Ric Harris
Active Member
Thank you for the right thread. Seeing he used bigger voltage caps makes me feel better as I have a lots of those.
KLH model 17 replacing caps and restoring old surrounds (sealing them?)
- Thread starter Ric Harris
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The sealant comes and goes on his listings. I'm guessing he runs out of stock at times. Keep watching his store, it should show back up.
Ric Harris
Active Member
That's good to know I've been experimenting on some ancient no names I have and I think what I did may be okay I'd rather have a known to work rather than I think it should.
GD70
Lunatic Member
Many concoctions have been tried, many woofers ruined. AKer Roy C. developed and tested the sealer and supplies vintage-ar. It's the closest you can get to the factory stuff. Personally, I wouldn't use anything else.
alteclipsch
Super Member
D
Ditto. Don't risk ruining those speakers.
GD70
Lunatic Member
Everything I've learned is from AK, Roy C. reading on line, and diving in! I've learned from the best here, and try to pass along the experiences I've had.
JKent
Active Member
I agree regarding sealant. Use ONLY Roy's formula. Send him a PM and he may have some.
Glenn, I believe you are mistaken about the 2uF caps. Although KLH DID often use double caps where singles would do (making some of the xo's, such as the Model Five, confusing to work on) the Seventeen's double 2uF actually went to 2 points on the switch (see schematic) so you do need to use two 2uF caps.
Also agree about the notoriously bad caps. The black and red Callins or Temple caps leaked, and one in my Seventeens actually exploded!
-Kent
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GD70
Lunatic Member
Hi Kent,
Yes, you are correct, and I meant to say 2-2uf's were needed, must have been late when I typed my response. Sorry to the OpP in case I sent you on the wrong direction!
Glenn
Ric Harris
Active Member
I must have 30 different values in caps but not a 2uF in the bunch so I ordered some. I looked into those Dayton ones first but like most stuff from Parts Express they want too much and take too long. I bought some from a dude I've bought from on ebay before. If they suck I'm out 6 bucks for 6 caps vs 2-3 bucks each plus shipping.
BTW No hurry up jobs on these. I plan on giving the cabinets a light sanding and a couple light coats of tung oil just to give a little more definition and luster to the walnut. I believe they used a semi opaque stain and varnish in one on them originally as they have that muddy brown appearance. They'll be sharp once I'm done. I like knowing that I conserved a pair of venerable speakers. I want the person who gets these to have pair of 17's to enjoy for another 40+ years.
What I'm not keeping them? No, I enjoy the process and moreover take great joy in the feedback I get from people who buy these kinds of things from me. In the case of this pair being goodwill finds it's likely the original owner is in a nursing home or has passed and being their condition is remarkable it means they cared about them. There's a certain Karma element to these if I may say so.
BTW No hurry up jobs on these. I plan on giving the cabinets a light sanding and a couple light coats of tung oil just to give a little more definition and luster to the walnut. I believe they used a semi opaque stain and varnish in one on them originally as they have that muddy brown appearance. They'll be sharp once I'm done. I like knowing that I conserved a pair of venerable speakers. I want the person who gets these to have pair of 17's to enjoy for another 40+ years.
What I'm not keeping them? No, I enjoy the process and moreover take great joy in the feedback I get from people who buy these kinds of things from me. In the case of this pair being goodwill finds it's likely the original owner is in a nursing home or has passed and being their condition is remarkable it means they cared about them. There's a certain Karma element to these if I may say so.
JKent
Active Member
Yeah--PE can be expensive for smaller orders. I like to use Madisound when possible. They have Carli caps, either double up some 1uF or get the 2.2uF. They also have some good mylar 2uF "surplus" caps for 0.35 each! Only drawback is they have very short leads. Shipping is always fast and reasonable.
I didn't remember the "muddy" look on the Seventeens but the Fives and Thirty-Threes I restored were definitely dull and muddy looking. Stripping off the varnish(?) and applying numerous coats of Watco Danish Oil made them look 100% better!
-Kent
I didn't remember the "muddy" look on the Seventeens but the Fives and Thirty-Threes I restored were definitely dull and muddy looking. Stripping off the varnish(?) and applying numerous coats of Watco Danish Oil made them look 100% better!
-Kent
Ric Harris
Active Member
I know Madisound real well. I am a Cheese Head after all. Couldn't pass up the cheese with the Wallace Avatar. As for stripping. Long ago and far away I worked at a unfinished furniture store and at our finishing shop we did lots of stripping as well. Did my fair share I'll tell you. I have in recent years learned the art of veneering and with the latex contact cements I can have a pair re-veneer and have a coat of stain or what have you in a day. There are few speakers that have ever been made that have a veneers that are anything beyond boring walnut. This pair will get a 320 grit light sanding and a couple coats of just plain old minwax tung oil. I have snootier oil finished but it wouldn't enhance them any better than the Minwax. Brown is brown. If they were quarter sawn (flaky) oak or the sort, you'd get that wet duck iridescence thing brought out more by the higher end finishes. As for Watco I never cared for the stuff because it never seems to dry. I know others who love the stuff but we all have our favorites. Also my caps, they came yesterday so I will jump into it post script. There electrocube 2uF 10% 200V for those who are curious. My electronically gifted buddy who works on TV and radio transmitters said there okay. Of coarse he's got a better brand suggestion but he's doesn't have pay for any his stuff. So I'll take okay and run with it.
JKent
Active Member
To each his own. Tung oil is good. I've also used Minwax Antique Oil, which has a little varnish or somethin in it for a slightly harder or glossier finish. AR speakers originally had boiled linseed oil finishes but I think Henry Kloss liked a harder finish on the KLH products.
Did not know about latex based contact cements but I'm tempted to give it a try!
Ric Harris
Active Member
Well the recapping job was easy they've been done already or have they?. The resisters look newer as well. The question is now how long ago or are these just a later version of 17's
....hmm 
They're Temple caps. One a 2x2uF the other is 8uF. The funny thing is I've never seen modern looking cement resisters in 60's stuff. The tweeters sounded good before I cracked them open.
Any thoughts...Yeah I don't solder well thus my lazy self wants to leave them...
....hmm They're Temple caps. One a 2x2uF the other is 8uF. The funny thing is I've never seen modern looking cement resisters in 60's stuff. The tweeters sounded good before I cracked them open.
Any thoughts...Yeah I don't solder well thus my lazy self wants to leave them...
Ric Harris
Active Member
Ric Harris
Active Member
Never mind their crap and have to go
Ric Harris
Active Member
It's a done deal. I added a coil and cap to the driver and oh baby was that major league upgrade. These old KLH's are always so bright by putting a 1,5mH coil and 20uF cap was just enough to give them that little boost for the bass they needed. BTW I use a reference amp for testing so there's no tone bias like some regular components have. I know it's sacrilege to modify the crossovers but better is better.
GD70
Lunatic Member
Let's see some pics of your finished crossovers.
Ric Harris
Active Member
I already have the drivers in and am leery of pulling those screws again. That old PB has only so many ins and outs before they strip then were either drilling more holes or doing T-nuts or the like. However pictured is the prototype. I scavenged the inductor coils from some old definitive crossovers that had blown caps. The other photos are of my old EV's and CV's that I need to find new homes for. The EV's I've had for 35+ years. A concerned father gave them too me if I promised to stop seeing his daughter as he was worried about her virtue. I didn't have the heart to tell him that it had compromised long before I came along. I took those EV's not having the slightest idea what they were besides heavy. I was building speakers with Radio Shack stuff back then but that's back in the stone age. 
