MR85 vs. MR88

[JWJW]

From just an AM/FM standpoint, is the MR88 worth the extra $$$$? I will not be using XM and have no interest in HD radio. Is the MR88 a better AM/FM tuner then the MR85? I can obtain the MR88 for $1,000 more. I'm having a problem justifying the extra $1,000.

Your thoughts and input please!

 

[dolstein]

From what I've heard, the MR88 is better than the MR85 for AM and FM (most likely due to DSP technology not included in the MR85). But is it $1000 better? Hard to say. If you don't listen to a lot of radio broadcasts but want a McIntosh branded tuner, you'd probably be better off getting a used model at a substantial savings over the MR88.

 

[jlovda]

I do not have "golden ears" that can hear differences in AC line cords. But I am an EE that likes to look at tuner performance specs. According to Mcintosh printed specs, the analog FM sensitivity, S/N and THD of the MR88 is very close to the MR85 although there is no listing of MR88 -50dB sensitivity in stereo (the 85 is 35dBf). The MR88 has 10db lower separation than the MR85 (35db vs 45db @ 1kHz). Mcintosh does not provide a large number of analog FM front end specs for the MR88 such as capture ratio, Image, IF, Spurious and Intermodulation rejection (although some of these specs may be irrelavent when processing the signal through a DSP). The only spec where the MR88 seems to really stand above the 85 is adjacent channel selectivity (+/- 200kHz) at 65dB. Mcintosh does not publish a 200kHz number for the MR85. The 'super" numbers for the MR88 really only apply to HD reception.

I own an MR78 and two MR7083's (hiding in an MX118 and MX130).

 

[Victor]

I would go with the MR88. Even though you say you have no interest in the HD radio I bet you end up loving the MR88 playing HD.

I have done a home demo with the MR88 and I used to own a MR85, they both sound fantastic but the MR88 is a step up. One of my friends ended up buying the MR88, he is a big radio fan and used a MR71 before the MR88. He was just like you and said he would only listen to the analog FM broadcast on the MR88, it took him about a day to hear how much better the digital HD FM broadcast sounds. Now he only listens to the HD.

 

[ron-c]

MR88 is the one that will make you forget about MR85. JW, where are you located, in a major or minor FM market?

Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[Butchthetiger]

I would go with the MR88. Even though you say you have no interest in the HD radio I bet you end up loving the MR88 playing HD.

I have done a home demo with the MR88 and I used to own a MR85, they both sound fantastic but the MR88 is a step up. One of my friends ended up buying the MR88, he is a big radio fan and used a MR71 before the MR88. He was just like you and said he would only listen to the analog FM broadcast on the MR88, it took him about a day to hear how much better the digital HD FM broadcast sounds. Now he only listens to the HD.

I would too if we had HD radio in Canada. Love my MR-71 but find myself listening to online radio rather than the one classical channel in Canada, CBC Radio which has lost it's way.

Butch

 

[JWJW]

Ron-c,
I'm in South Bend, IN

 

[ron-c]

With the MR88 you should be able to receive all of the Chicago stations most of which will be HD. That makes it a simple choice.

Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[MX117.MC7150]

Except, the OP stated that he is not interested in HD radio (which, hopefully, will soon be gone). Go with an MR67/71 for tubes, or MR73/74 for older style knobs and MR75-80 for newer style knobs. All are excellent performers if properly aligned and tuned up.

 

[waxman]

The MR88 have great looks! Bus as far as I know we in Sweden dont have XM nor HD channels :/ So I think I buy the 85...

 

[JWJW]

Ron-C,
With the MR85, I couldn't pick up Chicago stations? Is the MR88 "more sensitive" on FM and AM?
Thank you again for the input!

 

[ron-c]

JW, do you use an outdoor antenna? MR88 should pull way over 100 miles out in the flatlands of the Midwest.
HD radio is going to be with us for quite some time and it offers a lot of sonic improvements over analog when using MR88. This is not a $99.00 Sony radio.

Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[MX117.MC7150]

JW, do you use an outdoor antenna? MR88 should pull way over 100 miles out in the flatlands of the Midwest.
HD radio is going to be with us for quite some time and it offers a lot of sonic improvements over analog when using MR88. This is not a $99.00 Sony radio.

Thanks,
Ron-C

As most dealers will not stock an MR88, why don't you start a demo program where we can pay the shipping each way and demo an MR88 for a couple of weeks. If we don't care for, we return for full credit, less shipping?

 

[ron-c]

Dealers that demonstrate MR88 seem to be haveing a lot of success with it. Why wouldn't your dealer stock MR88?

Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[jlovda]

Except, the OP stated that he is not interested in HD radio (which, hopefully, will soon be gone). Go with an MR67/71 for tubes, or MR73/74 for older style knobs and MR75-80 for newer style knobs. All are excellent performers if properly aligned and tuned up.

All my equipment is pre-1995 so this is pure speculation but the MR85-88 would be compatible with current wireless remote controls. The MR75-80 have no remote control capability. Also, when you state "MR75-80," are you including the MR77-78 in between?

I might make some people angry but being my 60's and having gone through the "super-tuner wars" of the 70's and 80's, I don't think ANYONE currently, including Mcintosh, makes analog tuners as good as those from that era.

 

[ron-c]

I have a perfect MR78, 10B and others. I prefer the MR88 since I get many more stations, super sound, etc. I don't have to remember back then.
MR88 comes with a remote control that can also control other McIntosh components.

Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[JWJW]

Ron-C,
I'll be using just a standard indoor antenna.
Purely from a "spec standpoint," is the MR88 THAT much better then the MR85 for AM/FM?
Thanks!

 

[ron-c]

JW, you will always be limited with an indoor antenna regardless of which model you use. See antennaweb.org to get a better idea of what antenna you will need in your location. Using an HD-TV/FM antenna is the best bang for the buck. Under $100 for the whole thing is typical.
In some ways MR88 measures worse and better than our other tuners. In use MR88's DSP tuner suppresses multipath and other nasties so well that the signal is perceived as clearer than an analog design.
Thanks,
Ron-C

 

[JWJW]

Thank you Ron!
I have a difficult decision to make for sure....

 

[jlovda]

I have a perfect MR78, 10B and others. I prefer the MR88 since I get many more stations, super sound, etc. I don't have to remember back then.
Thanks,
Ron-C

Ron-C:
I am not trying to knock the MR88 because I have never seen one in person or heard one. I couldn't afford one anyway. Being an acoustical engineer by training I dealt with physics and quantitative measurements. How does the unit get "many more stations" if the published sensitivity specs show it to have generally similar or worse numbers (analog mode) than, say, an MR7083? If it is extracting a really weak signal out of noise with the DSP (like receiving space probe signals from Saturn), the -50db sensitivity or S/N should be spectacular, like 90db -100db. The digital processor is just a black box function like the RF, Mixer, IF and Detector combination in an analog tuner. The difference between what goes into the box and what comes out should be measurable and comparable.

I would think capture ratio would have some relationship to multipath performance since a multipath bounced signal off tall metropolitan buildings would act something like a separate signal coming from another direction. I do understand that a multipath signal would have the same information as the direct signal so doing an autocorrelation in the DSP could detect the relationship and cancel the second one. If there is no quantitative method of describing the MR88s superior multipath performance, the only way to verify it would be to have the unit located at the intended listening location with the intended antenna. A dealer's showroom is irrelavent.

Both the MR85 and the MR88 are current models shown on the company's website. Why are some specs like capture ratio or -50db stereo sensitivity left out of the MR88 spec list? I assume the engineering dept. has them. Except for HD reception, the Mac website never really tells the customer why he/she should spend a $1000 more to get the 88 over the 85 or what advantages digital processing provides. It is sort of left to listening tests at the dealer.

You can take this all with a grain of salt. I am also one of the people that cannot tell the difference between the sound of a tube or solid state amp with roughly equivalent specs.