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Question for the British bookshelf experts

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Depthgrammar

Member
Reading around about British speakers in the BBC lineage, I'm intrigued by their reputed presentation - as if offering a 'window' onto the original recording where things are depicted almost in miniature and image very precisely. I'd like to get an idea of this sound, as I think it would work well for my tiny bedroom system. My room is 8'x 8', so it's nearfield listening by default and I'm pretty much always in the sweet spot. Right now I'm running Allison 6s, which sound great but I feel the soundstage/scale is a little too big and concert-hall-nebulous for my space, and they're a bit fatiguing in a nearfield setup. The assorted Ls3/5as are out of my price range, and I don't have room for separates to drive anything extremely power hungry (I do listen mainly at low volume). I have a few amps to try but will probably wind up with a nak stasis receiver, 50-100w range, because I keep coming back to that sound.

The Kef r102 (w/ Kube) interest me on a number of levels - reportedly it's not hard to drive, not too finicky about placement (it has to go near a corner in my space), relatively affordable, and generally well-liked. But I've heard it described as a big sounding little box, approximating floorstanders in the kef lineup. Has anyone heard the 102 against the bbc monitors? Are they in the same family, presentation-wise? Or would I be better served looking at the r101 - or something like a Rogers Ls1 or Ls2 - if I'm mostly after that small-scale 'sound window' quality?
 
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Thanks, that's what I thought. So if my priority is a nearfield speaker that gives precise imaging on a smaller scale, as opposed to making you feel like the musicians are in the room with you, the 102 is not it? It seems some people feel this a quality of British speakers in general compared to American.
Would the kef 101 or rogers ls1 or ls2 better fit the bill? Or something else maybe?
 
I have a set of KEF Reference 101's I recapped for my near field setup. They sound great, but I use a small sub alongside my desk to fill in up to about 90-100Hz. Once you get them blended with a sub they sound terrific.
 
Hm, not sure I have room for a sub here, unless it could go in a corner, with some pretty solid furniture between it and my listening position. Probably not ideal. My other concern about the 101 is that it's going to be on stands very close to the corners of the room, which from the manual seems ill-advised. However this is for low-level listening and I'll be seated approx 2-3' from either speaker, so I'm not sure how much to worry about wall proximity, and my room is so small that lack of bass might not be a problem? It does seem like the 101 is more the sound I'm looking for.
 
So the Epi M50s hold their own with Kefs?

Also I see the 102s will need new ferrofluid for the tweeters, which may be beyond my capabilities here. Would the 101 tweeters also need ferrofluid replaced, or are they a different design?
 
I should mention that these days I'm mostly listening to Brazilian/Latin music, which I suppose falls somewhere on the spectrum between jazz & rock, though most of what I listen to is closer to jazz/folk than funk/fusion - i.e. mostly unamplified instruments, with the occasional electric guitar. How do people feel about British monitors for this sort of thing? Looking for something non-fatiguing because I listen all day, but that can image well & make sense of layered percussion. I read somewhere that the low-end Audio note speakers are good at this, and those are designed by the guy behind a lot of the classic Rogers models...
 
Depthgrammar said:
I should mention that these days I'm mostly listening to Brazilian/Latin music, which I suppose falls somewhere on the spectrum between jazz & rock, though most of what I listen to is closer to jazz/folk than funk/fusion - i.e. mostly unamplified instruments, with the occasional electric guitar. How do people feel about British monitors for this sort of thing? Looking for something non-fatiguing because I listen all day, but that can image well & make sense of layered percussion. I read somewhere that the low-end Audio note speakers are good at this, and those are designed by the guy behind a lot of the classic Rogers models...
Click to expand...

To me, the ProAc speakers are somewhat versatile. If you can go to a store to audition them with your favorite CDs or FLAC files, they are worth a trip.
They image very well, and can handle percussion. I do not find them at all fatiguing.

If you can find a well kept used pair, consider that; I bought mine second hand from a store in Baltimore. I think they are twenty years old.
 
OK thanks, Proacs are definitely on my radar.

botrytis said:
EPI is not British

Rogers LS2's
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As luck would have it I came across a pair of Rogers LS2s on craigslist. It was a sweet deal so I nabbed them, figured it would give me an idea if British speakers were the way to go before I spend $4 - 500. So far I'm loving them. Jazz has never sounded so good. They might be all I really need. However I do see that a sub would improve some genres, so I'm rethinking whether I can squeeze one in here somewhere. Curious if you're using them alone or with a sub?

I think I could maybe fit a small sub in one of 3 places
- a corner near either speaker
- a cabinet pretty much directly in front of my seated position where i have some records now (this would be kinda like having it under a desk, except I sit pretty low, so it'd be firing at more or less torso level)
-behind my sitting position, under a sofa close to the back wall. It would make a triangle about 6-7 feet from either speaker, but would be under the furniture...)

Speedbump71 said:
I have a set of KEF Reference 101's I recapped for my near field setup. They sound great, but I use a small sub alongside my desk to fill in up to about 90-100Hz. Once you get them blended with a sub they sound terrific.
Click to expand...

What sub are you using?

I guess I'm looking for the smallest sub that would blend well with the Rogers. I have no desire to rattle the walls, just to have that almost invisible fill-in of the lower frequencies. Any thoughts on models to look out for, or if this would even be a good idea in my space? Again, it's 8' x 8', tiny & furnished. Thanks for all the advice!
 
Almost any small sub would help. You arent trying to get down to 10HZ, just trying to fill in the first couple octaves. I am using some little Definitive Pro1000 sub I had sitting around from an estate auction I went to. I have heard of good results using little 8" M&K subs with these.
 
Depthgrammar said:
I should mention that these days I'm mostly listening to Brazilian/Latin music, which I suppose falls somewhere on the spectrum between jazz & rock, though most of what I listen to is closer to jazz/folk than funk/fusion - i.e. mostly unamplified instruments, with the occasional electric guitar. How do people feel about British monitors for this sort of thing? Looking for something non-fatiguing because I listen all day, but that can image well & make sense of layered percussion. I read somewhere that the low-end Audio note speakers are good at this, and those are designed by the guy behind a lot of the classic Rogers models...
Click to expand...

Yes the speakers you're probably thinking of is the AX Two from Audio Note. It was designed by Andy Whittle of Rogers LS-3/5a fame. It is excellent. I sold my KEF LS-50 and kept the AX Two - it is IMO ahead of LS-3/5a as well.

The downsides is they look dumpy

Here is my system a few years ago -- Audio Note AX Two (left) KEF LS-50 (middle) and my old Audio Note AN E/Lx (right) (Line Magnetic 219IA amplifier)

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The AX won't win any beauty contests - but it is really great for the money.

The other problem you may have is finding a pair - the AX Two has been selling now for 19 years - back orders are high and Peter Qvortrup (AN's boss) has had to open several plants in Europe to prepare for Brexit issues. Audio Note makes 700 products and so it wait lists even on entry level stuff are fairly long.
 
In your search for small, low budget, nearfield speakers, include the Technics SB-F1, SB-F2, SB-F3 models. Three models of increasing size at prices you can certainly afford. I have all three of them, some also in their MkII versions. They sound fantastic for what they are - obviously don't look for heavy bass notes - and sound pretty damn good comparing them with the sound I've gotten accustomed to, which is the KEF sound.
 
Depthgrammar said:
Those are the ones - I actually like how they look! Old school. I've been watching for a pair to come up 2nd hand, but no luck. That in itself says something. Seems like AN stuff is harder to come by in the US.
Click to expand...

I don't know what your budget is but if willing to buy used - I would look at the Audio Note K. I was at my dealer in Hong Kong and he noted that he had a customer who wanted to upgrade to Audio Note J/SEC Silvers - which is the top of the line $20,000 version of the AN J. So i gave cash and my KEF LS-50s to buy the AN K/Spe. So much better than the KEF!

The AX Two will be tougher to get but maybe around $650 used - the AN K/D or AN K/L or AN K/Lx will range between $1k to $2,500 second hand (depending on age). All of these are copper wired while SPe is silver. But the copper all sound really good. All of these have been selling since 1992. The AN K/D isn't quite as nice as the cabinet is chipboard and only available in black - the L and above come in a variety of finishes and depending how old they are no void Russian Birch front and back with an MDF wrap or the newer ones are full No void Russian birch and seamlessly put together.

Here is my Audio Note K/Spe that I bought in 2003

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You can see that the front has seems and holes for the grill - this version has rubber surrounds. I traded them in for AN J speakers about 6 months later.

But in July I bought the new version (albeit mine are used) AN K/Spe which is full Russian Birch no grill cloths and better sounding foam surrounds.

65017732_10157105951116287_7662213830633586688_o.jpg


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It's interesting what different lighting does here.

The AN K is a significant step up up over the AX Two - it will reach into the mid 40hz range and is a sealed acoustic suspension design with a high (for Acoustic suspension) 90dB sensitivity. It only needs 7 watts per channel.

69672584_10157285446311287_8480862875315863552_o.jpg


My view is to try and buy something that has a little bit of pride of ownership attached and flexibility. The AN K is good enough to be a last speaker. The above picture is my bedroom in Hong Kong and so this is a tight space but they are designed to go into corners or near the wall (like the AX Two) but I think you will appreciate an 8 inch driver over the 6 incher in the AX Two and the more accomplished "meatiness" offered by the AN K.

Plus they come up a little more often - indeed, dealers know their customers and that's how I got these - a rich guy selling them below what he should have been selling them for and he was willing to take the KEF LS-50 and cash to where I could not say no. The little amp is 12 watts per channel (KingKo KA 101) and is way more than enough power. The CD player, DAC and green power bar are from Line Line Magnetic. Speaker cables are the very affordable Audio Note AN-D. If you are considering Spendor and Harbeth and the like definitely consider these - you might be surprised.
 
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