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KLF-20 or Cornscalas?

C

ccdline73

New Member
I found a nice set of klf 20s for sale but I've always been interested in making a set of cornscalas. I was wondering if anyone has heard both and could describe which one you prefer. I have heard my bosses klf 30s and thought they sounded really good but I would like to either have something similar or better. I would really like to beat my bosses set up haha. If it's better to save my money and just upgrade the klf 20s let me know. Any advice is helpful.

Thanks
Ccdline73
 
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define better. KLF20 will not push as much air as the KLF30 but if you don't have a really big room no problems. KLF20 or 30 will both go lower than a Cornwall woofer will. KLF with ti diaphragms will out sing a Cornwall. For you to decide which KLF will depend upon how loud you want to play and which size woofer that you prefer the sound of, ten or twelve as they both sound different. Four ten inch woofers will push as much air as three twelve inch woofers will. Four twelve inch woofers will push as much air as three fifteen inch woofers will. Properly braced and damped I find that four ten inch woofers sound excellent and make plenty of good bass. Using a KLF10 horn to replace the K79 tweeter horn then mount it on top of a KLF20 or 30 you can easily time align the horns and have identical horn polar patterns which is a huge bonus. Hope this helps. Best regards Moray James.
 
I like the sound of tens because I think they have a slightly tighter sound. I was looking for something of equal to better quality than the klfs but I know that can be hard to do. I was told that bob crites' cornscalas will have about the same bass of the klf 30s but better mids and highs.
 
Is this just about moving air and "bass"? Or is there any concern at all about sound quality?

Oh, and Moray, the CW does NOT sound like the CS.
 
Sound quality is my number one priority but I like to crank up the volume so I want it to be loud but good. I currently have kg 5.5s which sound fine but dont produce the bass or mids im looking for. I want something that sounds clean and not distorted but still has enough bass to feel like you're getting punched in the face haha.
 
Cornwall (Cornscala same woofer and tuning) are already 3db down at 39 - 40 Hz and drop like a rock after that. Best regards Moray James.
 
moray james said:
define better. KLF20 will not push as much air as the KLF30 but if you don't have a really big room no problems. KLF20 or 30 will both go lower than a Cornwall woofer will. KLF with ti diaphragms will out sing a Cornwall. For you to decide which KLF will depend upon how loud you want to play and which size woofer that you prefer the sound of, ten or twelve as they both sound different. Four ten inch woofers will push as much air as three twelve inch woofers will. Four twelve inch woofers will push as much air as three fifteen inch woofers will. Properly braced and damped I find that four ten inch woofers sound excellent and make plenty of good bass. Using a KLF10 horn to replace the K79 tweeter horn then mount it on top of a KLF20 or 30 you can easily time align the horns and have identical horn polar patterns which is a huge bonus. Hope this helps. Best regards Moray James.
Click to expand...

Just for shits & grins, I wonder if replacing the K79 with a K792 (and titanium diaphragms, natch) and the K52 with a K53Ti from a Heresy III would be worth it. You'd end up with an all-Tractrix design plus all titanium. Replace the crossover components with decent parts and you could have a contender...

-D
 
The stock poly tweeter diaphragm in the KLF is a terrible diaphragm and switching to titanium is a huge upgrade more so for the mid diaphragm. In my Heresy 3 I switched from the stock tweeter to a K79 lens with the ti diaphragm I prefer it to the stock unit. The KLF10 horn is the perfect tweeter horn for a KLF20 or 30 as it is virtually identical to the mid horn so identical polars and better overlap between mid and hi horns. Upgrade the caps and the inductors and don't forget to brace the cabinet. Lots of other mods and you have much more than a contender imo but as they ay ymmv. Best regards Moray James.
 
HarleySG, it sounds like to me that's what he's saying. I see you have a set of cornscalas, are they worth it? This might sound dumb or a little extreme but has anyone done a cornscala with two 15in woofers?
 
Contrary to what has been written, I think the bass of both the Cornwall and Cornscala goes deeper than 40 hz. That said, the bass definition of the Cornscala is better than the CW. And I use(d) them both ~6ft. into the room.

Yes, I believe the CS is a definite upgrade over the CW.

Not to insult you, but it really sounds like bass is what you want more than anything. In that case, you should probably go for the KLF 30.
 
I like bass but overall sound quality is my priority. Moray made it sound like the cornscalas had little bass compared to the klf 30s so I was just playing around with that idea. I guess ill just let my powered sub take over for whatever bass if any the cornscalas are missing. Thanks everyone for the input but I think im going to build a set of cornscalas. Klfs are hard to come by and I think this would be a fun project
 
Oh and I guess I have one last question. Would an emotiva amp be a good fit for the cornscalas? I also have a denon avr 2700 which I was told is a good receiver.
 
Tubes would be my first and only choice. But I am probably in the minority when it comes to amplifier choice around here. I'm no fan of cheap SS amps or receivers.
 
That is what you thought but it is not what I said

ccdline73 said:
I like bass but overall sound quality is my priority. Moray made it sound like the cornscalas had little bass compared to the klf 30s so I was just playing around with that idea. I guess ill just let my powered sub take over for whatever bass if any the cornscalas are missing. Thanks everyone for the input but I think im going to build a set of cornscalas. Klfs are hard to come by and I think this would be a fun project
Click to expand...

The Cornwall and the Cornscala both uses the same woofer and cabinet (generally speaking, I have not seen different woofer used but you could) so they are the same and bass does not change when you build a Cornscala. Again four ten inch units move as much air as three twelve inch do and four twelve inch woofers move as much air as three fifteen inch woofers will. So you can see that a KLF30 will push much more air than a single Cornwall/Cornscala can. I am talking volume of air displacement here. As to bass extension both the KLF20 and 30 have lower bass extension than the Cornwall/Cornscala do. Further you can easily play with the bass tuning of either of the KLF designs to further extend bass response another 3 -4 Hz.
A single fifteen inch woofer moves a lot of air and the Cornwall can hit with great impact but as I said (and you can go on line and find the factory response graphs) the Cornwall/Cornscala is already 3db down between 39 - 40 Hz and bass response drops rapidly below that point. The do not make deep bass but they can make lots of efficient solid bass with impact down to 40 Hz. If you want more extension than that you need to ad a sub or get a different loudspeaker. Depending upon how you load (position) your speakers and how you like them to sound you can play with the numbers a little but minus 3 db at 40 Hz. is not low bass, it's a full octave away from low bass at 20 Hz.. Cornwall speakers move much less air than a pair of KLF30 and they do not play as low as a pair of KLF30 and as I said you can find the response graphs and data on line. A pair of Chorus ll would be a better speaker to compare to a pair of KLF30 as the Chorus ll (the replacement to the Cornwall) has a better fifteen inch woofer with greater power handling (pro woofer) same response as a Cornwall but you can play it much louder provided you have the power on hand. Imo the mid horn of a Chorus ll is a better horn that the one used in a Cornwall. I think that you need to do some listening to as many different speakers as you can and see if you can establish the parts of each that you like best. If you want a suggestion talk to Bob Crites about his two way Cornscala. That would be the direction that I would take if I were going down this path. Hope this helps. Best regards Moray James.
 
Sorry if I sounded ignorant in my other post but it's because I am no pro when it comes to audio and am slowly learning. I do have a 10in klipsch powered sub and I was looking at an rsw 15 for an upgrade. I dont know if i need a my mains to hit lower than 40hz. Should your mains hit hz that low? I just kind of figured that's what the powered sub was for but i dont know anymore haha. I agree that i need to listen to other speakers but trying to find someone with a decent klipsch setup in eastern Iowa is hard to do. My boss is the only person i know with klf 30s. Another problem im running into is trying to find the klfs in the Iowa area so that's another reason i was inclined to go with the cornscalas.

Thanks,
Ccdline73
 
Well Bob just got back to me saying that the woofers he uses have hit around 29hz in certain cornscala cabinets but the cabinets that are based off of the Cornwall hit around 34hz. He also says since his woofers use an aluminum frame they have more magnet power than the Cornwall's do
 
I have both Cornscala and cornwall , they both have good bass, but the Cornscala has better bass.... it uses a diderent woofer than the cornwall uses... the cornwall and Cornscala are both awesome speakers IMO...
 
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