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Noob on a budget looking for advice on speakers

JohnnyO206

JohnnyO206

New Member
Hello All:

Greetings from Seattle! It's my second post so please be gentle. :rflmao::rflmao:

I just picked up a vintage (and beautiful) Kenwood KR 7600 receiver and a Pioneer PL516 turntable at an estate sale. I'm VERY excited to set these up in my "music room", which is a fully carpeted 14' wide by 21' long room with large screen TV, sectional, 3,000 or so CD's and 100 or so albums (more to come). I plan on mostly playing CD's and vinyl and running the TV through my speakers. For 30+ years I've been missing the warmth and depth of listening to albums on a decent system and now is the time to get back into it!

Unfortunately, I'm lost as to what I should get for speakers...

I know that the KR7600 is rated at 70 watts per channel and I want the ability to "crank it up" once in while but most of the time I'll be listening to CD's and albums at reasonable to somewhat loud levels. Due to space limitations, I'd prefer not to get a separate subwoofer if possible.

Any recommendations for speakers? I'm open to new or vintage but looking to spend less than $500 (feel free to snicker). I saw some ADS L780/2 speakers with stands locally for around $300. They have great reviews and can handle up to 100 watts but I'm worried that they'll be too small for really getting loud.

I'm open to any suggestions. Thanks in advance for sharing your knowledge!

John
 
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Loudness is a function of power and of the limitations of the speaker. These limitations are both electrical (the power they can take before coil damage occurs) and mechanical (the power they can take before distorting, bottoming out, etc).

Unfortunately, speaker power ratings are not standardized and are often not very useful. But generally you will know when you are driving them too hard; the sound will change. Instead of getting simply louder, they will start sounding "different" (harsher, less detailed, mechanical noises, etc).

A key specification of speakers is their sensitivity, which allows you to compare the relative loudness of one speaker to another. The sensitivity specification tellls you how loud the speaker will get with one watt of input (or sometimes with 2.83V of input, which is 1 watt for 8 ohm speakers and 2 watts for 4 ohm speakers). The higher the sensitivity, the louder they will get with a given amount of power.

Those ADS speakers have a sensitivity rating of 88dB and will get plenty loud in a medium-sized room. That said, 88dB is more towards the low end of the sensitivity scale. For example, it will take twice as much power to get them to a given loudness vs a speaker with a 91dB sensitivity. Given that the 7600 can deliver up to 90 watts into a 4 ohm load (which is what I would consider those ADS speakers to be), it is a good match for those speakers. I would guess that you will hit the limitations of the speaker before those of the amp...and either way, your ears will be close to bleeding.



EDIT: FYI...value can be discussed only in the Dollars and Sense forum.
 
I would try and hit all the estate sales as well as garage/ tag sales people moving
Lots of new unemployed people looking to pay the bills
Stay with name brands with Really nice wood cabinets
Try for at least 12” woofers.
Easier to resell if you don’t like them at home
Listen to them bring a paper towel inside tube to listen to the mids and Tweeters.
Happy hunting
 
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Welcome.

There are some considerations.

First,
What genre of music do you prefer? Do you listen at loud, moderate or background levels ? If you listen to rock music you will want a speaker that can reproduce bass. If you listen to classical music, a speaker that has articulate treble is important.

Second,
What type of speakers do you prefer? Different designs tend to have different sound signatures

Third,
If you can go somewhere to audition speakers, that is far better than to rely on someone else's opinion. (Wharfedale, Jamo come to mind)

Fourth,
Companies that offer a money back in-home trial is a great way to go. (Tekton Designs, Fluance come to mind)
.
Fifth,
Audio reviewers on the Internet and YouTube fall into the trap of the latest speaker they have heard is often the "best" . In reality, speaker design has not evolved significantly since the 1970s.

Sixth,
Vintage speakers should be left to the experienced hobbyist. Your receiver probably allows connection of two pairs of speakers which allows you to experiment/compare with garage sale bargains and thrift store finds while enjoying your #1 speakers as well.

Seventh,
Probably should keep to 8 ohm speakers. Vintage receivers often have problems with 4 ohm speaker loads.
 
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If those ADS are in good shape and everything is working they should be fine. I've never heard an ADS I didn't like. If they don't do the low end well enough for you add an inexpensive subwoofer with the budget money left over. Plenty of good sounding vintage speakers in your price range, nothing to snicker at. Looking at new there may be fewer choices but you know what's available and you don't have to spend as much time searching, one often needs patience to get what they want in vintage, . Many speaker repairs are relatively simple for even moderate DIY skills, but there are exceptions and there are those who should not DIY anything.
 
Less than $500.00? Elac! Check Music Direct. I think I just saw last years models on sale there.
Remember though, if you buy a bookshelf pair you will need stands. My guess is you may be able to find a floorstander for that price too.

Good Luck, Mark
 
Those ADS with 70wpc would get loud enough for me, but your loud may be louder than mine. If loud is important, check out Klipsch, Cerwin-Vega and JBL, among others. I'd pretty much prefer the ADS myself. and that's the thing about speakers - the more of them you hear, the easier to figure out your own preferences - which may well change over time.

Don't misjudge the ADS L780 due to size - they made some much smaller that get loud.
 
I'm a big fan of Boston Acoustics everything. Especially the A-series, they seem to make every source sound good.
 
JohnnyO206 said:
Hello All:

Greetings from Seattle! It's my second post so please be gentle. :rflmao::rflmao:

I just picked up a vintage (and beautiful) Kenwood KR 7600 receiver and a Pioneer PL516 turntable at an estate sale. I'm VERY excited to set these up in my "music room", which is a fully carpeted 14' wide by 21' long room with large screen TV, sectional, 3,000 or so CD's and 100 or so albums (more to come). I plan on mostly playing CD's and vinyl and running the TV through my speakers. For 30+ years I've been missing the warmth and depth of listening to albums on a decent system and now is the time to get back into it!

Unfortunately, I'm lost as to what I should get for speakers...

I know that the KR7600 is rated at 70 watts per channel and I want the ability to "crank it up" once in while but most of the time I'll be listening to CD's and albums at reasonable to somewhat loud levels. Due to space limitations, I'd prefer not to get a separate subwoofer if possible.

Any recommendations for speakers? I'm open to new or vintage but looking to spend less than $500 (feel free to snicker). I saw some ADS L780/2 speakers with stands locally for around $300. They have great reviews and can handle up to 100 watts but I'm worried that they'll be too small for really getting loud.

I'm open to any suggestions. Thanks in advance for sharing your knowledge!

John
Click to expand...

Welcome back to the fold! There are many vintage options available in your given price range if that is the route you choose to take.
 
Living on the West coast, Stay with west coast speakers.
Jbls, Altec’s Infinity. Much more plentiful, Best of all
Really efficient, and collected. Baby Boomers are
Moving to Florida and Texas selling the big old speakers.
That’s what you want !
!trade your way up to some real killer speakers for your big room.
That’s why you want mint Cabinets to resell to make the next upgrade
Think Road Trip,
 
Just checked Seattle CL and saw a pair of ADS 710's for a reasonable sum that were posted today, they have dual woofers and dig a little deeper than the 780's.

Either way, you can't go wrong.
 
Patience will often pay off in the speaker world, you'll find cheap deals, free stuffs, etc.

I would advise against spending money on speakers you haven't heard based solely on notoriety. There are a few that are known to please the masses, and they're a safe investment. I realize that's tough these days, but $500 will buy you a lot of speaker, and a huge range of sounds. From magnepan to klipsch, great options, totally different sounds.
 
wmgwizard said:
Just checked Seattle CL and saw a pair of ADS 710's for a reasonable sum that were posted today, they have dual woofers and dig a little deeper than the 780's.

Either way, you can't go wrong.
Click to expand...
I A/B'd a pair of 710's against my 780's and I thought the bass was a little richer with the single, bigger woofer. On the other hand, the 780's "improved" (smaller) midrange driver didn't seem "improved". Although @JohnnyO206 would more than likely be best served by ADS in his foray into vintage, I think the 810's are the best used speaker value out there. I think the prices are kept low by all of the learned audiophiles proclaiming them "too boomy." I wish I'd have held out for a pair in the room that the 780's are in.

NOT the 810's that I played with in the music room for awhile before they moved across the state. They were big enough to easily fill a 15 X 25 foot room.

L810.jpg
 
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Even better, I once bought a nice pair of L-1230's for $500. Although they couldn't displace the queens of the living room, and became surplus to be sold, they were truly a pleasure. If i was a better audiophile, I'd have both pair cluttering the living room, still marveling at the wall of sound they created together.


Haphazard Photoshop recreation of ESS AMT-3's and ADS L-1230's playing together.

ListeningSpace.gif
 
I would echo the comment about efficiency. A little louder (+3db) requires twice the power so a more efficient speaker will provide more headroom in your larger listen room giving the vintage receiver some breathing room. Unfortunately, efficiency specs are not uniform as how it is measured varies. Generally speaking, smaller boxes tend to be less efficient, big honking ones more so. Ported tend to be more efficient than acoustic suspension (sealed box that uses the air within as a spring). Vintage JBL, Altec, and klipsch tend to be very efficient but as they are collectible, can also be expensive. Personally, I'd be on the lookout for a decent set of JBL Decade L26's. They should be in your price range, are fairly efficient and have a more balanced sound than most. They also are vintage w/o looking dated, sort of timeless really.

http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/specs/home-speakers/1973-l26.htm
 
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ESS AMT3's
119E0799-FD81-414E-BACF-B2561AD85DC5.jpeg
Mojo Modded AMT3,s....
clean 28hz-20khz....
Van Alstine Transcendence 10RB/Harmon Kardon PA2400
kingdome.jpg
 
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You're in the right area to snag a pair of vintage Speakerlab towers for cheap. That should be a good pairing for a vintage Kenwood amp! At least until you get up and running and learn more about your personal tastes in presentation.

I just browsed Seattle CL and saw multiple pairs of good condition floor standers.

If you can handle taking on some cosmetic issues I would maybe go for the SpeakerLab S19's currently listed in Snohomish.
Or the DAS 4 in Puyallup.
The S300 in Kent sounds like it might be an ex-Speakerlab employee.

Stay away from the "Speakerlab tower speakers" in Tacoma. They replaced the passive radiator with a "sub"...bad mojo there!
 
Hey, just noticed a pair of Monitor Audio Silver RS6's with the matching center channel for just at top of your budget in Tacoma. I think the seller is a little optimistic and they've been posted for 3 days. I sold mine for 3/5 of that price if you get my meaning. You might be able to get them a little cheaper and sell the center on eBay.

Anyway, they are fantastic speakers. I really enjoyed the pair I had and they did everything well. As long as that metal dome tweeter is really broken in (and there's no reason it wouldn't be by now) it is exceptionally smooooooottttthhhhh!. And I got very satisfying bass out of those twin 6.5 woofers. I ran mine on a vintage 80w PSE amplifier and never ran out of steam.
 
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