Starting From Scratch
- Thread starter Outland
- Start date
J English
Super Member
Yamaha and Harman Kardon are my favorite vintage receivers. Nice ones around for $40 - 140 for sure.
CDs used: look at Onkyo, Marantz, Cambridge Audio
Speakers: Infinity, KEF Codas, Polk Audio Monitor series, PSBs, Paradigm
Tape: Nakamichi, Harman Kardon, Yamaha
You should be able to put together a killer system for well under $1000. I buy almost exclusively on the 'Bay and I get great things all the time. Yeah, Marantz receivers are great, but you will pay more in the $200s for a good entry level one like the 2230 or the 2245. On the other hand, if you like a very warm sound, this might be the way to go.
I just got my latest Yamaha, a CR-240, fired up. $45 shipped and she sounds great coupled with my Polk Monitor 4's that I got for $55.
Go to it! There are FABULOUS deals out there!
J
CDs used: look at Onkyo, Marantz, Cambridge Audio
Speakers: Infinity, KEF Codas, Polk Audio Monitor series, PSBs, Paradigm
Tape: Nakamichi, Harman Kardon, Yamaha
You should be able to put together a killer system for well under $1000. I buy almost exclusively on the 'Bay and I get great things all the time. Yeah, Marantz receivers are great, but you will pay more in the $200s for a good entry level one like the 2230 or the 2245. On the other hand, if you like a very warm sound, this might be the way to go.
I just got my latest Yamaha, a CR-240, fired up. $45 shipped and she sounds great coupled with my Polk Monitor 4's that I got for $55.
Go to it! There are FABULOUS deals out there!
J
terra1
Addicted Member
I wouldn't let the dimensions of the reciever entirely dictate what I get. Instead of worrying about fitting the receiver in the space, if its a good receiver I would make accommodations to fit it whether using another cabinet or piece of furniture or another room.
That said, the Sansui 4000 is a great receiver. With any vintage you may want to get a service manual to set bias or DC and have a parts list. Make sure FM/AM is working. Stereo light lights up, etc.
If you like the Boston sound, my experience is their sonic character is consistent over the years. I have a pair of Boston A-100s, CR7s, VR40s. If you don't want to refoam, look at the later ones which may have rubber surrounds.
That said, the Sansui 4000 is a great receiver. With any vintage you may want to get a service manual to set bias or DC and have a parts list. Make sure FM/AM is working. Stereo light lights up, etc.
If you like the Boston sound, my experience is their sonic character is consistent over the years. I have a pair of Boston A-100s, CR7s, VR40s. If you don't want to refoam, look at the later ones which may have rubber surrounds.
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terra1
Addicted Member
I have a pair of B&W DM1400s and they are great. This was the time manufacturerers started incorporating use of multiple smaller drivers instead of larger 12" and 15" woofers.
Outland
Active Member
Goldwax: Thank you, that will come in handy if I end up purchasing the pair I saw on CL.
J English: Fellow 'bay user, eh? There isn't much in the way of audio equipment 'round these parts so I'm forced to go hunting on the internet for most of my audio buys, so unfortunately I don't get a chance to audition most gear.
terra1: Dimensions aren't a deal-breaker, but if possible I'd like to have equipment that fits in my current setup.
The unit I purchased was apparently "cleaned" and "set up" but I'd love to be able to do the things you listed anyway. Could you help me find out how to set bias and DC? I don't even know what that means. Should I search that?
I've never heard a Boston, but from what people seem to say it seems like a good fit for me.
J English, it's interesting you bring up CD players. I'm trying to decide what CD player would be best for this setup at the moment.
Thanks all around guys, you have really made setting up a hi-fi fun and clear.
J English: Fellow 'bay user, eh? There isn't much in the way of audio equipment 'round these parts so I'm forced to go hunting on the internet for most of my audio buys, so unfortunately I don't get a chance to audition most gear.
terra1: Dimensions aren't a deal-breaker, but if possible I'd like to have equipment that fits in my current setup.
The unit I purchased was apparently "cleaned" and "set up" but I'd love to be able to do the things you listed anyway. Could you help me find out how to set bias and DC? I don't even know what that means. Should I search that?
I've never heard a Boston, but from what people seem to say it seems like a good fit for me.
J English, it's interesting you bring up CD players. I'm trying to decide what CD player would be best for this setup at the moment.
Thanks all around guys, you have really made setting up a hi-fi fun and clear.
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Outland
Active Member
I forgot to ask about the very thing I hit the "Post Reply" button for in the first place.
On the other end, I saw that my local Radioshack had some nice funny-looking cables under the brand "Auvio". Searching around, it seems people are ok with them. Prices are fair as well.
On the other end, I saw that my local Radioshack had some nice funny-looking cables under the brand "Auvio". Searching around, it seems people are ok with them. Prices are fair as well.
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terra1
Addicted Member
Check the Sansui forum. There is a thread there on some available adjustments.
As far as interconnects, it really depends on the quality of the equipment you have.
I tried better interconnects and speaker wire when I bought newer expensive components.
I'm not sure you would notice that much difference with some vintage gear. In fact of the jumbo cables I got, it would be overkill for some of my Realistic receivers. I would be afraid they would be too tight and big for the flimsy back panels.
The way I approached it was, I got better interconnects as I got better equipment. It was totally proportional to the investment I made. I had bought a $2300 AV receiver and got a pair of $1400 speakers. It was cheaper to upgrade interconnects and wire than replace the system. I might try to tweak to see if I could get more detail. I saw improvement over the video cables, so I tried audio cables and speaker wire. There were specific subtle improvements I was looking for. There were specific CDs I was trying to see if I could get a smoother sound. Keep in mind probably 99% of the other CDs sounded great. This was before I learned that mastering can make a difference. I think I still was able to get less distorted sound and more detail by getting better cables and wire.
Having gotten into vintage 3 years ago, I don't spend a lot on expensive new cable and wire. I use some of the better interconnects I replaced at one time or another on for CD and tape, but for the most part I use regular cable and wire on the cheap vintage stuff. I have found what makes more difference is the combination of speakers and components.
I guess what I'm saying is -- like gambling, don't spend more than you can afford to lose or expect to gain.
As far as interconnects, it really depends on the quality of the equipment you have.
I tried better interconnects and speaker wire when I bought newer expensive components.
I'm not sure you would notice that much difference with some vintage gear. In fact of the jumbo cables I got, it would be overkill for some of my Realistic receivers. I would be afraid they would be too tight and big for the flimsy back panels.
The way I approached it was, I got better interconnects as I got better equipment. It was totally proportional to the investment I made. I had bought a $2300 AV receiver and got a pair of $1400 speakers. It was cheaper to upgrade interconnects and wire than replace the system. I might try to tweak to see if I could get more detail. I saw improvement over the video cables, so I tried audio cables and speaker wire. There were specific subtle improvements I was looking for. There were specific CDs I was trying to see if I could get a smoother sound. Keep in mind probably 99% of the other CDs sounded great. This was before I learned that mastering can make a difference. I think I still was able to get less distorted sound and more detail by getting better cables and wire.
Having gotten into vintage 3 years ago, I don't spend a lot on expensive new cable and wire. I use some of the better interconnects I replaced at one time or another on for CD and tape, but for the most part I use regular cable and wire on the cheap vintage stuff. I have found what makes more difference is the combination of speakers and components.
I guess what I'm saying is -- like gambling, don't spend more than you can afford to lose or expect to gain.
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terra1
Addicted Member
I guess lost in my parable is that there was something I was looking to improve.
Don't get lost in formulas.
I was trying to couch my advice knowing that some on here will say they think expensive cable and wire is a waste of money.
All I did was a result of trial and error since there were no forums like this for me back then. I incrementally bought more expensive cables and speaker wire until I said good enough.
Looking for audio perfection can be expensive.
First, listen to what you have. Is there something missing? Get to know what your tastes are. Develop your listening skills.
I bought my Sansui 4000 for $25 at a garage sale. All the lights were out. I found the problem was a broken solder join. They sound fine with regular RCA cables and Polk Monitor 5 speakers. I don't have much incentive trying more expensive cables or wire with it.
Part of the audio journey is learning what makes a difference as you go. Like I said, if you can afford it, it doesn't hurt to give it a try. Then you'll know.
Everybody has different tastes and experiences and goals. There have been advice that have been helpful here and some that I'm glad I didn't know about because I would have missed out on some things that conflict with the conventional wisdom.
Don't get lost in formulas.
I was trying to couch my advice knowing that some on here will say they think expensive cable and wire is a waste of money.
All I did was a result of trial and error since there were no forums like this for me back then. I incrementally bought more expensive cables and speaker wire until I said good enough.
Looking for audio perfection can be expensive.
First, listen to what you have. Is there something missing? Get to know what your tastes are. Develop your listening skills.
I bought my Sansui 4000 for $25 at a garage sale. All the lights were out. I found the problem was a broken solder join. They sound fine with regular RCA cables and Polk Monitor 5 speakers. I don't have much incentive trying more expensive cables or wire with it.
Part of the audio journey is learning what makes a difference as you go. Like I said, if you can afford it, it doesn't hurt to give it a try. Then you'll know.
Everybody has different tastes and experiences and goals. There have been advice that have been helpful here and some that I'm glad I didn't know about because I would have missed out on some things that conflict with the conventional wisdom.
Outland
Active Member
How would I know if something's missing? I've never heard anything better, unlike you. I'm trying to build the best theoretical setup, and go from there.
So you're saying I shouldn't upgrade my cables...?
People on AK are far more knowledgeable than me, I'm just trying to get as much information as I can on the matter.
So you're saying I shouldn't upgrade my cables...?
People on AK are far more knowledgeable than me, I'm just trying to get as much information as I can on the matter.
terra1
Addicted Member
I guess lost in my parable is that there was something I was looking to improve.
Don't get lost in formulas.
I was trying to couch my advice knowing that some on here will say they think expensive cable and wire is a waste of money.
All I did was a result of trial and error since there were no forums like this for me back then. I incrementally bought more expensive cables and speaker wire until I said good enough.
Looking for audio perfection can be expensive.
First, listen to what you have. Is there something missing? Get to know what your tastes are. Develop your listening skills.
I bought my Sansui 4000 for $25 at a garage sale. All the lights were out. I found the problem was a broken solder join. They sound fine with regular RCA cables and Polk Monitor 5 speakers. I don't have much incentive trying more expensive cables or wire with it.
Part of the audio journey is learning what makes a difference as you go. Like I said, if you can afford it, it doesn't hurt to give it a try. Then you'll know.
Everybody has different tastes and experiences and goals. There have been advice that have been helpful here and some that I'm glad I didn't know about because I would have missed out on some things that conflict with the conventional wisdom.
Outland
Active Member
Well, I guess I'm missing something.
Anyways, I'm on the hunt for speakers now. The Boston Acoustics A60s look nice, as do the Bowers & Wilkins DM12s. However, neither are available in my local CL at the moment.
If anyone has any other suggestions for speakers, I would appreciate them.
Anyways, I'm on the hunt for speakers now. The Boston Acoustics A60s look nice, as do the Bowers & Wilkins DM12s. However, neither are available in my local CL at the moment.
If anyone has any other suggestions for speakers, I would appreciate them.
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goldwax
dozy ming-mong
What city are you in?
Any Boston Acoustics A series speaker is good: A40, A60 and A70 are the bookshelf speakers, though the A70s are fairly large. A100, A150, A200 and A400 are the floorstanding models.
The later Boston Acoustics T series is also well worth considering: T830, t930, T-1030 (all floorstanders) as is the later HD series: HD5, HD7, HD8, HD9.
Question: why do you want bookshelf speakers, exactly? What's the size of your room? Where are you planning on putting your speakers? Note that bookshelf speakers should be placed on stands, not in an actual bookshelves or on the same surface as your other components, especially your turntable.
If you're looking at some cheap used bookshelf speakers, I have some early-'90s JBL P20 speakers, which are good. There are also P10 and P40 and possibly others.
You could also avoid all the hassle of used speakers and get a pair from this well-regarded Pioneer budget line: http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=385161
MJWPicMan
MJWPicMan
Start going to audio dealers and listening to different kinds of speakers to find out what kind of presentation you like. Maybe you like a speaker that has a more forward presentation like B&W, or maybe you will find out you prefer a speaker with a neutral presentation like Vandersteen. Maybe you will learn that you like an electrostatic or planar speaker like Magneplanar or a brighter speaker like JBL. See if you can find some British Celestions or Spendors. They both make great sounding bookshelf speakers. Don't feel obligated. A couple of trips to a couple of dealers can be very educational. Speaker presentation can be very different. And start going and auditioning speakers that people are selling on CL. And take your time. Don't buy on impulse and don't buy the first pair that you like, buy the pair that you absolutely love. Remember, you have to live with them. So when you are auditionig be critical and do a long audition. It takes time for speakers to reveal their strengths and weaknesses, and many times the first impression starts to change as you continue to listen.
As far as cable goes it can make a big difference in the way your stereo sounds. Your stereo can't sound any better than it's weakest link, and that's frequently cable. I like AudioQuest, and you can frequently buy Audioquest Ruby or Topaz interconnects pretty cheaply on eBay or Audiogon. This is a link to AudioQuest's cable archive page; http://www.audioquest.com/archive/ and this will give you a lot of information about speaker and interconnect theory and construction. Be patient, and you'll be rewarded.
Outland
Active Member
Thanks for the advice, Martin.
I've thought about seperates, but I simply don't have the space for all those components. Having a receiver and CD player already leaves two huge pieces of equipment, so I think that setup is a nice compromise between quality and largeness.
I would love to have an audio dealer around here. However, I'll audition the ones that I find on CL.
I've thought about seperates, but I simply don't have the space for all those components. Having a receiver and CD player already leaves two huge pieces of equipment, so I think that setup is a nice compromise between quality and largeness.
I would love to have an audio dealer around here. However, I'll audition the ones that I find on CL.
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MJWPicMan
MJWPicMan
In that case I recommend you look into NAD, Rotel, or Luxman recievers. These are all a step up in sound quality from the general generic Sansui/Pioneer/Kenwood Japanese receivers. And with as much money as you have you should be able to get a really nice receiver.