KLH Model Thirty coming my way

[alteclipsch]

I've made a deal on a pair of KLH Model Thirty speakers, will pick them up in the next few days. From the research I've done on AK, CSP, and others, they have the same drivers as the Six, except in cabinets only 2/3 as deep. Also, they have groovy rustic/psychedelic grill cloth in original condition (harkens me back to my young adulthood).

Anyhow, the woofers have that hot-cross bun pattern of stuff on the cones, similar to that in some other KLH models; I'm sort of assuming it's to add a bit more mass to compensate for the volume reduction. I also read they may or may not have a true crossover, maybe only a single capacitor while the woofer is allowed full range.

Does anyone out there have a pair of these to help verify the story behind the Thirty?

Here's a shot of a Thirty woofer lifted from an AK post:

 

[alteclipsch]

No one has these? Must not be very common...

 

[Lavane]

No one has these? Must not be very common...

I had a pair of model 30 somethings years ago. Mine were 4 ohm with an 8" woofer with the same stuff on them with the metal mesh over over the tweeter.

 

[alteclipsch]

I had a pair of model 30 somethings years ago. Mine were 4 ohm with an 8" woofer with the same stuff on them with the metal mesh over over the tweeter.

That really sounds like a Model Thirty Two, I had a couple of pairs of them, still have an 8" woofer from one. They had a CTS tweeter(or facsimile) under that wire mesh/fiberglass disk. Fun speakers, good sound for their size and price point. But where are the Thirty users?!

 

[Tim D]

Never seen a thirty in the wild. Probably uncommon. I had a few thirty two's pass through. The thirty two's are walnut veneer and are quite small in size. The thirty one's are similar to thirty two's but with vinyl covering and I don't have experience with the thirty's.

 

[alteclipsch]

Picking up the Thirties today, will post photos inside and out the next few days.

 

[nnicola]

Make sure the cloth woofer surrounds are not porous and sealed with the correct substance. You can check this by gently pushing the woofer in towards the cabinet. If it returns to the original position gradually, about a second later, the cabinets are sealed and airtight. If the woofer bounces back immediately, the cabinet is not sealed and could be caused by the cloth surrounds leaking air. The Model Thirty is an acoustic suspension design and if the cabinet is not airtight the bass will be compromised and the speakers will never sound as good as they should.

There is a store on eBay called “VINTAGE-AR” that sells the correct sealing solution. The seller mixes it based on the original KLH formulation. Don’t use anything but this stuff to seal the woofers. There are lots of threads out there about people using caulk or some other junk to seal the cloth surrounds but they have ruined their speakers for the long haul. Anything else will eventually harden and hinder the woofers surrounds ability to move freely.

I don’t have the KLH Model Thirty, but I do have the Model Six and the Model Seventeen. I like them both, but the Model Six uses the exact same drivers as the Thirty and it is one of my favorite speakers.

Here are a couple of links with info on KLH speakers:

http://www.aphenos.net/electronics/speakers/klh/all_klh.htm

http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/

You should also replace the capacitors in the crossover if that was not done already by any previous owners. Any 50 year old capacitor probably is past its service life, but Henry Kloss was notorious for using really cheap capacitors in the KLH speakers that regularly failed and leaked many years ago. The “classic speaker pages” link should have info or a schematic for the Thirty crossover.

Good luck with your Model Thirty speakers!

 

[Tim D]

Nicola,

One small correction.

The vintage_ar seller doesn't mix the concoction. Their supplier is AK member "RoyC". You can pm him if you can't find it from vintage_ar. He also hangs out on the classic speaker pages (CSP) website. I won't use any other product as it is the only one that continually gets praise and is regularly used by members of the two communities (AK and CSP).

Btw, it would be nice if OP could post a cross-over schematic since these are rare. There is likely no schematic on the web for them. It should be a simple diagram if there is no switch or pot on the back of the speaker. Any resistor, cap and inductor values would be important if the OP decides to do that nice thing.

 

[alteclipsch]

Make sure the cloth woofer surrounds are not porous and sealed with the correct substance. You can check this by gently pushing the woofer in towards the cabinet. If it returns to the original position gradually, about a second later, the cabinets are sealed and airtight. If the woofer bounces back immediately, the cabinet is not sealed and could be caused by the cloth surrounds leaking air. The Model Thirty is an acoustic suspension design and if the cabinet is not airtight the bass will be compromised and the speakers will never sound as good as they should.

There is a store on eBay called “VINTAGE-AR” that sells the correct sealing solution. The seller mixes it based on the original KLH formulation. Don’t use anything but this stuff to seal the woofers. There are lots of threads out there about people using caulk or some other junk to seal the cloth surrounds but they have ruined their speakers for the long haul. Anything else will eventually harden and hinder the woofers surrounds ability to move freely.

I don’t have the KLH Model Thirty, but I do have the Model Six and the Model Seventeen. I like them both, but the Model Six uses the exact same drivers as the Thirty and it is one of my favorite speakers.

Here are a couple of links with info on KLH speakers:

http://www.aphenos.net/electronics/speakers/klh/all_klh.htm

http://www.classicspeakerpages.net/

You should also replace the capacitors in the crossover if that was not done already by any previous owners. Any 50 year old capacitor probably is past its service life, but Henry Kloss was notorious for using really cheap capacitors in the KLH speakers that regularly failed and leaked many years ago. The “classic speaker pages” link should have info or a schematic for the Thirty crossover.

Good luck with your Model Thirty speakers!

This will be about my 20th adventure with KLH/AR speakers, doing exactly what you describe above. I've never seen one that didn't need caps and dope. I'm also testing them before I buy. Should be fun!

 

[alteclipsch]

Nicola,

One small correction.

The vintage_ar seller doesn't mix the concoction. Their supplier is AK member "RoyC". You can pm him if you can't find it from vintage_ar. He also hangs out on the classic speaker pages (CSP) website. I won't use any other product as it is the only one that continually gets praise and is regularly used by members of the two communities (AK and CSP).

Btw, it would be nice if OP could post a cross-over schematic since these are rare. There is likely no schematic on the web for them. It should be a simple diagram if there is no switch or pot on the back of the speaker. Any resistor, cap and inductor values would be important if the OP decides to do that nice thing.

I already have RoyC's dope. And I've searched high and low for a schematic with no success. I did read in one post that there is one capacitor and no inductor or resistors (hard to believe, but these are early in the Singer cost cutting era), the woofer supposedly works wide open. There are no switches. Time will tell, I'll post everything I find.

 

[Tim D]

The KLH 17's and 20's also ran the woofer free with no low-pass filter/cross-over. A cost-cutting strategy probably although I haven't heard any complaints. The lack of a low-pass filter/cross-over for the woofer would have the woofer trying to reproduce higher frequencies into the "break up region" of the woofer. Not ideal, but again I've heard no complaints regarding the 17's and 20's.

 

[anytune]

I've owned a set of Model Thirties for several years. Bought them at a now-closed thrift store for $16. They have the groovy rainbow grill covers and are very pleasant sounding. As mentioned, the Model Thirty is essentially a thinner version of the Model Six (I own both). Same woofers; cabinets are the same width at 12 3/4 inches. The Model Thirty is slightly shorter: 22 3/4 inches tall versus 23 1/2, and are 4 inches thinner at only 8 inches deep. In my listening, I have not noticed them lacking for bass.
Besides narrower cabinet depth, the Model Thirty has RCA speaker terminals. They were sold as part of all-in-system in the early 1970s when Singer owned KLH (post- Henry Kloss era). I had problems with one of the RCA connectors which cut out intermittently. So I switched them out to bare wire connections and this works better. You may want to do the same. IMO, the Model Thirties are excellent speakers I think you will enjoy.

 

[alteclipsch]

The KLH 17's and 20's also ran the woofer free with no low-pass filter/cross-over. A cost-cutting strategy probably although I haven't heard any complaints. The lack of a low-pass filter/cross-over for the woofer would have the woofer trying to reproduce higher frequencies into the "break up region" of the woofer. Not ideal, but again I've heard no complaints regarding the 17's and 20's.

I could swear my Seventeens have inductors but I'll take your word for it, I'd have to take one apart and look. Not gonna happen, too many projects!

 

[alteclipsch]

I've owned a set of Model Thirties for several years. Bought them at a now-closed thrift store for $16. They have the groovy rainbow grill covers and are very pleasant sounding. As mentioned, the Model Thirty is essentially a thinner version of the Model Six (I own both). Same woofers; cabinets are the same width at 12 3/4 inches. The Model Thirty is slightly shorter: 22 3/4 inches tall versus 23 1/2, and are 4 inches thinner at only 8 inches deep. In my listening, I have not noticed them lacking for bass.
Besides narrower cabinet depth, the Model Thirty has RCA speaker terminals. They were sold as part of all-in-system in the early 1970s when Singer owned KLH (post- Henry Kloss era). I had problems with one of the RCA connectors which cut out intermittently. So I switched them out to bare wire connections and this works better. You may want to do the same. IMO, the Model Thirties are excellent speakers I think you will enjoy.

I'm paying a lot more than that but I can't help myself, it adds a pair I've never seen to my Fives, Twenty Threes, and Seventeens. And I'm intrigued by the thought of having what's essentially skinny Sixes. My Sixes have been gone for 25 years or I'd do an A/B.

Do yours have the crisscross pattern on the cones?

 

[alteclipsch]

Well, the seller backed out, so I'll never know. He gave them to his grandson, so at least they go to an upcoming generation, nice thing to do. Back to the hunt...

 

[audiojones]

Aw shucks, I really wanted to see those. Oh well, hope his grandson knows what they are and treats them well!

 

[anytune]

Yes, mine have the hot-cross buns cones. Sorry to hear you missed out. Maybe at some point, the grandson will offer them up. Wouldn't hurt to leave him your phone number.

 

[alteclipsch]

Yes, mine have the hot-cross buns cones. Sorry to hear you missed out. Maybe at some point, the grandson will offer them up. Wouldn't hurt to leave him your phone number.

Yes, they have my contact info, it would've been fun to do their maintenance and listen to them compared to my other KLHs. He was a really pleasant fellow to discuss with, so not a big deal.

 

[RunnerInSTL]

Bummed to read that this thread ended abruptly due to the seller backing out.

I bought a pair of 30s on Friday at a local antique mall—the type with booths from various sellers. I don’t know where this guy sources his speakers from, but he always seems to have something interesting. He had a pair of 33s and 30s, and the 30 sounded better to me.

Mine also has the cool striped grill cloth in snag-free condition but with a couple stains I’m working on. You can see a significant water stain on one of the grills in the attached picture. There’s no sign of water damage to the cabinet.



They sound absolutely wonderful paired with my Sherwood S-9100a.


I haven’t opened them up to check the crossover network. I’ll eventually get to it but it’s not a priority right now.

 

[RunnerInSTL]

I should also add that someone had replaced the RCA jacks with spring clip terminals. I’m considering replacing those with binding posts for convenience. If I want to swap speakers between systems, plugging banana plugs in would make it simple.