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Replacement Motor for AR-XA Turntable

Yes, George and I are using the same motor, the one he had designed to directly address the original Hurst's flaws. The reason the ad says not suitable for XA/XB is it does take some finagling...it's been over a dozen years since I've done it, so I don't even remember the specifics, but I think it needed a thin gasket (homemade) to go under the top plate between the motor and bottom of that plate. The suspension also needs to be adjusted, as well drilling the new mounting holes. Most people here can handle it, but the average eBay customer might have trouble, and so that's why I wrote up the eBay ad the way I did. Dave
 
Well, I just checked eBay sales from the weekend, and I sold out of motors. (Thanks, AK!) The adapters are backordered until mid-March...so it will be 3 months before they are available again...unless I find a 12VAC adapter I like as much as the Jameco...I'll report back here if I do. Dave
 
ddarch said:
Well, I just checked eBay sales from the weekend, and I sold out of motors. (Thanks, AK!) The adapters are backordered until mid-March...so it will be 3 months before they are available again...unless I find a 12VAC adapter I like as much as the Jameco...I'll report back here if I do. Dave
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Darn! I knew I should have ordered that motor last night when I saw you were down to your last one. Oh well, I'm in the middle of a move right now anyway, so not in much of a position to do anything about it right now. But once things are settled (in about 3 months) and you have these back in stock, I will be.

Thanks for the info Dave.
 
So here's another thought I've had. What would be the disadvantages of going with a low voltage ac motor/wall wort transformer combo and then mounting the transformer in the turntable as a power supply? That would keep the turntable neat and clean on the back with just the need for RCA output jacks and a three prong 115vac computer style cord connector. But my question is, would it add unnecessary noise to the turntable that keeping the power supply off board would eliminate? Just thinking out loud here.
 
ddarch said:
Yes, George and I are using the same motor, the one he had designed to directly address the original Hurst's flaws. The reason the ad says not suitable for XA/XB is it does take some finagling...it's been over a dozen years since I've done it, so I don't even remember the specifics, but I think it needed a thin gasket (homemade) to go under the top plate between the motor and bottom of that plate. The suspension also needs to be adjusted, as well drilling the new mounting holes. Most people here can handle it, but the average eBay customer might have trouble, and so that's why I wrote up the eBay ad the way I did. Dave
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Dave, I have a quick question for you. Since you are using the same motor as George, does that mean your motor is compatible with his outboard Digital Motor Drive (“DMD”) too?
 
Hello all, I have an AR XB that I am told needs a new motor....is the XA motor the same XB? Which is the most suitable replacement/closest to the original?

I had the vinyl veneer on my XB replaced with wood and when the TT was returned, the table won't spin. It was working fine before. Now, when you take off the heavy platter it spins, but when the platter is on it does not. ???? Thanks!!
 
Remove the pulley and put some thin sewing machine oil at the base of the spindle. Let it run a few days, occasionally removing and replacing the dirty oil. That motor needs a push but should keep the platter spinning.
 
Treker said:
I have a modded AR-XA Turntable with a Haydon motor that is noisy and is no longer responding to the addition of lubrication oil, so I'm in need of a new motor. What's the recommended replacement motor these days? I see that Dave from Vinylnirvana.com has a low voltage replacement motor for the AR - The Turntable, but in his eBay ad he says it's not suitable for use on an AR-XA. So I'm curious if anyone has used this motor on an AR-XA, and if so, what modifications had to be done to make it work?
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I know this is an older thread, but I have a solution for noisy Haydon motors that has worked for me 100% of the time. I have repaired lots of them this way so it may benefit future AK members with the same common issue. In the case of a noisy Haydon that runs with that characteristic loud tic tac sound, they are relatively easy to repair and get running silently again, provided the bearing isn't damaged. The best part is that you don't even need to disconnect it from the circuit. The important thing here is to know that you must NOT run a noisy Haydon motor for any length of time, or you will risk damage to the bearing. Certainly, never run it all night like some of the advice says to do! The noise is due to dried-out lubricant that forms grits in the bearing, so running the bearing in this state will almost certainly cause irreparable damage, in which case it will never run silently again. Simply running the motor and dripping a bit of oil into the top bearing will not produce a good result because lubricant cannot get into the bearing fast enough that way. We need to dissolve the hardened lubricant very quickly to preserve the bearing.

After disconnecting the power supply, undo the two screws that hold the motor to the deck. You now need to remove the cap by running a sharp blade around the joint between the cap and the base to cut through the hot-melt glue that holds the cap on. Use a thin blade or small screwdriver to carefully prise off the cap. If it is stubborn and will not release, gently warm the sides of the cap with a hair dryer or hot air gun. Be careful not to cook the wires, so protect the motor and the wiring with a cotton rag. Once you have the cap off, you have completed the hardest part of the repair. We now have to dissolve the old hardened lubricant. You will need a can of "electronic spray with lubricant". This is the same stuff used by electronics repair shops to service noisy volume potentiometers. Place a good wad of paper toweling under and around the motor, and spray the inside of the motor. Let the spray work for about 5 minutes or so, and then give it a few more bursts, turning the motor upside down to let the spray flush out. Give the spindle a few turns by hand and keep going. You will feel the roughness in the bearing disappear. Before replacing the cap, let the spray evaporate and then let the motor run for a bit. If you can still hear a little noise, repeat the process, but remember to keep your fingers away from any wiring and remember to unplug it before spraying any more! You can't overdo this. Flush the crap out! No further lubrication is necessary as the lube will be left behind. Most good lube sprays have a silicon-based lube that remains once the electronic cleaning fluid evaporates. Use a little hot melt glue to replace the cap and then fix the motor back in place. I always cut a thin silicone rubber gasket to fit between the motor and the deck to help reduce vibrations.

So give this repair a go. All up, it should take about 30 mins to achieve a quiet-running Haydon motor.
 
Blackdog61 said:
My Haydon motor has gotten noisy again and I’m considering replacing it with a 24v Hurst and supply. After oiling it I can barely hear it with the belt and platter on and although I don’t know that any motor can be inaudible, I don’t know if I’m being unreasonable.
Thoughts?
http://hurst-motors.com/lyd35directdrive.html
https://www.kccscientific.com/product/apollo-frequency-converter/
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Just repair it as per the previous post, for the cost of a can of electrical lube cleaner.

By the way, those KCC Scientific frequency converters are excellent units if you want to run a tt sourced from OS running at a different mains frequency.
 
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I’ve had it apart before and it was good for quite awhile but I’m not sure it will make it long term.
 
Is there any lateral play in the bearing? What type of oil did you use when you had it apart? Some are totally unsuited as they can oxidise and gum up. These motors run pretty hot, so this is important. A 30 weight motor oil without additives would be OK. These can be small motor mineral oils for mowers and hydraulic oils. But if you can get it, silicone small motor oil.
 
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No, I don’t detect any lateral play, but there is less than 1mm vertically. Getting that top bushing adjusted for minimal play without being too tight is not easy.
For clarification, I had a motor I got from George Merrill many years ago which was either 12v or 24v and came with a step down transformer. That went away on another turntable. I may have used 3 in One on this one but I don’t remember. It gummed up a year or so and I poured some light sewing machine oil to it and it behaved. Yesterday I noticed that familiar ticking sound and poured the sewing machine oil to it, letting it run all night. Nothing dirty came to the surface. It’s nearly silent now, and I don’t want to remove it again.
If it gets pulled I’m inclined to just replace it.
I am asking here for advice to see if anyone has experience with these 24VAC motors, and if the KCC supply would be a good option to drive it.
I have experience with the 3001-001 Hurst motor and am not sure I want to use it.
In the event I change the motor I want an upgrade.
 
The KCC unit is quality + and yes, will do the job to drive that 24VAC motor very nicely. But you can also get a good wall wart 24VAC adaptor for 1/5 the price, or one such as the Rega unit. Just make sure it's the correct frequency for your motor.

With lube oils, most of the mineral ones will evaporate over time with the heat of the motor, and leave behind varnish grits. That's why silicone oils are best.
 
Thx. Honestly, the cheap Hurst motor that U Turn used looks very similar to the one I considered. I’m tempted to spring for the KCC unit and experiment with the cheap motor without installing it, then dropping another $20 on the current Hurst motor. It’s not a lot of money either way.
That said, the Haydon motor is almost dead silent now. I’m just curious to see if running a lower voltage motor with some regulation might be better.
 
Personally, if I had to go down the upgrade path, I'd choose a DC motor with a speed controller or trim pot. Let us know how it goes though!
 
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