I was tweaking the TF1525 in the ported LaScala today and it really sounds good. It is similar to the 15C with a small X-max but at moderate listening levels that is not a problem. I really like the sound of those TF series woofers.
Ported LaScala (Tribute to the late DJK)
- Thread starter THD+N
- Start date
Well they are guitar speakers after all, trying to be competitive to overpriced EVM 12L and 15L's no longer made but I have 4. I found the Kappa Pro 15A to be a higher power version with a 3" ALUMINUM VC with a light cone. I came up with the Kappa 12a with the same motor for DaveTennessee and the fabulous Dual 12 speakers he built. They were $75 each at the time, now they jacked up the price by at least $50. Eight percent inflation my eye.
I have found two different spec sheets for the TF1525. One says X-max 2.5mm, the other 4.5mm. A few other small signal parameters are different as well.
For a 42oz magnet and 2.5" VC, Celestion did their homework on these woofers. That is not a big magnet for such a high BL product. Finite Element Analysis...
Also closer tolerance on the Voice Coil gaps. What I liked about the JBL drivers (high end Pro) is the Flat Edge, rectangular cross section, eliminating wasted air space. Expensive to do, but worth it for their performance advantage or the Round Wound Majority. The opposite of strings on a bass guitar, ironically, which influences the TONE (but wears out the wood neck faster). Think Jaco Pastorius, the Jimi Hendrix of the Electric Bass and a great reason to have HORN bass definition to better hear the genius of what he did before he went cuckoo. That being said, I still prefer the sound of acoustic instruments, whose tamber nuances are most difficult to reproduce correctly.
Keep in mind that when I improved the bass (and the tweeter) when I came up with the Super Heresy, my original intent was to improve the Mid Bass/Midrange. After all, the center frequency in all music (symphonic) is 440 Hz. where all tuning is based. The reason for getting "the midbass right" (Quarter Pie, MWM, LaSCala, and FH-1) is the horn loading for low Modulation Distortion, which is 1,000 times higher in speakers than in Amps. So the closer Gigantic gets to "horns on everything" with a practical compromise Bass Reflex extension, the more revealing the recordings will be, which is what fuels all of our addictions in the first place.
My goal, when I finally realized it, was to get as good of a micro detail/inner voice definition as I got in my Stax Electrostatic Headphones of 30 years ago (still have my AKG 240's, which was the right choice in 1976 as the Studio Recording Standard even today). I finally achieved it with all horns, but it took years and patience.
Now that we have tools like Hornresp, it's nice to know we don't waste lumber by making more sawdust and firewood during the quest for sonic purity!
Keep in mind that when I improved the bass (and the tweeter) when I came up with the Super Heresy, my original intent was to improve the Mid Bass/Midrange. After all, the center frequency in all music (symphonic) is 440 Hz. where all tuning is based. The reason for getting "the midbass right" (Quarter Pie, MWM, LaSCala, and FH-1) is the horn loading for low Modulation Distortion, which is 1,000 times higher in speakers than in Amps. So the closer Gigantic gets to "horns on everything" with a practical compromise Bass Reflex extension, the more revealing the recordings will be, which is what fuels all of our addictions in the first place.
My goal, when I finally realized it, was to get as good of a micro detail/inner voice definition as I got in my Stax Electrostatic Headphones of 30 years ago (still have my AKG 240's, which was the right choice in 1976 as the Studio Recording Standard even today). I finally achieved it with all horns, but it took years and patience.
Now that we have tools like Hornresp, it's nice to know we don't waste lumber by making more sawdust and firewood during the quest for sonic purity!
would you care to tell us WHY? you already own great JBL drivers that 2 of us have helped you do a good ported LaScala built with. It's your time and money, but at which point will you declare "good enough" and just play music with the optimized results. Enlighten me, 'cause I just don't get what you are all about here.
Invidiosulus
Well-Known Member
He said “was” as in past tense.
He didn’t say they were still his first choice.
Gigantic
A big, big love
I didn't buy them primarily because the seller wanted $170 for shipping, plus $400. I decided to get the 2225 instead, which were $120 shipped, each. the basic simulations that I did suggested they would be more than adequate for the previous project and would perform better than the D135, but with less sensitivity. I was initially attracted to the 135's high, 104 dB sensitivity when I found them, but the 2225's will perform better in every other aspect.
I have 2220's in my Edgarhorns optimized for 100-500 band by nature, which are 101. But but I'm suspicious of a 104 db rating, which probably comes from a Peaky response where only the peak is referenced by Marketing to yield a higher number. Reminds me of the Radio Shack as when I was a kid saying 200 Watt PP (peak to peak) then putting 15 Watts RMS in small letters and parentheses. Lying by omission and exaggeration (MSM and politicians are masters of it) has not place in modern speaker design. It's hard enough these things to still meet their PDF specs. in the used market, let alone new.
He said IS his first choice, which is why I asked why in the absence of a timeline.
My mistake on this. Do whatever you like, I'm now at the finish line of this thread. Let us know how it sounds when you get it done or take off in another direction. Back to my own projects.
Last edited:
Yep. I was there with my wife and PWK. Got my own picture of it with PWK in the background. He gave us a tour of it before he drove us to lunch at the Rotary Club, then to his house to listen to his symphonic recordings.
Funny story, as I was talking to PWK at lunch about his experiment with a Heresy and a Garden Hose on Time Delay (seriously), a Banker in a 3-piece suit sat across from my wife at the lunch table and said to her: "You must be really good friends of Mr. Klipsch." She replied: "No, actually, we only met him 1 1/2 hours ago." So after his jaw dropped to the table he says: "Mr. Klipsch has been a member here for many decades and NEVER brought a guest here before." True story.
That's what I get for speed reading after deleting most of my daily 300 Emails. Regardless of missed words, my QUESTION is/was still VALID. He gave no technical reason why he was looking at such a rare and obscure woofer for a ported LaScala build.
After 10 years of BS concerning my Super Heresy, the one thing I'm sensitive about is all the johnny come lately turkeys and chickens on the Klipsch Forum who asked if they could use "whatever" 12" woofer they had laying around. I just shared the joy of my discovery to help others truly IMPROVE the sound of their old H boxes pre-1980.
I didn't want to do unpaid R&D for them, even though I did a few times when the woofers in question had the TSP's looked at first by the requesters.
THD+N is one of the few who actually did a little homework before buying into the cheaper Celestion woofer that works well by way of simulation and reality. I applaud those kind of efforts that we ALL learn from in the process of better sound.
I make no apologies for being human, missing a WAS word, and having a cumulative 10-year, predisposed, sensitivity to unknown and unqualified woofers.
True. My integrity was/is INTACT, just because my vehicle ran over a 1/4" branch in the road. Even PWK said things I did not agree with. He was human too and farted into his couch during our conversation. LOL
Gigantic
A big, big love
At any rate, I now have almost everything I need for the project, the only thing lacking is 2 sheets of 25mm 13-ply
I’d ordered horns from zxpc over the Independence Day holiday, they not only sent the long throw versions, but both horns arrived damaged. ZXPC isn’t responding to my missives to make it right, so next week, I’ll have to take it up with my credit card company.
ZXPC also doesn’t have any stock left, so I ordered the PRV 18x10 horns from Parts Express, instead. They’re thicc!
I just need to decide whether I want to continue with Meranti mahogany veneer or another species instead. I may start making the doghouses as soon as next weekend.
I’d ordered horns from zxpc over the Independence Day holiday, they not only sent the long throw versions, but both horns arrived damaged. ZXPC isn’t responding to my missives to make it right, so next week, I’ll have to take it up with my credit card company.
ZXPC also doesn’t have any stock left, so I ordered the PRV 18x10 horns from Parts Express, instead. They’re thicc!
I just need to decide whether I want to continue with Meranti mahogany veneer or another species instead. I may start making the doghouses as soon as next weekend.
Last edited:
