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KLH model 12

Phydeaux

Phydeaux

Active Member
These popped up with the contour boxes about three hours from me on Christmas Eve and I couldn’t keep them off of my mind for a couple days before I decided to drag my brother along on an all day drive to go get them.
R0GCY5l.jpg

Sadly though when I arrived they had the same problem as my model 5’s....dead tweeters :no:. I bought them anyways because i couldn’t justify going that far for nothing :dunno:. I am planning on recapping the contour boxes in the hopes that the tweeters will come back to life as others have had such success with other klh speakers.

I’ve never done a recap but figured with the crossover being external that it would be easier for me to tackle and maybe get me to a place where I feel comfortable doing my other speakers as well.

my question for now is simple, do I go with Dayton or similarly priced film/poly caps? Or would the generic NPE caps from parts express suffice?....the price difference is vast and even though the I dont want to cheap out on parts I also need to buy a soldering iron and other essentials to get the project moving forward.

this seems to be a touchy subject in other threads and don’t want to start a math war.....But given the age of these speakers are higher quality caps really necessary?

thanks all :bowdown:
 
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Thanks much, I read that post but I think he never updated after finding out his woofers were toast. One member in another thread said use npe for high value and film for low values which would save a lot of money as well. I just want to retain the original sound as much as possible but not have to recap again any time soon.

and nice, Long time zappa fan and never seen that up close before....is that your picture?
 
Not my picture, found it on a Zappa forum awhile back. Loves me some Zappa JG was my first taste back in the day and is still a fave to this day. I still feel for poor Mary stuck to seat 38

New caps should last for quite a long time, not to shoo you away but you might also check over at here (see attached link) all KLH all the time.

Look for posts by "JKent" he's one of the resident guru's over there

You might want to PM @slowpat based on this thread he did a recap based

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/klh-model-12-owners.259668/

https://community.classicspeakerpages.net/forum/4-klh/
 
Phydeaux said:
use npe for high value and film for low values
Click to expand...

In general this is what I would do. More specifically I would try to do film for the mids/tweeters and NPE for the woofers. It shouldn't be all that hard to figure out what's what, the 4 wires from the boxes to the speakers are Ground, Woofer, Midrange, Tweeter. The contour boxes are kind of a rats nest though, you'll have to trace it out.

I actually ended up with two sets of contour boxes, one I redid with film (the thread that was linked), one I redid with Parts Express NPE. Honestly I think they both sounded fine, KLH tweeters were never the last word in extension or detail and anything will be better than the caps that were in there from the factory.

Keep your fingers crossed that the tweeters aren't blown, they're unique to the Model 12 (they should be stamped M12 on the faceplate). Worse comes to worse Model 5 tweeters should be similar, although I would replace both even if only one is blown. Model 12 parts do show up on eBay occasionally, you'll need to be patient though.

In my experience they like big solid state power. I tried them with a couple tube amps and they sounded flat, but a couple hundred watts really woke them up.
 
Dswankey said:
Not my picture, found it on a Zappa forum awhile back. Loves me some Zappa JG was my first taste back in the day and is still a fave to this day. I still feel for poor Mary stuck to seat 38

New caps should last for quite a long time, not to shoo you away but you might also check over at here (see attached link) all KLH all the time.

Look for posts by "JKent" he's one of the resident guru's over there

You might want to PM @slowpat based on this thread he did a recap based

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/klh-model-12-owners.259668/

https://community.classicspeakerpages.net/forum/4-klh/
Click to expand...
One of my favorites as well, almost always end up listening to the whole album when I just had one track or two in mind....especially love
‘On the bus’ and ‘lucile’.


And thanks, the thread I found from jkent regarding the twelves was very informative and basically answered my question...although after seeing his work on his and others contour boxes...I’m half tempted to see if he’d do mine as well....seems like a nice guy and knows his stuff.
 
RossW said:
In general this is what I would do. More specifically I would try to do film for the mids/tweeters and NPE for the woofers. It shouldn't be all that hard to figure out what's what, the 4 wires from the boxes to the speakers are Ground, Woofer, Midrange, Tweeter. The contour boxes are kind of a rats nest though, you'll have to trace it out.

I actually ended up with two sets of contour boxes, one I redid with film (the thread that was linked), one I redid with Parts Express NPE. Honestly I think they both sounded fine, KLH tweeters were never the last word in extension or detail and anything will be better than the caps that were in there from the factory.

Keep your fingers crossed that the tweeters aren't blown, they're unique to the Model 12 (they should be stamped M12 on the faceplate). Worse comes to worse Model 5 tweeters should be similar, although I would replace both even if only one is blown. Model 12 parts do show up on eBay occasionally, you'll need to be patient though.

In my experience they like big solid state power. I tried them with a couple tube amps and they sounded flat, but a couple hundred watts really woke them up.
Click to expand...
Much appreciated Ross, I may go that route since the cost won’t be too much different....just don’t wanna spend what the all film route entails. Was mostly worried about the lifespan on the npe’s after reading some heated debates on other threads but seems like they’ll at least last long enough for me to enjoy them for a good while.

I have all of my fingers crossed about the tweeters, my fives are still unrestored since I haven’t had too much luck finding working ones for those either. I was under the impression that only the woofers were different from the fives, having a bigger magnet size but I’ll keep my eyes open for ones specific to the twelves if the recap doesn’t wake em up.

And currently running a sansui AU-777A rated at 30 wpc but most who own it say it’s moderately underrated and probably closer to 40-45. I know it’s nowhere near what you recommended but hopefully they’ll still sing until I can find a BA/CA-3000 combo or something in the big league range haha.
 
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It appears as you have been reading other threads , so I will be brief.

Detailed tweeter information can be found in the link below, but it's easy to identify 5, 12, or 23 tweeters, if the two plates are the same thickness then it's NOT a 5, 12, or 23.

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/klh-tweeter-id-and-repair.492609/

Woofers are said to be different, but I would try a 5 or 23 in a model 12 if needed.

As for capacitors, my theory is to replace the old with the same type. If using generic NPE from PE order extra since they are cheap and match them using a meter since they do vary.

Remove the grill from the front and test for a good seal of the drivers and woofer surrounds. Gently push down on the woofer and see if it returns in about 1 to 2 seconds. If not the surrounds may need to be treated with the proper sealant or the driver's are not completely sealed to the cabinet. Cabinet seams could also be leaky. I recommend Mortite for sealing drivers to the cabinet and if the woofers need treatment get it from Vintage_AR on the ePay site or contact @RoyC.

Any other concerns or questions just ask.
Good choice on your purchase and I hope it all comes together for you!
 
doctorolds said:
It appears as you have been reading other threads , so I will be brief.

Detailed tweeter information can be found in the link below, but it's easy to identify 5, 12, or 23 tweeters, if the two plates are the same thickness then it's NOT a 5, 12, or 23.

https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/klh-tweeter-id-and-repair.492609/

Woofers are said to be different, but I would try a 5 or 23 in a model 12 if needed.

As for capacitors, my theory is to replace the old with the same type. If using generic NPE from PE order extra since they are cheap and match them using a meter since they do vary.

Remove the grill from the front and test for a good seal of the drivers and woofer surrounds. Gently push down on the woofer and see if it returns in about 1 to 2 seconds. If not the surrounds may need to be treated with the proper sealant or the driver's are not completely sealed to the cabinet. Cabinet seams could also be leaky. I recommend Mortite for sealing drivers to the cabinet and if the woofers need treatment get it from Vintage_AR on the ePay site or contact @RoyC.

Any other concerns or questions just ask.
Good choice on your purchase and I hope it all comes together for you!
Click to expand...
Thanks doc,
I’ve been reading up here and there for most of the year since finding my fives in or around March, but sadly haven’t really gotten anything done in restoring them yet. In regards to the tweeters though I’ve been specifically looking only for ones from the models you listed, just haven’t found any working pairs yet.

Is there a more accurate brand of NPE caps you know of? Or are the variables in readings true of electrolytic caps in general? I don’t need to buy the cheapest but gasped when I saw my order total for the Dayton polys.

and lastly I’ve been meaning to buy some of the sealer and have put it off so I may do that step first as my 5’s and 22a’s have already needed it and the 12’s definitely need it as the woofers are noticeably more pliable when pushing in and bounce back very fast.

much appreciated, I’ve grown to be quite the klh nut over the course of the year...and feel pretty lucky to have found two of the most desirable Models in one year...even though they need more work than I knew I’d be getting into.
 
It's dissapointing you haven't gotten your fives working yet, I remember your thread from half a year ago! Some might consider this blasphemous, but if it were me I'd settle for a pair of 6, 17, 20 tweeters while I bide my time for a working pair of 5, 12, 23's. They're not particularly expensive, once you do find the correct tweeters you'll have a spare pair on hand for when you get a model that uses them, and in the mean time you'll have a nice pair of speakers to listen to!

Also, I went a LONG time reading threads on this website before I came across this infographic from the aphenos site. Just posting in case you haven't seen. http://www.aphenos.net/electronics/speakers/klh/klh-tweets.jpg
 
Penn42 said:
It's dissapointing you haven't gotten your fives working yet, I remember your thread from half a year ago! Some might consider this blasphemous, but if it were me I'd settle for a pair of 6, 17, 20 tweeters while I bide my time for a working pair of 5, 12, 23's. They're not particularly expensive, once you do find the correct tweeters you'll have a spare pair on hand for when you get a model that uses them, and in the mean time you'll have a nice pair of speakers to listen to!

Also, I went a LONG time reading threads on this website before I came across this infographic from the aphenos site. Just posting in case you haven't seen. http://www.aphenos.net/electronics/speakers/klh/klh-tweets.jpg
Click to expand...
I’m disappointed in myself too, they really deserve better but if you saw where I dragged em out of you’d probably call me a saint for rescuing these poor things!
What’s even more blasphemous than me not restoring them is how I’ve been using them, I found a pair of 22A’s not long after and use them stacked.....and I gotta day it’s sounds pretty damn good to my ears. Sorta why I got lazy cause it sounded so good on its own, but all three pairs deserve a recap, reseal, and makeover.

I have considered doing that with the t-3 type tweeters but even those haven’t come up too much. Or they come up when I’m not looking anymore with my luck haha.
I think I have a pic of the differences before but that one really cleared it up in what I’m looking for exactly.

don’t worry, someday soon all redeem myself but until then I’m a blasphemer :whip:
 
Penn42 said:
Didn't mean to berate you! If the 'bay's been scarce it's been scarce. Your luck will turn eventually.
Click to expand...


No not at all, it’s just some much needed motivation to get me going.
I really have been wanting to work on them but it’s slightly intimidating to me and if I mess anything up I’ll be missing all that bass.
That and I got a bit hooked on my sansui addiction and tracked down some rare headphones and an amp/tuner combo.

Out of room now after getting these so I’d say it’s time do at least do something!
 
Something sounds like a good idea, lol.
Another idea to think about is becoming an AK subscriber so you can post a wanted add in Barter Town. One of our many members probably has 1 or 2 they could possibly part with? Even though the ePay site has none available now you can do a search and save it with notifications so when they appear you will get a message. I recommend using 2 searches using "KLH tweeters" in electronics and vintage electronics. Good luck!
 
I owned a beautiful pair for a year but they never left my basement workshop after I finished working on them. Too big to fit anywhere in our smaller house. Very low WAF rating. I recapped the crossover boxes using good quality mylar caps plus Nichicon bi-polar electrolytic speaker caps for the larger values. They really sounded nice. I use 5's now instead. One little trivial upgrade I did to the crossovers. The amp in screw terminals are hidden below the four speaker connections and are a pain to get to. I drilled two holes in each box (std. banana plug spacing) off to the side of the amp screws and mounted twin red/black speaker binding posts. These are parallel connected to the original screws.

KLH12_Xover Back.jpg Model 12 Recap.jpg
 
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So I ended up having someone local tackle it for me about a month and a half ago and just now today finally found a way to fit these in my tiny listening room. Am really happy to finally be able to say that all the drivers are working and they sound amazing.
For some reason when I was listening to a record I was having to drive them really hard to get them to a listenable level and ended up triggering the protection circuit....but tested a cd just now and can barely turn the volume past 2. Guessing somethings going on with the phono stage of my amp or a cleaning and deoxit is necessary.

The 22A’s also got fresh caps and they sound much better than before..... but I don’t think they’ll be getting as much use as the 12’s now.
 
Sealant showed up today and was luckily enough for one coat on all three pairs of speakers with some to spare. Gonna test em tomorrow and hear the difference.

I’m hoping I didn’t overdo it with the sealant as I tried to go as thin as possible. I sure did breath a lot of it inand am still feeling the effects of it...strong stuff o_O
 
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