Well this could be a great thing. And welcome to AK.
Speakerlab History Project
- Thread starter Bratwurst7s
- Start date
Well this could be a great thing. And welcome to AK.
What an interesting development. I'd heard rumors that Paul Johnston had teamed up with Speakerlab to design some new versions of the classics. It's nice to see some actual new models on the market.
There is a small but dedicated group of Speakerlab fans here at Audiokarma. I'll be looking forward to seeing what pops up in your history section.
Cheers,
James
A nice project. Thanks for the effort.
Also, did Mile Nestorovic design any Speaker Lab speakers? I believe he worked there?? Just curious as to which were Mile's designs, and can that be noted on the spreadsheet?
You are welcome.
It's been a fun project but there hasn't really been all that much interest. Nestorovic definately worked at Speakerlab but I don't know the exact time line, ca late '70s until sometime in the early '80s. Afaik he was involved with the S30, S40 and S50 speakers, other than that I'm not sure. If I can pin down exactly which models that he was involved with I can enter a note in the spreadsheet, no problem. Cheers,
James
StimpyWan
Addicted Member
You are welcome.
Cheers,
James
Thanks!
Those S50 speakers look like they would be an epic find. Though I doubt many pair made it to the East Coast, of the U.S.?
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
A nice project. Thanks for the effort.
Also, did Mile Nestorovic design any Speaker Lab speakers? I believe he worked there?? Just curious as to which were Mile's designs, and can that be noted on the spreadsheet?
Yes, Mile did work for Speakerlab for a time. His designs were differentiated from the main line at the time by being two digits, the first of which was the 30, and then later the 50 and 40. He contributed to other designs also, but those where the ones employing his crossover designs for the mis-matched woofers.
With our new speakers we spell out the numbers to differentiate from the older products. Our new designs don't require a complicated crossover design (and all the downside those entailed) to make our woofer systems work (now called Force Balance (TM)), materials and magnet improvements let us get better results with less complication.
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
We started design on the new speakers back in 2008 when Cello Technologies became involved with Speakerlab. We put together a team of engineers (Dan Wiggins, Jeff Hammerstrom, Mike Valarie, and Tom Hall; owner of Cello and investor in Speakerlab). We completed the designs for the Point Line in 2008, releasing the Point1 and Point2 in 2009. We'd worked out the preliminary designs for the new Super Seven and Super Thirty in 2008, and moved forward with detailed designs in 2009 with input and assistance from the original Speakerlab engineers (especially David Graebener, who was providing advice and concent on the down-low, since he was head of engineering at Wisdom at the time). We decided to use Bohlender Graebener ribbons for the mids and tweets based on input from all the founders (especially David, since he felt they were the evolution of what he was originally trying to accomplish with horns at Speakerlab (and of course the Speakerlab Ribbon)). We released the Super Seven in 2012, followed in 2014 by the Seven and Thirty. The Super Thirty was delayed due to B/G going out of business, but eventually Parts Express made a deal to import the parts, so we got the Super Thirty going early this year.
I met Paul at an AES event in 2011(12?) and we chatted about what we were doing at Speakerlab. Since Paul had been rebuilding Speakerlab speakers (and others) for a long time, we paid him to design and build complete woofers for the Legend Series (Thirtys, Super Thirtys, Sevens and Super Sevens). He also did the initial crossover design for the Super Seven. Unfortunately he decided he wanted to do his own speakers along the same lines as what we are doing and went behind our back earlier this year to try and secure the use of the name 'speakerlab' from the former owner of the retail store. Since we had been building the speakers at Speakerlab since 2008 (only switching the branding to SL Speakers in 2013, but obviously still being Speakerlab speakers), that didn't go so well and actually clarified our ability to use the name. We wish him well in his endeavors and are sad that we won't have him as a local resource anymore.
I'd really like to see as much literature from Speaker Lab as possible.
I've mentioned this before, I'm looking for a How to Booklet that had a family
of curves with normalized frequency along the X axis so Fc = 1 Hz and you
multiply that axis by the actual Fc. Normalized dB along the y axis where 0dB
= the passband and you apply your woofer's passband dB/w or dB/2.83 volts
to that axis. Then the family of curves are a function of Qtc, you then just pick
off the Qtc for your system and you have the system frequency response. This
works for sealed box systems and is how professional filter designers did it
before computer simulation was widespread.
If anyone has this, I'd like a copy or scan.
I had this 20 years ago or so but cannot seem to find it.
I've mentioned this before, I'm looking for a How to Booklet that had a family
of curves with normalized frequency along the X axis so Fc = 1 Hz and you
multiply that axis by the actual Fc. Normalized dB along the y axis where 0dB
= the passband and you apply your woofer's passband dB/w or dB/2.83 volts
to that axis. Then the family of curves are a function of Qtc, you then just pick
off the Qtc for your system and you have the system frequency response. This
works for sealed box systems and is how professional filter designers did it
before computer simulation was widespread.
If anyone has this, I'd like a copy or scan.
I had this 20 years ago or so but cannot seem to find it.
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
I do recall seeing one of the design guide issues in one of the piles, we will be scanning everything we have and posting it soon.
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
Speaking of old catalogs and paperwork, I saw earlier in the thread that some people have old catalogs, some even scanned already. We'd love to get high quality scans of anything we don't have. So if you have any, please send me a note here with a picture of the front and back covers so we can see if it is something we have, or if it is something we need. If it is one we don't have, we'd love to get high quality scans of it, or we will pay postage both ways to have you send it so we can scan it (we promise not to lose or damage it!).
This will be a very nice public service. I'm really looking forward to seeing more factual info, the lack of which is what got me started with my spreadsheet in the first place.
A couple of questions:
Have we Speakerlab fans been living in a vacuum? You released the new S7 version in 2012 and none of us have heard of it. That's tragic. We need to get the word out.
So it seems that with the 2008 date of new developments at Speakerlab that some serious new investments and changes must have happened. There is little to no public information as to what has been happening at Speakerlab in the last 20+ years. Please enlighten us about what has been going on. We are interested.
Lastly, (for today,
), who are we conversing with here? It's always friendlier to be conversing with a known person than with an entity. I'll start. My name is James. I bought my ribbon Sevens in 1983 and still have them (although they have been seriously modified) and listen to them almost every day. Cheers,
James
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
This will be a very nice public service. I'm really looking forward to seeing more factual info, the lack of which is what got me started with my spreadsheet in the first place.
A couple of questions:
Have we Speakerlab fans been living in a vacuum? You released the new S7 version in 2012 and none of us have heard of it. That's tragic. We need to get the word out.
So it seems that with the 2008 date of new developments at Speakerlab that some serious new investments and changes must have happened. There is little to no public information as to what has been happening at Speakerlab in the last 20+ years. Please enlighten us about what has been going on. We are interested.
Lastly, (for today,
Cheers,
James
I don't know about living in a vacuum, but we haven't been pushing the marketing other than through our facebook page, and not even much of that (when we removed all the speaker information from the old speakerlab page we did become harder to find). Our initial client focus for our Legends series has been custom integrators that design home theater and recording studios and we just started marketing them more widely in the last couple of years.
My name is Tom, Here is a blurb from my Linkedin page that answers some of your questions:
- President
Company Name Cello Technologies Seattle
Dates Employed Jul 2000 – Present
Employment Duration 18 yrs
I purchased the Seattle operations of Cello Technologies when Cello decided to close national operations due to the economic downturn in 2000. Grew the company through some of the largest integration projects ever completed in seattle. Expanded the scope of services offered to include all aspects of low voltage work in large residential projects (this was largely due to client requests that we be able to provide our level of service for all their systems). Added staff that focuses on medium and large yacht projects (80 - 300+ feet). Grew the engineering consultation part of the business to provide development help to companies entering this business, as well as direct project consultation for audio/video in marine, commercial and aviation projects.
- Edit position Principal Design Engineer, owner
Principal Design Engineer, owner
Company Name SL Speakers (Speaker Lab, LLC.)
Dates Employed Jul 2013 – Present
Employment Duration 5 yrs
Location Seattle, WA
I got involved informally with Speakerlab in 2007 as a consultant, and formally in the fall of 2008 as an investor and advisor. Along with revamping their retail presence to modernize it and leverage their history, I created a team of audio engineers to develop a speaker line relevant to today's market. We consulted with the original Speakerlab engineers (who'd long since moved on) so that we didn't lose any of the 'secret sauce' that helped define the brand, and the first new speaker (the Point1) was unveiled at an employee reunion in the fall of 2009. The feedback from all the original engineers, as well as 50+ former employees, let us quickly update and move into production later that year! We were also able to sit down with the Speakerlab founders and review our product plans and tweak them based on their input, which lead directly to the designs for our Legend Series. Our new speakers (Speakerlab had ceased production of speakers in the mid '90's) focus on the DIY customer that Speakerlab had always attracted, as well as integration companies (like Cello) who need high performance, customized products to compete against the internet and big box stores. In late 2009 we began producing speakers under the Speakerlab brand, but spun the speaker business off from the retail store in 2013 as SL Speakers (Speaker Lab LLC.) so we could focus more directly on the speaker business. And though the retail Speakerlab store didn't survive the changes to the retail climate, we have continue to innovate and evolve the speaker line to meet the requirements of our clients.
- Edit position Partner
Partner
Company Name Speakerlab
Dates Employed Nov 2008 – Nov 2015
Employment Duration 7 yrs 1 mo
Location Seattle
Bringing my experience in ultra-high end custom audio/video to help Speakerlab grow in retail audio/video as well as re-developing their speaker and speaker kit lines.
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
Is the woofer below or above the tweeter? What size is the woofer?
(edit) If the woofer is a 5 1/4" and is on top, it is a DAS-2 circa 1985/6. This was the replacement for the .1 when they created the DAS (Digital Audio Speaker) line.
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SpeakerlabSL
New Member
Some pics of the new stuff...(and a shot of new vs old).
audiotemp
Super Member
StimpyWan
Addicted Member
Beautiful speakers. Thanks for sharing. It looks like you're using Christie Digital BG planar mids and tweeters on some models. I'd love to hear them. Any plans for a dealer network, or are these direct-sales provided?
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
Thanks! I think we have the design guide, but that is a catalog we were lacking (it's actually one of the last full catalogs that was published).
SpeakerlabSL
New Member
Yes, we are using the BG mids and tweeters (keeping it in the family). It really threw a wrench in things when BG closed, stopped us from building the Super versions of the Seven and Thirty for over a year. Luckily we were able to lobby Christie (along with Parts Express) to let the factory continue to build them and make them available to us.
We are working with a few custom integrators currently and are looking to add dealers as we ramp production up (our Point Line is more or less in stock, but currently the larger speakers are built to order).
StimpyWan
Addicted Member
Thanks for the update. That's great info. And Christie made a lot of people nervous, after the BG buy out. But I'm glad that they saw fit to start selling the Neo drivers aftermarket again.
Also, one other question. Do any of the dual woofer models use the Nestorovic bass configuration/circuit? If so, that would be awesome!