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KLH Model 5 crossover help !!!

HomerJSimpson

HomerJSimpson

Addicted Member
Picked up a set of KLH model 5's today. I thought the tweeters were blown, but when I tested them with a meter, they are both good.

I took a look at the crossover and can't seem to pinpoint where the problem is.

Has anyone else ever had a similar problem with these?

They should sound GREAT when I get the tweeters going.
 
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Replace the capacitors, problem solved. I had "dead tweeters" on my sixes and nearly source new ones until I found out how notoriously bad the capacitors are in them. They are the best vintage speaker (from the 60s) I've heard, bar none.

I'd be shocked if that's not the problem
 
That cap with 2 red leads and one black is actually 2 separate caps built into one. Replace it with 2 - 4 mfd. caps. There is also an additional 4 - mfd. cap and a 3 - mfd. cap in the tweeter circuit which must be replaced.

There is a single 16 mfd. cap in the midrange circuit which also must be replaced.

This is not the simplest crossover to access but the replacement of ALL caps will reward you with sound from one of the the best bookshelf AS designs ever. The original caps are either way out of spec or just plain open.

My personal recommendation is Solen caps all the way.

Dave
 
What are those things ?

Fast_Eddie said:
Not familiar with them Homer, but are those L Pads or Pots in there? If so, that's a likely candidate.
Click to expand...

The KLH model 5 has 2 three position switches marked normal-high-low-----one for the midrange and one for the tweeter.
L-pads or pots are not used in the model 5. They seldom go bad but a good squirt of contact cleaner/ lube wiil make them work smoother and eliminate any static when switching.

Dave :thmbsp:
 
Tafsound said:
That cap with 2 red leads and one black is actually 2 separate caps built into one. Replace it with 2 - 4 mfd. caps. There is also an additional 4 - mfd. cap and a 3 - mfd. cap in the tweeter circuit which must be replaced.

There is a single 16 mfd. cap in the midrange circuit which also must be replaced.

This is not the simplest crossover to access but the replacement of ALL caps will reward you with sound from one of the the best bookshelf AS designs ever. The original caps are either way out of spec or just plain open.

My personal recommendation is Solen caps all the way.

Dave
Click to expand...

Yet another David confirming this Dave's suggestions. As I write this, I'm listening to a set of Model 5 being driven by a 250 wpc amp. They're singing like there's no tomorrow, too. I, too, used Solens in the crossover. Its too easy just to swap all of them out and be done with it.

When you pull the woofers to get to the backs of the cabinets, just go ahead and pull the whole crossover unit off and work on them on your bench/table. On the switches, mine had developed a lot of oxidation on the detents which I cured with a small amount of white grease after cleaning them well to remove the old, hardened grease.

Be aware that there were 2 versions of the crossovers. The ones with point-to-point wiring with terminal strips will have developed oxidation on the rivets that serve to provide ground returns back to the Ground terminal. Solder a wire to connect these directly to that big lug to make sure this will not affect performance - and they will if they're in bad shape.

While you've got the drivers out, redope the cloth surrounds, too. There have been discussions here on how this is done. Oh, and pay attention to those foam seals on the crossover both around the switches and the perimeter of the back panel. This box needs to be well-sealed to operate correctly.

Cheers,

David
 
I replaced the 2X4 caps with some 4.7's that I had laying around. This did fix the tweeter problem. :yes:

These have a great sound to them, I am pleasantly surprised! :thmbsp:

I wonder how these would sound STACKED....?:scratch2:
 
Yep, I wondered the same question on the stacking. I remember Advents done that way in the 70s. These are one tough set of speakers, too. I've been pumping them with the mighty Hafler P500 all evening and they'll just stand right up to it.

Glad yours are singing, too.

Cheers,

David
 
Tafsound said:
That cap with 2 red leads and one black is actually 2 separate caps built into one. Replace it with 2 - 4 mfd. caps. There is also an additional 4 - mfd. cap and a 3 - mfd. cap in the tweeter circuit which must be replaced.

There is a single 16 mfd. cap in the midrange circuit which also must be replaced.

This is not the simplest crossover to access but the replacement of ALL caps will reward you with sound from one of the the best bookshelf AS designs ever. The original caps are either way out of spec or just plain open.

My personal recommendation is Solen caps all the way.

Dave
Click to expand...

Rich, this gentleman knows and loves KLH speakers as much as anyone on this board. If you want to get the most out of these speakers (and you should want to), pay attention.
 
you havent really driven 250 watts RMS into them right?I'm told max.wattage for these was 75W RMS.100Wpeak. 86DB.@1 watt from one meter. 8ohm.
 
No, I've got a 250wpc amp - a Hafler P500 with lots of mods, actually - pushing them but that doesn't mean I'm driving it to the hilt at all. It _will_ grab the woofers and get their attention for sure. Essentially, this means that peaks in the music will get full power but that's not really going to kill rhe drivers unless I get mindless about abusing them. I do have the amp fused as if it were a 100wpc amp just for safety if I do something dumb like trip over an input cable with the wine.....

You are correct that they will get loud but it does take more power to get them going than the Altec 604s I typically use. Those guys are still in storage until the new house is built - and they take up a lot more room.

Cheers,

David
 
dshoaf said:
No, I've got a 250wpc amp - a Hafler P500 with lots of mods, actually - pushing them but that doesn't mean I'm driving it to the hilt at all. It _will_ grab the woofers and get their attention for sure. Essentially, this means that peaks in the music will get full power but that's not really going to kill rhe drivers unless I get mindless about abusing them. I do have the amp fused as if it were a 100wpc amp just for safety if I do something dumb like trip over an input cable with the wine.....

You are correct that they will get loud but it does take more power to get them going than the Altec 604s I typically use. Those guys are still in storage until the new house is built - and they take up a lot more room.

Cheers,

David
Click to expand...
Ok,just checkin,because that kind of power has the abillity to smoke coils in most speakers.I have modle 5's,6's and 23's.I love them all but they don't take big power and as good as they sound it takes a few watts to drive them right but not too much.moderation is key with Kloss speakers.
 
MarkAnderson said:
Rich, this gentleman knows and loves KLH speakers as much as anyone on this board. If you want to get the most out of these speakers (and you should want to), pay attention.
Click to expand...

I will recap these as mentioned. I just wanted to hear what these would sound like with the tweets working. Just a temp fix.
 
I currently own KLH: fours, fives, sixes, & seventeens. All have been in storage for about 15/20 years. I would like to refurbish them all kinda production line.

Can you guys tell me where you have been buying your caps? Is Solen the only/best way to go?

What about instructions & product for doping the woofers.
Should I arbitrarily re-dope all of them, or only the ones that rebound too quickly. How thick? How wide? What should I apply it with? In a service bulletin from KLH about 1970, they recommended a 1" paint brush.

It sounds like the product that was originally used is no longer available. Various speaker re-builders have recommended Elmer's Rubber Cement (just a paper thin coating) or Aleene's Tacky Glue (available @ Michael's craft stores or art supply shops). It all sounds a little too scary to me!

Also have 2# open coil mid-ranges from my FIVEs. They were also used in ELEVENS, TWELVES, & FIFTEENS. Also used as a full range in 8 & 21 table radios. Anybody want to sell them to me? What about having my blown out ones rebuilt? Would this be a better way to go?

There seems to be very little information on FOURs. Anyone have any? There doesn't appear to be any way to service these.?

Plz help,
Weater
 
"There seems to be very little information on FOURs. Anyone have any? There doesn't appear to be any way to service these.?"

The Fours are fairly rare and completely sealed. All drivers are epoxied into the front baffle, the grills are glued on and the back is sealed. If you need to access them cut an angled square hole in the back. Do not go more than half way up from the bottom because you will cut the crossbrace. Once in you can replace/repair the crossover but I think the drivers are there to stay.
 
KLH FOURs

Do you have any historical information such as how long of a run, beginning/end of production, original cost, etc.

Thanks,
Weater

P.S. Need 2# 4.5 midranges for my FIVES
 
weater said:
Do you have any historical information such as how long of a run, beginning/end of production, original cost, etc.

Thanks,
Weater

P.S. Need 2# 4.5 midranges for my FIVES
Click to expand...

Not really. Mine were made in June, 1964 which was near the end of their production run because Singer bought KLH in 1964. Original cost was $224. each.
 
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