• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

Possible Cure for Collapsed Stylus Suspension

wualta said:
boreas: If you think of it, start to collect some of the various products that claim not only to clean but also rejuvenate or restore rubber parts. Motorcycle people use the xylene + oil-of-wintergreen method to soften old carburetor boots. Either way, you've added something to the solution by molding the softened rubber so the repair is more useful and, dare we say, permanent.
Click to expand...

Good idea. Meanwhile, this is what's in WD-40. With the possible exception of the corrosion inhibitor, it really does resemble a rubber restorer as much as anything else. It's definitely "off-label" though.

solvent naphtha petroleum, medium aliphatic, > 60%
petroleum base oil as paraffinic distillate, heavy, solvent-dewaxed (severe), 15% to 25%
corrosion inhibitor unregulated, 1% to 10%
wetting agent unregulated, 1% to 10%
fragrance unregulated, 0% to 1%
carbon dioxide, 2% to 3%

John
 
Great experiment John.
Inquisitive minds like your's make the world go round, or at least help the records that go round sound better.

John
 
Another shot after, oh, maybe 10 hours. Still sounds good and appears not to have sagged at all, even after being briefly subjected to about half a gram too much VTF.

(I really wish I had taken a "before" picture!)

John

attachment.php
 

Attachments

  • ADC RXM-I Playing 002.jpg
    ADC RXM-I Playing 002.jpg
    32.5 KB · Views: 376
boreas said:
I'll start by saying that this may not apply to all styli. Differences in the material used for the suspension bushing may result in different, even disastrous, results.

Okay, the subject of the experiment was a used ADC RXM-I (114-DEC). It came to me mounted on an ADC Integra integrated headshell and cartridge. The suspension had largely collapsed. The cantilever wasn't completely bottomed out but it was close. Since the stylus tip showed only a little wear, I decided to try to resurrect it.

Based on some erroneous information on the interwebs, I chose to treat the bushing with WD-40. I had read that the principle ingredient of WD-40 was fish oil and I thought that would be relatively benign. Turns out, however, that WD-40 is petroleum based.

Too late! I had already applied some to the suspension so I just went with it.

Here's what I did. I took a piece if paper and folded it onto a small shim which I then slipped between the cantilever and the stylus grip. This raised the cantilever significantly. I decided to raise it past the point where I believed it should be, thinking that it would slump back a little when the shim was removed. I was right.

After I inserted the shim I sprayed a little bit of WD-40 into a bottle cap and dipped a very small paint brush, about 1/8" wide, into the WD-40. I then proceded to apply WD-40 to both sides of the bushing. (This isn't always possible. On some styli all you can access is the front of the bushing.)

After about an hour I reapplied the WD-40 and, after another hour, I applied more. An hour after that I removed the shim and cleaned off the excess WD-40 with a dry Q-Tip. The stylus didn't spring back on its own but when I pressed on it it did, just a little and just where I hoped it would go. Since then, time and more pushed has made no additional change. I think it worked. The test will be when I listen to it, which I'm about to do.

John
Click to expand...


John,

Excellent thinking on this one!

Once this passes your testing and looks like a long term solution would you post a few pictures showing where you put the paper shim and the where you applied the WD 40?


Thanks, Bob
 
I think John just did this for the Halibut.

:D

But seriouisly, WD-40 is probably the ONE product with more nonsensical crap put out there about it than any other product. I got into a fairly heated argument with some of the "experts" on the Audio Asylum a few years ago. That's where I first heard the "fish oil" assertion and another guy insisted there are ingredients in it that corrode any metal you put it on. Imagine that. Petroleum corroding metal!

Doug
 
I just ran it through the Shure Audio Obstacle Course. A tiny bit of mistracking on the orchestral bells at level 4 but otherwise just fine. I don't know whether to attribute the slight mistracking to stylus condition or the suspension. Still, I've heard worse with that record.

John
 
I used to have that test record for my III and became interested in the music of Lee Holdridge because of it.

"Mas Que Nada" was already a favorite, and it's interesting now to hear the obvious tape distortion in that recording, one that was supposed to be so clean that you could easily tell if your cartridge was mistracking. Nope, some of that is the 1965 tape overloading. It's probably easier in the orchestral bells track to hear the separate sound of the cartridge misbehaving.
 
Last edited:
Good thread to keep in mind.

I just a acquired an ADC cartridge, the Q-303. I don't think it's anything special though the technique could well work on others.
 
Spike-Milligan-600x400.jpg


wualta said:
I used to have that test record for my III and became interested in the music of Lee Holdridge because of it.

"Mas Que Nada" was already a favorite, and it's interesting now to hear the obvious tape distortion in that recording, one that was supposed to be so clean that you could easily tell if your cartridge was mistracking. Nope, some of that is the 1965 tape overloading. It's probably easier in the orchestral bells track to hear the separate sound of the cartridge misbehaving.

WD-40 seems squared away and vindicated, at least for now. I'm going to follow the siren song of Lestoil and see what that does for a certain 614-DQ.
Click to expand...

My copy of AOC is from the V15/II period so I wondered about tape overload or just damage to the record. As a check, I followed the ADC with my Era IV M97 with Astatic/JICO elliptical. It sailed right through.

I agree about orchestral bells being an easier one to judge than some of the others. The relatively pure tones stand in sharp contrast to any audible distortion. The harpsichord, on the other hand.......

John
 
Last edited:
Yes, it makes you wonder what they were thinking.

I'm not surprised the M97, even with the Astatic stylus-- I forgot to look- is the canti telescoped?-- tracks the whole thing nicely. I'd say your XLM-I does pretty well, though, considering it was raised from the dead by miracle fish oil..

And yes again, we simply must get a copy of that lovely new Milligan long player...
 
I have recently purchased a NOS stylus for my Empire 888-TE that has significant sag. May have to see what I can do.
 
onwardjames said:
I have recently purchased a NOS stylus for my Empire 888-TE that has significant sag. May have to see what I can do.
Click to expand...

It certainly is worth a try, if only as "proof of concept". Whether the stylus gets put in service will, of course, depend on the condition of the diamond.

If you do it, please report back to us. Unlike the ADC, the Empire bushing can only be seen from the front. That makes applying WD-40 to both sides difficult or impossible (unless you squirt some down the hollow shank). Also the busing material may not be the same as the ADC's and may not like WD-40.

All in the name of science!

John
 
boreas said:
...I chose to treat the bushing with WD-40. I had read that the principle ingredient of WD-40 was fish oil and I thought that would be relatively benign. Turns out, however, that WD-40 is petroleum based.....
John
Click to expand...

I wonder how Preparation H would work? It's active ingredient is shark cartilage. ;)
 
boreas said:
It certainly is worth a try, if only as "proof of concept". Whether the stylus gets put in service will, of course, depend on the condition of the diamond.

If you do it, please report back to us. Unlike the ADC, the Empire bushing can only be seen from the front. That makes applying WD-40 to both sides difficult or impossible (unless you squirt some down the hollow shank). Also the busing material may not be the same as the ADC's and may not like WD-40.

All in the name of science!

John
Click to expand...

So help me understand....the wd40 tightened up the suspension because something in it softened/conditioned and tightened/firmed the rubber?

Wow. At the upper end of recommended weight, the NOS stylus/cart is nearly touching the record. Very anxious to try this.
 
onwardjames said:
So help me understand....the wd40 tightened up the suspension because something in it softened/conditioned and tightened/firmed the rubber?

Wow. At the upper end of recommended weight, the NOS stylus/cart is nearly touching the record. Very anxious to try this.
Click to expand...

Bear in mind that this whole thing is a case of, "Hey, what do you suppose would happen if....." What follows is mere speculation, crack-brained theorizing and assorted WAGs.

What I think the WD-40 did was to restore the resilience of the bushing. Prior to treating it, I could move the cantilever up and down within a narrow range of positions and it would stay put. Moving it outside that range would result in some amount of rebound but not to the original (correct) position.

I'm guessing that what happens to the bushing is that some chemical components of the bushing are more or less volatile and, over time, evaporate. These missing ingredients are what provide both elasticity/resilience and "memory" and some ingredients in the WD-40 replace them.

If this is correct, it begs the question of how long these newly introduced chemicals will last. They may last for years or they may have all evaporated by next Thursday.

John
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom