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Some Empire Turntable History

robiles said:
I just put the new one on top of the other - did not even try anything else. My 208 is not yet functional, so could not test the improvement, but when i bought it, the platter bearinf used to make metalic rubbing noises. After cleaning, new thrust plate and oiling it is almost silent, but noises can still be heard when putting the ear next to the spindle. Will have to investigate further after i get it spinning.

Another problem i have encountered is the platter is warped, it has a spot that is about 2mm higher then the rest of the platter. I thought about a heat and weight treatment, when i have the time. As a last resort i could visit a machine shop to remove the "excess material" but i am afraid this would unbalance the platter. And to make it look perfewct, both sides have to be straightened - i am a bit reluctant to do that...

edit: the platter and metal chasis apear to be dirty - lots of small dots that do not go away. Is this the famous pitting typical to these tables? If so, then sandblasting would be the only viable cleaning option? What i find a bit strange is that underneath the platter and motor cover, this phenomenon is almost invisible.
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Thought so re: the thrust plate. Thanks!

It sounds like yours may have been subject to some heat or humidity in storage over its life - this would account for the platter warping and chassis pitting appearing as small dots or dirtiness. You cannot sandblast or polish it out as it is not emerging on the surface, but from the inside of the casting outwards - so polishing will in most cases just reveal more of it. Painting or refinishing it entirely is really the only way to address it unfortunately. The platter warpage has you in a tough spot as well.
 
muchachos said:
Thought so re: the thrust plate. Thanks!

It sounds like yours may have been subject to some heat or humidity in storage over its life - this would account for the platter warping and chassis pitting appearing as small dots or dirtiness. You cannot sandblast or polish it out as it is not emerging on the surface, but from the inside of the casting outwards - so polishing will in most cases just reveal more of it. Painting or refinishing it entirely is really the only way to address it unfortunately. The platter warpage has you in a tough spot as well.
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I find it weird that this is such a common problem (the warped platter at least). I also have a dual that suffers from it, but not as bad though. Will sure give it a go as soon as i finish building the motor controller. It might not even be obvious sound wise.

I will give weight, heat and time a go, see if it has an effect. If not i thought about a thick and heavy piece of glass. A lathe could also be an option, but removing 1-2mm on the top and bottom side would reduce weight, ballance and who knows what else, so at the moment it is off the table.

Is the platter made of the same, prone to pitting material? There are traces where the belt used to ride on it that do not want to be removed using 99.9% ipa. Did not try anythins else yet, so any genious idea is welcome (preferably using stuff available to buy in europe)

The pitting does not bother me that much. I might try and salvage some materials for a new plinth, or maybe even try my luck with concrete until I decide what will happen with the original plinth/chassis.
 
Do you have a problem with the platter or the platter trim?

I think ibmight have one of each around here. Just need to look because I'm not sure where they went after the move.
 
cmarti said:
Do you have a problem with the platter or the platter trim?

I think ibmight have one of each around here. Just need to look because I'm not sure where they went after the move.
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I do not know precisely what a platter trim is - is it the top surface? You mentioned one of each, so i am assuming you are refering to the 2 piece platter. Mine is the 208, with a one piece platter. My problem is that while spinning, i can see the outer edge of the platter dip, on an angle of about 20 to 30 degrees (measuring at the spindle). It is not so bad, anyway less than 2mm but i do not have a proper device to measure. The belt marks are on the side surface.

And because a picture is worth 1000 words, here are a few photos. Where the tonearm was mounted, the previous user placed some rubber tubes between - did not manage to remove thr marks left.

20221126_173144.jpg 20221126_173056.jpg 20221126_173037.jpg

Also made a video but i can not upload it here.
 
robiles said:
I do not know precisely what a platter trim is - is it the top surface? You mentioned one of each, so i am assuming you are refering to the 2 piece platter. Mine is the 208, with a one piece platter. .
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My bad, I was trying to be of help but I failed to recognize the model of Empire you're working on.
 
Th
cmarti said:
Much more since I had the cabinet professionally restored and swapped the plexiglass with Etched tempered glass. Also replaced the regular stuff like thrust pad and motor mounts.

1iwLsy6.jpeg
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That looks fantastic!!

I want to replace the plexiglass with glass in mine as well. Afraid to damage the wood though.
 
I'm not trying to be mean or critical GardeGarde, because I have one too. Why do members ask for knowledgable service while not leaving a state where they live? I live in NJ but I'm not going to call you and ask where you live.

A question for me. I had a 598 in the mid-70's, sold it when I moved and bought another on E-bay when I bought a house years later. Why is it so hard to find a TT cable and bracket? The cable and the ground wires are nothing special and there are 5 pin male connectors all over the net. So nobody makes that connector?
 
drjjpdc said:
I...A question for me. I had a 598 in the mid-70's, sold it when I moved and bought another on E-bay when I bought a house years later. Why is it so hard to find a TT cable and bracket? The cable and the ground wires are nothing special and there are 5 pin male connectors all over the net. So nobody makes that connector?
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Nope. That connector is obsolete and hasn't been made in decades. The last widespread equipment to use that connector were CB radios. The last time I saw anything made with that connector was the late 1980's on some Radio Shack car stereo harnesses. I don't think Radio Shack sold the plug/jack itself since the 1970's. These days anytime you see that male or female connector offered for sale, its always NOS.

If by bracket you mean the cartridge sled, eBay has two sellers that make very good reproductions.
 
drjjpdc said:
I'm not trying to be mean or critical GardeGarde, because I have one too. Why do members ask for knowledgable service while not leaving a state where they live? I live in NJ but I'm not going to call you and ask where you live.

A question for me. I had a 598 in the mid-70's, sold it when I moved and bought another on E-bay when I bought a house years later. Why is it so hard to find a TT cable and bracket? The cable and the ground wires are nothing special and there are 5 pin male connectors all over the net. So nobody makes that connector?
Click to expand...
I’m in Western NY State. I have a 990 arm where the arm’s internal wires got pulled out while trying g to fix the que, making the arm unusable. The connector is fine though and I have the cable for that. Disassembly and reassembly of the arm may not be possible without Empire’s original tools at the factory.
 
drjjpdc said:
I'm not trying to be mean or critical GardeGarde, because I have one too. Why do members ask for knowledgable service while not leaving a state where they live? I live in NJ but I'm not going to call you and ask where you live.

A question for me. I had a 598 in the mid-70's, sold it when I moved and bought another on E-bay when I bought a house years later. Why is it so hard to find a TT cable and bracket? The cable and the ground wires are nothing special and there are 5 pin male connectors all over the net. So nobody makes that connector?
Click to expand...
not sure what you're referring to re: "bracket", but these folks make new specialty cabling and connectors a wee bit better than original:

(these are sold, but the seller will make one for you, if you ask):
https://www.ebay.com/itm/175578291654
https://www.ebay.com/itm/175523413827

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275651797931
https://www.ebay.com/itm/275643638400

hth,

doug s.
 
doug s. said:
not sure what you're referring to re: "bracket", but these folks make new specialty cabling and connectors a wee bit better than original:

(these are sold, but the seller will make one for you, if you ask):
https://www.ebay.com/itm/175578291654
https://www.ebay.com/itm/175523413827

https://www.ebay.com/itm/275651797931
https://www.ebay.com/itm/275643638400

hth,

doug s.
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Doug,

Thank you very much. I'm marking Delray on my laptop. There were 2 sellers selling old Empire cables for $250 and $350.
 
drjjpdc said:
Doug,

Thank you very much. I'm marking Delray on my laptop. There were 2 sellers selling old Empire cables for $250 and $350.
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I have the Delray cable on my other 598 and it was a significant upgrade in sound from the original cable. Its light weight also allows the suspension on the 598 to float and bounce better too.
 
I had someone put my Empire 598 together. If I buy a new 5 pin cable, how best to install it? Can I move the TT base just so I can fit my hand under the tonearm plug? I hope I don't have to lift out the whole tonearm.

I'm getting a hum with my TT. I'm using a Cambridge 651 phono preamp and then running cables into my Jolida integrated amp. I never had it before. But if all the cables are plugged in everywhere with the TT off, and I turn on the Cambridge first and then the Jolida a loud hum occurs. If I shut the Jolida off the hum is gone.
 
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drjjpdc said:
I had someone put my Empire 598 together. If I buy a new 5 pin cable, how best to install it? Can I move the TT base just so I can fit my hand under the tonearm plug? I hope I don't have to lift out the whole tonearm.
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this is the tonearm cable for the 598 delrayaudiosales sells on ebay:
s-l500.jpg


doug s.
 
drjjpdc said:
Doug S.,

Can you help with my installation of the cable I asked and maybe with my hum question?
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it should be just plug and play, if your table has the stock arm.

re: the hum, it sounds like you have a ground loop issue. do you get the hum w/the turntable disconnected?
 
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