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ortofon cadenza blue vs audiotechnica

A

andrikus

New Member
My Ortofon cadenza blue cartridge broke so I'll have to replace it.
The dealer where I bought the recordplayer and catridge (michell gyrodec with technoarm ) lets me trade in the cartridge for another cadenza blue.
However, in the phone calls I had, he's also giving a lot of attention to Audiotechnica which make me think this is a good alternative,

It is not possible to compare the elements in a listening session, so I'll have to with reviews, specifications and hopefully the members on this forum.
In the shop I can listen to the AT-OC9XSL.

In the same price range as the cadenza are the is are the AT-ART9XI and the AT-ART9XA.

What can you people tell me about these cartridges that help me make a decission?
 
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andrikus said:
My Ortofon cadenza blue cartridge broke so I'll have to replace it.
The dealer where I bought the recordplayer and catridge (michell gyrodec with technoarm ) lets me trade in the cartridge for another cadenza blue.
However, in the phone calls I had, he's also giving a lot of attention to Audiotechnica which make me think this is a good alternative,

It is not possible to compare the elements in a listening session, so I'll have to with reviews, specifications and hopefully the members on this forum.
In the shop I can listen to the AT-OC9XSL.
Click to expand...

I run an AT-OC9XML on a Rega RB303 arm which is very related to the Technoarm. It sounds wonderful. The XSL is supposed to be more audiophile. Those use a boron cantilever.

Your cadenza used a Ruby cantilever. Using purely technical criteria, boron should be better, but audiophiles also favor Ruby(sapphire).

ART9 is a step up (in theory) to the AT-OC9X line. I have not heard them. But in my opinion, Audio-Technica is probably the manufacturer that gives you the most value for money. And they do MC cartridges very well.
 
Maybe you could consider a new AT and then send the Ortofon out for a rebuild if the cartridge is suitable for that. Getting a nice cantilever material and a good cut of diamond shouldn’t be too expensive, around the trade in value of the Ortofon depending on who does the retip.
 
Have several AT & Ortofon cartridges, including an OC9XSH and ART20. The OC9XSH is an excellent cartridge at its price point, but the ART20 is outstanding. I'm very pleased with my Cadenza Black. I would have to think long and hard between the ART9 and the Cadenza Blue if I could only have one.
Also, you can have your Cadenza Blue retipped & up-graded for under $500. Talk to Steve at VAS Audio or Peter at Soundsmith.
 
I've been ogling the Cadenza Blue for a while now, I've never had an Ortofon cart. I've got an ART9 and an ART9xa. For whatever reason I've just never been able to get the ART9xa dialed in to my liking. I haven't given up on it but I am taking a break from it for a while.. I sent it to Steve at VAS and he checked it out and said it was fine. This is my first Shibata stylus and I suppose I'm just a bit baffled by it. That and my eyes aren't what they used to be. I'll figure it out.
 
Hi, you need to realise that the Ort & AT-OC9 have different compliances, so check if your arm is compatible for the new cart you choose.
Also the Ort has a nude Elliptical, so does not need special height set up. But the OC9 is Shibata & requires the arm (unless you are very lucky) to have adjustable height to get it to sing.
On top of that Ort carts are built like ''brick out houses'', but the technics carts are not so tough, in my experience.
Why not have the Blue repaired.
Cheers
 
tabarddn51 said:
Hi, you need to realise that the Ort & AT-OC9 have different compliances, so check if your arm is compatible for the new cart you choose.
Also the Ort has a nude Elliptical, so does not need special height set up. But the OC9 is Shibata & requires the arm (unless you are very lucky) to have adjustable height to get it to sing.
On top of that Ort carts are built like ''brick out houses'', but the technics carts are not so tough, in my experience.
Why not have the Blue repaired.
Cheers
Click to expand...

I sent out my player for repair.(I expected a faulty cable) The repair service concluded, that the cartridge is broken; the right channel impedance was very different from the left.
My dealer then called with the importer of Ortofon here in the Netherlands and reported back to me, it can not be repaired. It can only be traded in for another Ortofon or replaced.

If I remember it well the height of the arm can be adjusted to the cartridge. I'll have it installed at the dealer and he'll take care of setting it up properly.

------
Your replies are much appreciated

From what you people write I conclude that
- Ortofon is less fragile
- The cantilever of the AT is better.

I see that the channel separation figure of the AT's (30dB vs >23dB) is better, is that important and are there other specs that are worth mentioning?
What can I expect soundwise?
 
As has been said above, the ATOC9 models are excellent and well worth considering. I have both an ATOC9-MLII and an AT-OC9XSH in my armoury and they are both excellent cartridges.

That said, I’d still rank them a little below the Cadenza models. I use a Cadenza Black as my main cartridge and wouldn’t swap it for anything (well, maybe an Ortofon MC Diamond, but here are roughly 8000 reasons why that won’t be happening!).

Unless you really fancy a change, I’d be inclined to stick with another Cadenza - they do work well with the Tecnoarm, too.
 
I have 2 of the 3 carts (both ATs but not the blue). All are good. Don't have the Cadenza blue but do have the Cadenza Bronze. In the ART9 there is the .5mv and .2 mv output versions. The lower output version of the ART 9 has a more extended top end than the Cadenza Bronze. But the Bronze has such a great midrange. Not if that is a help or note. Depending on the phono stage you are using you may want to consider the Technics 305 or Sony T1 step up trans. and running the output into the MM stage.
 
Nothing has been mentioned about which tone arm these cartridges are being listened to in.
I also own a Cadenza Blue mounted in a S.M.E. 3009, 9 inch Pre-Improved and when I first installed it, it sounded wonderful until......

When I purchased a Dynavector 505 tone arm and tried both arms I found I liked the Cadenza Blue even more so in the 505 than I do in the S.M.E.
The ART-9 is 8.5 gram while the Cadenza is 11 grams. In a short time I more than ever realized how important it is regarding the matching of components. When in the 505 arm the ART-9 sounded similar as it did in the S.M.E. arm however, when the Cadenza was mounted on the heavier arm it seemed to be another type of animal.

The importance of proper cartridge/arm combination was so always important but, I had ignored the issue thinking it was just those guys who own super high end systems I was reading about. I learned otherwise as the Cadenza opened up to new levels across the frequency spectrum unlike it sounded with the S.M.E. arm where it was polite projecting a composure of control and strength while sounding wonderful. But, on the Dynavector 505 arm it became a different animal and has prompted me towards heavier arms in the future.
It’s bass suddenly became not only more rock solid but the bass became mountainous in size with out being overblown or un-natural and overbearing. It was a bass response I don’t think I ever experienced before, talk about iron-fisted. It’s highs seemed to be more apparent without sounding too forward or dominant. With-in the first 5 minutes of use with the heavier arm I actually felt I was listening to an entirely improved version of the Cadenza like Cadenza Blue Mk.II or something. It wasn’t a bass response that was omni-present in the sense of always being-there but, it was simply bigger sounding and more authoritative when necessary. And to be honest as much as I care for the Cadenza, now when in the other heavier arm it became a new more exciting lover of sorts and it became so much more attractive and fun to listen to.

It didn’t have anything over my Lyra Delos or my Lyra Kleos in the S.M.E. except for the bass range where the Cadenza seemed to be the new-big-guy. And the same goes for my ART-9 which does at times compete with the Delos though none of them had the seemingly improved bass response of the Cadenza.
It wasn’t a bass response that was omni-present in the sense of always being-there, it was simply bigger sounding and more authoritative. I never was fatigued or bored of it. Like I said, the bass wasn’t dominant but when bass was called for it was a new best friend.
And though listening to my ‘NEW’ sounding Cadenza, it doesn’t out-sound my Benz-Micro “Gull-Wing" cartridge which is my premier cartridge that I haven’t yet tried with the heavier arm.
In closing I can say that if the other carts. I mentioned above had the bass response in addition to their high level transparency as the Cadenza does when in a heavier-weight tone arm, I’d be re-evaluating my tastes.
FM

Below: Dynavector 505 tone arm and Ortofon Cadenza Blue cartridge.
505 copy 4.jpeg
FM



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More massive arms certainly have their place. My Sorane SA-1.2 works great with the Ortofon SPU Diam.17, DL-103R & OC9XSH. I'll have to give a few of the other carts a try in it.
 
Analog vinyl is a vibration-sensing medium. How each of the ingredients (turntable/arm/cartridge/phonostage) individually deals with vibration(s) plus how the individual ingredients interact with one another; both contribute to the assessment of the finished recipe.

All assessments of any individual ingredient can only be performed in the context of a complete whole assemblage. Thus it pays to have a vinyl system with more than one arm for the purpose of assessing synergy or the lack of the same. I've got a non-interchangeable headshell arm and a SME headshell style interchangeable arm suitable for the turntable. With the SME headshell style arm I can experiment with headshells and counterweights in order to see how adjusting the effective mass suits a cartridge/arm combination. There is more to arm/cartridge interaction than effective mass alone. However experimentation with effective mass can illustrate just how different a cartridge can sound due to mass without changing any other parameter. So it pays to have a cross-section of headshell masses and materials. Using custom milled counterweights can enable one to mount cartridges too light for the stock tonearm with some headshell cartridge combinations. Ideally one could have one tonearm for cartridges which synergise with high mass arms and another tonearm for cartridges suitable for lower mass set ups.
 
Hi, If the MC cart's R & L/H channel are out of whack. The easier fix would be to make up or buy a HypnoToad MC AD797 P/Amp. I understand there are boards & maybe built up ones, still available.
With this Phono amp it is dual mono & you can adjust the gain & impedance separately for each channel.


Cheers
 
frankmarsi said:
Nothing has been mentioned about which tone arm these cartridges are being listened to in.
Click to expand...
At this moment the tonearm is a given: the Michell technoarm.
I only have the funds to replace the broken cartridge, with a cadenza (blue, maybe bronze depending on the of the dealers negotiation space ) or an AT
Are you saying the cadenza blue is not a good match and, for this arm, I should choose a different element?
 
Here's a notable re-tipper that has received good reviews in the industry. I would call first to discuss your situation. Ask for their options and prices.
https://www.sound-smith.com/services/phono-cartridge-repair-restoration-tip-repair

In short, the Cadenza Bronze has more of a mello or slightly subdued high-end sound compared to the Cadenza Blue. I've never
owned the Bronze but, reviews and Ortofon's own web-site more or less state that as do independent reviewers.
I chose the Blue because it has slightly more pronounced highs and since I use vintage AR speakers, I benefited from it.
If your speakers exhibit elevated highs, the Bronze might be more appropriate. I suggest going to the Ortofon web-site as they
explain their product line. Also, surf the hi-end sites for reviews.
I realize cartridge prices have increased since I purchased my Delos at around $1,500. whereas now I believe it's around $2,200.
If you enjoy realistic highs, mids, and bass with a transparency and depth of high resolution it's become my favorite daily-driver.
And, I can honestly say my all time favorite in my cartridge stable.

P.S. Check your tone arm's specs. for the actual range of cartridge weight recommendations.
FM
 
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andrikus said:
My Ortofon cadenza blue cartridge broke so I'll have to replace it.
The dealer where I bought the recordplayer and catridge (michell gyrodec with technoarm ) lets me trade in the cartridge for another cadenza blue.
However, in the phone calls I had, he's also giving a lot of attention to Audiotechnica which make me think this is a good alternative,

It is not possible to compare the elements in a listening session, so I'll have to with reviews, specifications and hopefully the members on this forum.
In the shop I can listen to the AT-OC9XSL.

In the same price range as the cadenza are the is are the AT-ART9XI and the AT-ART9XA.

What can you people tell me about these cartridges that help me make a decission?
Click to expand...
Broke?
Does it need a retip or do you have dead channel?
If it is just a cantilever it can be fixed
Cheers
Chris
 
Hi, Strictly speaking yes the Blue is not a good match for your arm. That's with an estimated Eff Match of 12grams, which is what the Raga arm is. According to the Korf calculator, the arm should be around 20 to 25 grams to be a good match, this is easily fixed be adding a brass head-shell spacer. But it will not solve your problem and I have re-read your initial posts & cannot work out from what you have said, is wrong with the Blue
- are you getting sound from both cannels
- Is one channel louder that the other
- some else?
On paper the AT cart should be a better match, but you need to be able to adjust the arms height to set the cart up properly, their ML cart would be easier to set up.

Cheers
 
One channel is louder than the other, and through headphones I heard that one channel picked up more noise without playing a record.
The latter could not be confirmed by the repair company,
The repair company measured it and found that the impedance of right and left channel are quite different from each other. It is beyond repair.
The only option is to install a new cartridge. So now I have to make a big decision: which cartridge am I going to buy
 
andrikus said:
My Ortofon cadenza blue cartridge broke so I'll have to replace it.
Click to expand...
I had a Cadenza Blue at one time. It's a great cartridge, but that ruby cantilever is delicate. One day, I found the cantilever just sitting by itself, below the seated tonearm on its holder.

I've used boron cantilever cartridges ever since. Great sound, much tougher.
 
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