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Pioneer PL 117d problems

PoPSiCLe

PoPSiCLe

New Member
So. I have a newly found PL 117D, that someone left at a recycling center - it looks pristine, other than a problem with the lid, but other than that, as I said, pristine.

Unfortunately, it does not work, and I'm kinda at a miss what is the real problem. I'm fairly technically inclined, but I have never worked on a turntable before, and the service manual isn't the greatest quality, which makes seeing the images and diagrams a bit funky.

Anyway. What happens is that the start-button doesn't really do anything - it feels kinda "loose", and doesn't actually do much. When opened up, I can move the platters to the "correct" position, and it will work, but pressing the stop-button will then not "reset" everything to where it's supposed to go - I think. It's a bit difficult to understand exactly what does what, so if anyone has some images from a working PL 117D internals, I'd be happy to have a look at them - one of the plastic arms had jumped out of its groove - this has been rectified, but didn't really do much.

I have tried soaking stuff in WD40, and moving it back and forth, without much luck, so I might have to take it apart completely, and clean everything piece by piece, perhaps.

Anyone have any images of a working PL 117D?

I'm specifically looking for:
A top down view of the inside with nothing going on
Same, but with start-button pressed
And same after stop-button is pressed.

A video will of course work wonders as well.

It seems fairly simple, mechanically, but since I have no history of this, I dunno if something might have been taken apart, and not put back entirely correctly before.

If I can get it working, I'm also planning on swapping the soldered Left/Right output with a pair of contacts, so I can plug in a separate audio cable - if anyone have any info about this, or have done this mod, please lemme know
 
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PoPSiCLe said:
So. I have a newly found PL 117D, that someone left at a recycling center - it looks pristine, other than a problem with the lid, but other than that, as I said, pristine.

Unfortunately, it does not work, and I'm kinda at a miss what is the real problem. I'm fairly technically inclined, but I have never worked on a turntable before, and the service manual isn't the greatest quality, which makes seeing the images and diagrams a bit funky.

Anyway. What happens is that the start-button doesn't really do anything - it feels kinda "loose", and doesn't actually do much. When opened up, I can move the platters to the "correct" position, and it will work, but pressing the stop-button will then not "reset" everything to where it's supposed to go - I think. It's a bit difficult to understand exactly what does what, so if anyone has some images from a working PL 117D internals, I'd be happy to have a look at them - one of the plastic arms had jumped out of its groove - this has been rectified, but didn't really do much.

I have tried soaking stuff in WD40, and moving it back and forth, without much luck, so I might have to take it apart completely, and clean everything piece by piece, perhaps.

Anyone have any images of a working PL 117D?

I'm specifically looking for:
A top down view of the inside with nothing going on
Same, but with start-button pressed
And same after stop-button is pressed.

A video will of course work wonders as well.

It seems fairly simple, mechanically, but since I have no history of this, I dunno if something might have been taken apart, and not put back entirely correctly before.

If I can get it working, I'm also planning on swapping the soldered Left/Right output with a pair of contacts, so I can plug in a separate audio cable - if anyone have any info about this, or have done this mod, please lemme know
Click to expand...

does it have a belt?
 
Nashou66 said:
Welcome to AK.

Ddi you download the SM from VE?

https://www.vinylengine.com/library/pioneer/pl-117d.shtml

it looks pretty decent copy to me.

after looking at it Id check to make sure the micro switch KSF-023 is working properly.

For that matter Id check all switches.

Athanasios
Click to expand...
It's... not _horrible_, it just doesn't function all that well to print out to use next to the turntable.

I will have a look at the microswitches, although I don't think those are the problem, they seem to work as intended, with clicks and such when moved manually.

The microswitch(es) seem to function - they click and such. As stated, it's the movement of the main plate(s) that isn't working correctly, as far as I can see- which is why I was hoping someone with a working PL 117d might be able to take some photos and perhaps a video of the internals as they hit the buttons, to see how it's supposed to move.
 
On some auto function tables the platter needs to be spun manually many times to "re set" the cogs etc.

Try that, maybe 10 revolutions or so.

Not sure where the lubrication pionts should be . But general rule is if it slides use grease if it spins use oil.
 
PoPSiCLe said:
It has a belt - it starts, and runs, and swaps speeds if I toggle between 33 and 45 - the problem is, as I stated, that the movement of the internal components / sliders / plates doesn't seem to be on point.
Click to expand...

Like others have said, will most likely need some new lube. White lithium grease on the cogs and gears that require it.

I would download the service manual and start to go through it.

The 112, 115 and 117 all have the 4 point suspension, careful adjusting it as it’s a bit of a pain in the neck. It’s a good deck and worth fixing up.
 
jobrewer1983 said:
Like others have said, will most likely need some new lube. White lithium grease on the cogs and gears that require it.

I would download the service manual and start to go through it.

The 112, 115 and 117 all have the 4 point suspension, careful adjusting it as it’s a bit of a pain in the neck. It’s a good deck and worth fixing up.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'll take it apart and regrease and oil. However, I'm not 100% sure that is the extent of the issue - which is kinda why I would like some actual pictures of a working PL 117d, as that would give me confirmation that everything is positioned as it's supposed to be.
 
PoPSiCLe said:
Yeah, I'll take it apart and regrease and oil. However, I'm not 100% sure that is the extent of the issue - which is kinda why I would like some actual pictures of a working PL 117d, as that would give me confirmation that everything is positioned as it's supposed to be.
Click to expand...

Have you tried YT?

I’m sure you can find some videos of one on YT.

That arm on that deck if set up properly is rather nice. I know I’ve seen videos of the 117 as I’ve had a few of them. Recently was looking at them due to working on my 510a.

Honesty your best bet is the service manual. Good luck with it!
 
PoPSiCLe said:
Yeah, I'll take it apart and regrease and oil. However, I'm not 100% sure that is the extent of the issue - which is kinda why I would like some actual pictures of a working PL 117d, as that would give me confirmation that everything is positioned as it's supposed to be.
Click to expand...

lots of vids on YT
 
PoPSiCLe said:
Haven't been able to find any of the actual internals - there are some of the player actually playing, but that doesn't really help me
Click to expand...

Ahh I see, not sure you will find that. They are not to complex and your in the right spot for info.

pull the platter off lock down the arm remove the headshell And counter weight.

flip it over and remove the bottom and start looking for old grease. That’s where I’d start.
 
jobrewer1983 said:
Ahh I see, not sure you will find that. They are not to complex and your in the right spot for info.

pull the platter off lock down the arm remove the headshell And counter weight.

flip it over and remove the bottom and start looking for old grease. That’s where I’d start.
Click to expand...
Already done most of that - opened it up, removed the platter and the band, and now we're at a place where, if I move the main plate to where I _think_ it is supposed to be on stop, and hit "start", it moves correctly (again, I think) - however, when I hit "stop", it does not move back to the original position (the microswitch mention earlier stops on a plastic arm, and it doesn't reset correctly - again, I think) - anyway, when this happens, I can't actually use the start button at all, as it just "flops" (not push/pull action) - so this is where I'm currently at. I will go through the service manual page by page, and check each item, and see if I can figure out what is causing the mechanics to not behave as they're supposed to.
 
PoPSiCLe said:
Already done most of that - opened it up, removed the platter and the band, and now we're at a place where, if I move the main plate to where I _think_ it is supposed to be on stop, and hit "start", it moves correctly (again, I think) - however, when I hit "stop", it does not move back to the original position (the microswitch mention earlier stops on a plastic arm, and it doesn't reset correctly - again, I think) - anyway, when this happens, I can't actually use the start button at all, as it just "flops" (not push/pull action) - so this is where I'm currently at. I will go through the service manual page by page, and check each item, and see if I can figure out what is causing the mechanics to not behave as they're supposed to.
Click to expand...

There should be some pots to adjust to get it to start and stop, you may need to clean the pots and controls and make the adjustment on where the stop and start of the arm land and start.
 
jobrewer1983 said:
There should be some pots to adjust to get it to start and stop, you may need to clean the pots and controls and make the adjustment on where the stop and start of the arm land and start.
Click to expand...
This isn't pots - it's the mechanical movement of the buttons/mechanics. There is nothing electrical about this AT ALL - it's 100% mechanical - you push a button, it moves an arm, and that arm pulls a wire, which then moves plates and other arms. This is meant to (AFAIK) behave correctly even with no power supplied - they're mechanical arms, the functionality should not be dependant on power. I'll see if I can get a video shot of what is happening, and include it here.
 
PoPSiCLe said:
This isn't pots - it's the mechanical movement of the buttons/mechanics. There is nothing electrical about this AT ALL - it's 100% mechanical - you push a button, it moves an arm, and that arm pulls a wire, which then moves plates and other arms. This is meant to (AFAIK) behave correctly even with no power supplied - they're mechanical arms, the functionality should not be dependant on power. I'll see if I can get a video shot of what is happening, and include it here.
Click to expand...

I’ve worked on many many PL-117s 115s and 112, among other pioneers. Forgive me, as I know the 115 and the 117 have some auto functions that I’ve not commented to memory.

I’ve not played with the 117 in some time, but the actuation of parts is not that complex, especially if it’s just the mechanical aspect of it. If you can make it move by hand the way it should, it should be easy to see what is going on.

Take a video of what your having an issue of and post it, maybe someone will see the issue and we can point it out.
 

Here's a short video of my pushing buttons, and viewing the internals of the PL 117D - if anyone have any input on movement and/or parts placed wrong, or anything like that, please lemme know.
 
PoPSiCLe said:

Here's a short video of my pushing buttons, and viewing the internals of the PL 117D - if anyone have any input on movement and/or parts placed wrong, or anything like that, please lemme know.
Click to expand...

ok so the stop cable is clearly getting stuck, that’s the 1st thing I can see. Put a drop of lube down the housing of the steel cables for the start and stop. That’s the 1st thing. It also looks like the cable for the stop is loose.
 
jobrewer1983 said:
ok so the stop cable is clearly getting stuck, that’s the 1st thing I can see. Put a drop of lube down the housing of the steel cables for the start and stop. That’s the 1st thing. It also looks like the cable for the stop is loose.
Click to expand...

it looks like it’s just binding, add a single drop of lube to each moving hinge to see if the movement frees up that whole mech look stiff and not moving as it should
 
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