E-200).

HTH & Good luck.

Bret P.

 

[Gunslingers]

Hi All,

Back with another update.

I've gone ahead and ordered some caps to install.

After some more testing it appears that only one mid is actually dead, the tweeter functions at least on some level.

I pulled out the mid as you can see below. It appears to the multi-meter to have an open circuit. The other mid in that speaker reads out at around 7.6 ohms. As you can see in the picture the leads to the driver look fine. From what I have read and understand this would mean there is most likely a melted or disconnected voice coil? And here short of rewinding the voice coil I'd be best served replacing the driver?


Two other random add ons:
I was also looking to replace the push connectors with binding posts (but as you can see in the photos) the push connectors have 4 pronged legs that are bent for mounting. I haven't found any binding posts that appear compatible online, anyone know of any?

Is it typically a good idea to repair the screw holes (see photo)? I found the following, but it seemed a bit extreme.
http://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/21620/how-can-i-fill-a-screw-hole-so-it-can-be-used-again

Best and thank you for all the help!

 

[jaybird]

Make sure those L-pads aren't cooked, they are wire wound on plastic formers and if they get over heated they melt and deform. Would any available L-pad be able to replace these ? I have model 6's and mine are cooked.

 

[Gunslingers]

I did my best to google, but what exactly is an L-pad? Is that the solder joint?

 

[coonmanx]

L-pad is basically a volume control for one of the drivers, usually the tweeter. It keeps the resistance the same but alters the volume of the driver.

 

[Gunslingers]

Figured this thread deserved some closure. Ended up replacing the mid and the new one works great.

Speakers turned out awesome, really glad I brought them back to life. I would encourage anyone else considering it to give it a try.

 

[mitchalee]

As unlikely as it sounds, I just bought a pair of Jensen Model 5 loudspeakers for $100 with the exact same Radio Shack speakers removed but included with their surrounds rotted out and a pair of ancient alnico beasts installed. Well the woofers which look to be from the 1950s will come in handy for some period speakers but not in these 60s Model 5s. So I am now browsing Amazon, MadiSound, Parts Express and so on. Need something that can get down to 25 Hz, start fading at about 40, work in a sealed box, but only needs to stay clean up to about 500 or 600 Hz. Should be able to find something with modern foam, rubber, a nice magnet, on a good frame, and a light paper cone suitable to a 6os restore for under $100 each, probably under $150 for both. Unless, of course, Goldwood has a a loss leader on special. A real pig in a poke, but the better ones are just as good as brands coming in art double or triple the price with marginally worse quality control. But the same basic performance unless one gets lemoned!

Cheers!

Mitch