[NHT SuperZero crossover mod] can you use 5.1uF capacitor instead of 5uF?

[Kreshna]

Found an interesting crossover modding suggestion for NHT SuperZero:

I suggested all of the owner to modify this speaker:-

1.change the wire with another good quality wire,i use TARA LAB 8N multi strand(crossover to treble & bass speakers, solid core 8N copper wire(from input to crossover) they are not costly,in H.K. HK$10-12 per feet.(total 5 ft)

2.only change the capacitors of the crossover with SOLEN CAP from france(the new type) the superzero use 5uF & 10uF each per one,& no need to replace the resistor & coil (costly about HKD210) you should place the capacitors on the soldering parts of the circuit board because the place was not enough if you soldering on the front side of the circuit board.

Afterall,the superzero will actually sound like those high end speakers! i never heard such silky midrange & treble! the soundstage will become very very 3D!​

Okay. Problem is, I just cannot find 5uF Solen capacitor at all, only 5.1uF Solen capacitor. So is it okay to use 5.1uF capacitor instead of 5uF? What the worst could happen?

 

[BillWojo]

You will be fine. Most caps are plus or minus 10 percent anyway. Just stay at or above the recommended voltage rating.

BillWojo

 

[Kreshna]

You will be fine. Most caps are plus or minus 10 percent anyway. Just stay at or above the recommended voltage rating.

BillWojo

Thank you, Bill.

Also, the user mentioned TARA LAB 8N multi strand and TARA LAB 8N solid copper core, which is said to be about HK $12 per feet (which is about US $1.5 per feet). Problem is, such models don't seem to exist. Most Tara Labs speaker wires I found on ebay are more expensive than the SuperZero itself.

So, what speaker wires would you suggest?

 

[elnaldo]

I'd read this article by Roger Russell, "Director of Acoustic Research at McIntosh Laboratory, Inc. and the originator of
McIntosh Loudspeakers", and save your money:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

 

[Kreshna]

I'd read this article by Roger Russell, "Director of Acoustic Research at McIntosh Laboratory, Inc. and the originator of
McIntosh Loudspeakers", and save your money:

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm

Sorry for the late reply, I took my time to read the article. Great article, thanks!

How about capacitors? Do certain capacitors sound better than the others? Or is it the same myth as audio cables?

 

[elnaldo]

Capacitors,

Sorry for the late reply, I took my time to read the article. Great article, thanks!

How about capacitors? Do certain capacitors sound better than the others? Or is it the same myth as audio cables?

Capacitors, at audio freqs "should" be similar, but the fact is that people can hear differences between some capacitors in some applications, with high definition audio systems. Too much information about this tests on the web.

I usually use budget good quality caps, like Clarity Caps (PX), Epcos film caps, never tried extremely expensive capacitors to compare.

The Solen caps you mentioned are fine, but not the only capacitor that will work, If you find difficult to find them locally, or too expensive shipping costs when buying from Internet, you can try another film capacitor easier to find. Motor run capacitors are usually good quality, not expensive, and easily sourced. My suggestion, try a capacitor you can find locally, and then decide if you want to spend more buying from Internet. I really don't know your budget and the cost of those speakers (perhaps you are tweaking a $$$$$$ speaker, and I'm talking about saving 2$). On forums like this you have mixed people with thousands of $$ equipment and users with budget systems and little money .

 

[Kreshna]

Capacitors,


Capacitors, at audio freqs "should" be similar, but the fact is that people can hear differences between some capacitors in some applications, with high definition audio systems. Too much information about this tests on the web.

I usually use budget good quality caps, like Clarity Caps (PX), Epcos film caps, never tried extremely expensive capacitors to compare.

The Solen caps you mentioned are fine, but not the only capacitor that will work, If you find difficult to find them locally, or too expensive shipping costs when buying from Internet, you can try another film capacitor easier to find. Motor run capacitors are usually good quality, not expensive, and easily sourced. My suggestion, try a capacitor you can find locally, and then decide if you want to spend more buying from Internet. I really don't know your budget and the cost of those speakers (perhaps you are tweaking a $$$$$$ speaker, and I'm talking about saving 2$). On forums like this you have mixed people with thousands of $$ equipment and users with budget systems and little money .

I have just become interested in Clarity Caps myself, although it is actually ESA models instead of PX you've mentioned. The reason is this:

Unlike the Wima MKP10 that has a dry and honest treble, the ESA has an airy treble and high frequency sparkle that highlights the decay of cymbals and high hats, and "enhances" the sense of acoustic space in recordings.​

You see, NHT SuperZero has midrange to die for, but I miss the airy, shimmering cymbals of JBL titanium dome tweeter. I'm looking for capacitors that can make the SuperZero's treble sound closer to that of JBL 120Ti or L20T. This is one of those cases where I'd choose euphony over accuracy.

 

[elnaldo]

I don't think a capacitor will make a tweeter to emit sounds it can't. I mentioned Clarity Caps PX because they are not so expensive.

Personally, I prefer a textile dome to a titanium dome, but that's just my experience and taste.

In this link, https://www.parts-express.com/nht-s...te-with-2-way-crossover-1300-4000-hz--269-603
I see the NHT uses regular electrolytic capacitors. I think any polypropylene film cap will be an improvement over those ones. I'd try some motor run capacitor you find locally as a 1st upgrade, to see if you hear a difference, and if you are not satisfied, try a more expensive capacitor. But I wouldn't expect a miracle to happen just replacing a capacitor. The test you linked is a different application, it's a preamp output, not a speaker crossover.

** I mean this kind of capacitors, polypropylene film, rated 250 or 450V AC:
https://www.indiamart.com/proddetail/motor-run-capacitors-1425811233.html NO AFFILIATION.

 

[rothwellaudio]

I wouldn't expect a miracle to happen just replacing a capacitor.

I agree. There are lots of claims on the internet of simple modifications to a range of equipment that totally transform the sound and turns a sow's ear into a silk purse. I take them with a pinch of salt.

 

[Kreshna]

I don't think a capacitor will make a tweeter to emit sounds it can't. I mentioned Clarity Caps PX because they are not so expensive.

I understand. I just wonder if SuperZero's tweeter is somewhat held back by its crossover's electrolytic capacitors. They may not sound exactly like JBL titanium dome tweeter (035Ti, 044Ti, etc), but I wonder if capacitor changes would make them sound airier and/or cleaner than it is.

Personally, I prefer a textile dome to a titanium dome, but that's just my experience and taste.

What kind of treble sounds do you like?

Based on my experience, JBL titanium dome tweeter sound crisp and bright, but very clean (although the degree of cleanliness depends on amplifier). Cymbals and hi-hats sound very airy. So far, I haven't heard other speakers that can touch it. I'm sure Yamaha NS-1000's beryllium dome tweeter sound much better, but I haven't be able to acquire them.

In this link, https://www.parts-express.com/nht-s...te-with-2-way-crossover-1300-4000-hz--269-603
I see the NHT uses regular electrolytic capacitors. I think any polypropylene film cap will be an improvement over those ones. I'd try some motor run capacitor you find locally as a 1st upgrade, to see if you hear a difference, and if you are not satisfied, try a more expensive capacitor. But I wouldn't expect a miracle to happen just replacing a capacitor. The test you linked is a different application, it's a preamp output, not a speaker crossover.

Mea culpa, I Googled using Android phone, so I missed the preamp part. Nonetheless, is component difference (capacitor, etc) more audible in line-level signal than speaker-level signal?

** I mean this kind of capacitors, polypropylene film, rated 250 or 450V AC:
https://www.indiamart.com/proddetail/motor-run-capacitors-1425811233.html NO AFFILIATION.

Thank you. I'll post the result after I'm done.

I agree. There are lots of claims on the internet of simple modifications to a range of equipment that totally transform the sound and turns a sow's ear into a silk purse. I take them with a pinch of salt.

Indeed, but I'm curious nonetheless.

 

[elnaldo]

I think at this point you need to buy some capacitors and try by yourself.

the 2 tweeters I usually listen are : Infinity EMIT tweeters in my main speakers, and Audax HD100-D25 textile dome in my test speakers, both are very fine tweeters, and every time I test some speaker with titanium domes, I say instantly "oughhh . ugly" and turn the volume down. but there are hundreds of different tweeters around.

I fix professional audio gear down here, and I fix many kind of studio monitors, expensive and cheap, and most of them use textile domes. A good quality textile dome sounds very natural and pleasant. The berillium inverted domes in the Focal series are very nice too.

Try a film capacitor in your speakers and post back. Probably the output will be a bit higher since ESR is lower in the film capacitor. Some people add a couple of ohms in series with the film capacitor, 1 to 3 ohms I'd say, to simulate the resistance of the electrolytic cap. But that's a second step, only if you find the tweeter too bright.

 

[Kreshna]

I think at this point you need to buy some capacitors and try by yourself.

the 2 tweeters I usually listen are : Infinity EMIT tweeters in my main speakers, and Audax HD100-D25 textile dome in my test speakers, both are very fine tweeters, and every time I test some speaker with titanium domes, I say instantly "oughhh . ugly" and turn the volume down. but there are hundreds of different tweeters around.

I fix professional audio gear down here, and I fix many kind of studio monitors, expensive and cheap, and most of them use textile domes. A good quality textile dome sounds very natural and pleasant. The berillium inverted domes in the Focal series are very nice too.

Indeed. That stirs my curiosity: does NHT SuperZero's tweeter is being held back by its default caps? That's why I'm interested to recap.

Try a film capacitor in your speakers and post back. Probably the output will be a bit higher since ESR is lower in the film capacitor. Some people add a couple of ohms in series with the film capacitor, 1 to 3 ohms I'd say, to simulate the resistance of the electrolytic cap. But that's a second step, only if you find the tweeter too bright.

Thank you.

Some capacitors are really big, probably too big to fit inside the SuperZero's smallish enclosure. I'll try mockup first, some local sellers here have 30mm diameter mockup cylinders for sale. I'll try them first, then I try the capacitors. Then I'll post the result.

Anyway, if I use bigger voltage rating, would it help increasing the SuperZero's power handling capacity?

 

[datafone]

You could mock up some, using PVC piping of similar diameters and cut to length.

I'm in the other camp where materials can make a difference, both conductors and dielectrics, be they cable or caps.

Edit: with voltage ratings, you are good between 100v and 200v, depending how much they are being fed. Higher won't hurt, but likely won't make any difference in power handling, that job is largely to do with the XO design.
I'm not familiar with the speakers.

 

[elnaldo]

The Voice Coil wire is the weakest part in the speaker, so usually that's what limits the power handling, the woofer VC is what use to burn when you exceed the power rating.

If a capacitor is too large you can glue it to the bottom of the cabinet and run wires to the PCB.

I'd replace just the tweeter capacitor with any polipropylene film cap you can get easily and see if you hear some improvements.

As said, I wouldn't expect some magic to happen, perhaps some more detail, or perhaps no difference. It depends on how good-bad the actual capacitor is.

 

[datafone]

There is no magic, only reality

 

[Kreshna]

Update: so I have replaced the caps with Solen caps, 4.7uF and 8.2uF, respectively. I noticed the sound becomes cleaner. Not night and day, but quite noticeable.

My complain about SuperZero's soft dome tweeter is that it sounds more grainy and less clean than JBL L20T's (and 120Ti's) titanium dome tweeter. I cannot say the SuperZero's tweeter now sound as clean (and less grainy) as JBL titanium dome tweeter, but the improvement is noticeable.

My wife, who is not an audiophile, said the SuperZeros now sound cleaner and smoother. I didn't tell her about capacitor replacement though, I just asked her, "do the speakers sound different?"

 

[Blue Shadow]

Glad there were improvements with the changes you did. Women hear better than men in general so it is nice to get a confirmation for an unbiased source. Now you can both enjoy the speakers more than before.

 

[Kreshna]

Glad there were improvements with the changes you did. Women hear better than men in general so it is nice to get a confirmation for an unbiased source. Now you can both enjoy the speakers more than before.

Indeed.

Unlike Musicman here, I wouldn't say Solen caps give the SuperZeros "a very 3D soundstage," because the speakers already have very 3D soundstage, even with the old caps.

I wouldn't say Solen caps make the SuperZeros sound like "those high end speakers," because I'm not really sure what does subjective phrase really mean.

However, I could say that Solen caps make the SuperZeros sound cleaner and less grainy, and that's quite noticeable, that even my wife noticed it.

See, the SuperZeros have unparalleled clarity, especially vocals. But their highs can also sound grainy --especially with lesser amplifiers-- that it could be fatiguing to listen to in the long run. The treble sounds grainy when driven by Yamaha RX-V663. The treble sounds less grainy with Sansui AU-7900, but still grainy nonetheless, and still fatiguing in the long run. With Solen caps, the grain disappear, and the treble become more 'liquid' and clean.

Anyway, is that true women hear better than men? But then why audiophiles are mostly males?

 

[Blue Shadow]

Anyway, is that true women hear better than men? But then why audiophiles are mostly males

Women have hearing tuned to listening to children and small changes. Men like gear, knobs, switches, buttons, dials, tire smoke, horsepower, shutter speeds, shiny functional metal making up the stereo, cars/trucks, watches and cameras. Women don't generally seek out high volume the way the male does, thereby saving their hearing from damage...oh guys like loud guns, too. Just a generalization but most women I knew hear better than their male partners.