Haven't you downloaded the owners manual, schematic, lo res and high res service manuals from the Pioneer Manual database???
3300 ohms 2 watts.
3300 ohms 2 watts.
SX-1010 tuner
- Thread starter Maddart
- Start date
Yes,m get it and you might as well get it all at digikey, usually I recommend mouser because of their small order policy and usually I don't have large enough orders to qualify for digikey. The 1056 has a very low Vce saturation voltage, and thus does not generate a lot of heat while operating in these circuits.
Yes, absolutely. Those are the (EchoWars) preferred brands / types.....
Maddart
Active Member
Just recieved in the Nichicon KG Gold Tune 22000uf 63v caps from percy audio. 2 pieces for $60.00 with shipping.
I Can't find a datasheet for this on the web.
On the can it says CE 85c negative black, I am going to assume that the post with the black rivet is the negative? There is no other indication of negative. Has anyone worked with these before?
Thanks
Mark
I Can't find a datasheet for this on the web.
On the can it says CE 85c negative black, I am going to assume that the post with the black rivet is the negative? There is no other indication of negative. Has anyone worked with these before?
Thanks
Mark
On the can it says CE 85c negative black, I am going to assume that the post with the black rivet is the negative?
That is correct. REMEMBER, on one the NEGATIVE is grounded, and on the other the POSITIVE is grounded!!! That is a common mistake that nobody likes to admit.
Maddart
Active Member
Just replaced c3,c4,c5,c6 and Q7 on the protection circuit. Used the ztx1056A, added the 1n4004 diode between pin 9 and 10 and replaced the 18000uf caps with the nichicon gold 22000uf caps and 3.3k3w resistors.
The protection circuit is still cutting in and out. It will play for several minutes cut out than back in and play for a while longer before cutting out again. The same symptoms as before component replacement.(The tuner is also cutting out again). Must have gremlins.
Pin 3 on the protection board varies from -3vdc to 5v dc.
All the solder joints are good to IPC610 standards anyway. cleaned the board with flux cleaner and let evaporate before firing up. Not sure where to go from here.
Mark
The protection circuit is still cutting in and out. It will play for several minutes cut out than back in and play for a while longer before cutting out again. The same symptoms as before component replacement.(The tuner is also cutting out again). Must have gremlins.
Pin 3 on the protection board varies from -3vdc to 5v dc.
All the solder joints are good to IPC610 standards anyway. cleaned the board with flux cleaner and let evaporate before firing up. Not sure where to go from here.
Mark
Where we are at is that we can now trust that the protection circuit (or at least the most problematic parts of it) is behaving itself and that the protection circuit is justified in disconnecting the speakers.
I'm not in a position today to get into it (sorry - family stuff) but IIRC that pin 1 and 3 are the amplifier outputs and pin 3 going from -3vdc to +5vdc means that that amplifier channel NEEDS attention.
You could try cooling the components of that amplifier channel (if you can follow the service manual and locate them solo) with either a can of freeze spray or "canned air" keyboard duster when the protection circuit disconnects the speakers. Stick more with the "little" transistors rather than the power output devices.
When the circuit cuts out, how long does it stay out on it's own, (no cycling of power) and does cycling the power speed up it's recovery?
Maddart
Active Member
About an hour ago i turned it on and the relay cut out 4 times in 5 minutes. The length of time that the relay stays off is probably 1-2 seconds. I just turned the unit back on when i signed on line and the relay clicked off once and has been behaving for ten minutes until it just clicked off again And its been about 10 more minutes and it just cut out again for 1-2 seconds.
Note: pin 3 is running at about .015vdc then it jumped to +4vdc and initiated the relay. when the relay opened the meter reads OL until the relay resets.Not sure what IIRC is and am not sure what to do next. Could it be the DC offset?
Have a great thanksgiving.
Mark
Note: pin 3 is running at about .015vdc then it jumped to +4vdc and initiated the relay. when the relay opened the meter reads OL until the relay resets.Not sure what IIRC is and am not sure what to do next. Could it be the DC offset?
Have a great thanksgiving.
Mark
IIRC = If I remember correctly.
I'd say yes, since you said it hit +4V and then the relay kicked in.
If the offset is indeed drifting that bad, you have:
1. Bad/dried-up caps on the amp board
2. Bad DC offset trimpot
3. Damaged transistor junction on one or more transistors of that channel, or maybe a bad solder joint.
Going to be somewhat less than fun to track it down. The 1010 amp board, as I mentioned above, is less than the ideal unit to teach yourself on.
Do take note of the small multijunction diodes mounted on long wires from the driver boards to the heatsinks (used in the bias section for temperature compensation). If you decide tear into this, they need to be taken loose and carefully moved out of the way. The leads are fragile, and if you break them you have a real problem on your hands. (FYI, if you do break one, turning on the amp with a broken bias diode means instant vaporization of the output transistor and drivers.
Maddart
Active Member
Good morning all
After reading your reply (EW) i thought i'd have a look at the amp boards. looking from the front of the unit the one PCB on the left has pin 21 goobered with solder. The one PCB on the right has pin 22 goobered with solder. Both of these have a woven fabric insulation over them. I slide back the insulation the wire has been twisted and soldered.
(It looks as if someone has been through this before on this unit).
Now i'm afraid to turn this thing on for fear that a wire could have fractured under this woven material. From what i can see it looks to be very fragile. and not sure where the multijunction diodes are located.(let me guess the diodes have a 56 on the left one and a 54 on the right one mounted to the heat sink with phillips screw)
FYI, if you do break one, turning on the amp with a broken bias diode means instant vaporization of the output transistor and drivers.
Perhaps it would be wise of me to seek a technician that has experience with these amps in the chicagoland area.(Suggestions welcome)
Would love to get this unit up and running and don't want to risk damage to this beauty.
Thank You
Mark
After reading your reply (EW) i thought i'd have a look at the amp boards. looking from the front of the unit the one PCB on the left has pin 21 goobered with solder. The one PCB on the right has pin 22 goobered with solder. Both of these have a woven fabric insulation over them. I slide back the insulation the wire has been twisted and soldered.
(It looks as if someone has been through this before on this unit).
Now i'm afraid to turn this thing on for fear that a wire could have fractured under this woven material. From what i can see it looks to be very fragile. and not sure where the multijunction diodes are located.(let me guess the diodes have a 56 on the left one and a 54 on the right one mounted to the heat sink with phillips screw)
FYI, if you do break one, turning on the amp with a broken bias diode means instant vaporization of the output transistor and drivers.
Perhaps it would be wise of me to seek a technician that has experience with these amps in the chicagoland area.(Suggestions welcome)
Would love to get this unit up and running and don't want to risk damage to this beauty.
Thank You
Mark
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Your guess about "54" and "56" IS correct.
It may have come from the factory like that.
As for chicago area repairs, I waited for others to respond first, but now I toot my own horn. I fix things for folks. I'm wayyyy too close to O'Hare airport. And you may not believe the pile (or more accurately, line) of things waiting for fixing.
As for the diodes, ohmmeter tests before restoring power are manditory to be sure nothing is open.
As for the amps themselves there are 4 small capacitors on each that could cause the problem, but what I am DEEPLY suspicious about are the two 2sc1451 transistors (the round metal cans in the pictures) which DO NOT have a good reputation.
If you wish, before resorting to dropping it off (but considering that the tuner drops the signal meter deflection, MAYBE NOT) I could talk you through replacing the four caps and two transistors per channel, which if you EXPLICITLY follow my directions, and NOT JUMP AHEAD, we can do in relative safety.
Otherwise, I'm near the junction of Irving Park Road (IL 19) and Route 83 just southwest of O'Hare airport, and am pretty much home 24/7 in case your travels pass near by.
It may have come from the factory like that.
As for chicago area repairs, I waited for others to respond first, but now I toot my own horn. I fix things for folks. I'm wayyyy too close to O'Hare airport. And you may not believe the pile (or more accurately, line) of things waiting for fixing.
As for the diodes, ohmmeter tests before restoring power are manditory to be sure nothing is open.
As for the amps themselves there are 4 small capacitors on each that could cause the problem, but what I am DEEPLY suspicious about are the two 2sc1451 transistors (the round metal cans in the pictures) which DO NOT have a good reputation.
If you wish, before resorting to dropping it off (but considering that the tuner drops the signal meter deflection, MAYBE NOT) I could talk you through replacing the four caps and two transistors per channel, which if you EXPLICITLY follow my directions, and NOT JUMP AHEAD, we can do in relative safety.
Otherwise, I'm near the junction of Irving Park Road (IL 19) and Route 83 just southwest of O'Hare airport, and am pretty much home 24/7 in case your travels pass near by.
Maddart
Active Member
I will ohm out the diodes, Just wanted to know that i could do that without damage the components.
As for the amps i am capable of removing and replacing the components providing i don't have to be double jointed to access the board. Don't have the tools (signal gen., o-scope etc.)to completely troubleshoot myself.
Are multijunction diodes available in case one is damaged?
I also have the caps and heat sinks to upgrade the PS board.
I would like to repair the unit myself if possible, but don't want to get in over my head.
Your location is about 30 minutes away should i get myself into trouble.
Thanks
Mark
MJ Diode: one direction-Other direction
L= 56 1.94M ohm - .81M ohm
R= 54 2.04M ohm -.90M ohm
As for the amps i am capable of removing and replacing the components providing i don't have to be double jointed to access the board. Don't have the tools (signal gen., o-scope etc.)to completely troubleshoot myself.
Are multijunction diodes available in case one is damaged?
I also have the caps and heat sinks to upgrade the PS board.
I would like to repair the unit myself if possible, but don't want to get in over my head.
Your location is about 30 minutes away should i get myself into trouble.
Thanks
Mark
MJ Diode: one direction-Other direction
L= 56 1.94M ohm - .81M ohm
R= 54 2.04M ohm -.90M ohm
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You need to read this about testing diodes and transistors. Ohmmeters just won't cut it. The ohmmeter tests I spoke of will be VERY specific as to WHERE to read things from and what to expect to see to verify the complete integrity of the bias circuits. One of the things you WON'T see is ohms continuity through the diodes, but rather about 1.8 volts. You will understand after you read the link above.
The multijunction diodes are just about the rarest and hardest to find of all the generic vintage components. A LOT of gear has ended up as paperweights and doorstops because THESE parts cannot be worked around, unlike transistors with different cases etc.
Once you start working on those boards, the diodes should be seperated from the heatsinks and tucked away in a SAFE place in that area with a minimum of bending of leads, especially in places where the leads are already bent.
There is a reason for my avatar. It was awarded to me by EchoWars after a particularily harrowing and damaging "repair" session. If I remember correctly, somebody jumped ahead on their own, and I didn't get a chance to get them to do the necessary tests to avert disaster. One of the OTHER comments in the form of a picture during that thread was a picture of an h-bomb mushroom cloud. Another disasterous thread again involved someone with just enough knowledge to be dangerous, and the false confidence to not pay attention and they jumped ahead.
By Monday morning I will have a list of parts posted for mouser.com for a couple of bucks of parts for the 1010's amps and whatever else. The soonest they can be shipped is monday afternoon anyways. I would like you to post what parts you already have that have not been put into the unit, and also clarify whatever you have already done to it.
Once you start poking around in the amplifier area, then power stays OFF until I am sure nothing will be damaged by turning it back on.
There is nothing techs hate worse than cleaning up after someone else damages things that can be avoided.
There are a few loong threads in the Pioneer forum within the last year where involved repairs were successfully completed. It will be very helpful to read them, as you are about to tread the same path (hopefully quicker) and should be able to pick up quite a bit, thus saving some typing.
The multijunction diodes are just about the rarest and hardest to find of all the generic vintage components. A LOT of gear has ended up as paperweights and doorstops because THESE parts cannot be worked around, unlike transistors with different cases etc.
Once you start working on those boards, the diodes should be seperated from the heatsinks and tucked away in a SAFE place in that area with a minimum of bending of leads, especially in places where the leads are already bent.
There is a reason for my avatar. It was awarded to me by EchoWars after a particularily harrowing and damaging "repair" session. If I remember correctly, somebody jumped ahead on their own, and I didn't get a chance to get them to do the necessary tests to avert disaster. One of the OTHER comments in the form of a picture during that thread was a picture of an h-bomb mushroom cloud. Another disasterous thread again involved someone with just enough knowledge to be dangerous, and the false confidence to not pay attention and they jumped ahead.
By Monday morning I will have a list of parts posted for mouser.com for a couple of bucks of parts for the 1010's amps and whatever else. The soonest they can be shipped is monday afternoon anyways. I would like you to post what parts you already have that have not been put into the unit, and also clarify whatever you have already done to it.
Once you start poking around in the amplifier area, then power stays OFF until I am sure nothing will be damaged by turning it back on.
There is nothing techs hate worse than cleaning up after someone else damages things that can be avoided.
There are a few loong threads in the Pioneer forum within the last year where involved repairs were successfully completed. It will be very helpful to read them, as you are about to tread the same path (hopefully quicker) and should be able to pick up quite a bit, thus saving some typing.
Maddart
Active Member
Sounds good- Diode check L=1.54v R=1.46V fluke 177.
Looking at this amp, i'm not sure where the MJ diodes can be tucked to be out of the way.
Maybe not the best idea but could the leads of the diodes be cut off the posts then resoldered? As i said earlier, sliding the woven insulation back reveals what appears to be two wires that look as if they were twisted together then soldered.
The parts that i have on hand are:
Digi-key#
4-p10323-nd 100uf/50v
1-p11198-nd 100uf/16v
2-p10321-nd 47uf/50v
1-p10246-nd 330uf/16v
1-493-1808-nd 4.7uf/25v
4-493-1985-nd 470uf/100v
2-p10271-nd 220uf/25v
4-p10285-nd 2200uf/25v
4-p10775-nd 100uf/100v
2-p10333-nd 1000uf/50v
1-1n4004 diode
2-ztx1056a transistor
also have 3 of 3 different types of heat sinks and a tube of dow corning thermal adhesive.
WORK ALREADY PERFORMED
Replaced c3,c4,c5,c6 and Q7 on the protection circuit.
Used
2-P10246-ND 330uf/16v
1-P11198-ND 100uf/16v
1-493-1808-ND 4.7uf/25v
1-ztx1056A
added the 1n4004 diode between pin 9and 10 Per your instructions and cleaned PCB with flux cleaner.
Replaced the 18000uf caps with the nichicon gold 22000uf caps and 3.3k3w resistors.
Looking at this amp, i'm not sure where the MJ diodes can be tucked to be out of the way.
Maybe not the best idea but could the leads of the diodes be cut off the posts then resoldered? As i said earlier, sliding the woven insulation back reveals what appears to be two wires that look as if they were twisted together then soldered.
The parts that i have on hand are:
Digi-key#
4-p10323-nd 100uf/50v
1-p11198-nd 100uf/16v
2-p10321-nd 47uf/50v
1-p10246-nd 330uf/16v
1-493-1808-nd 4.7uf/25v
4-493-1985-nd 470uf/100v
2-p10271-nd 220uf/25v
4-p10285-nd 2200uf/25v
4-p10775-nd 100uf/100v
2-p10333-nd 1000uf/50v
1-1n4004 diode
2-ztx1056a transistor
also have 3 of 3 different types of heat sinks and a tube of dow corning thermal adhesive.
WORK ALREADY PERFORMED
Replaced c3,c4,c5,c6 and Q7 on the protection circuit.
Used
2-P10246-ND 330uf/16v
1-P11198-ND 100uf/16v
1-493-1808-ND 4.7uf/25v
1-ztx1056A
added the 1n4004 diode between pin 9and 10 Per your instructions and cleaned PCB with flux cleaner.
Replaced the 18000uf caps with the nichicon gold 22000uf caps and 3.3k3w resistors.
Some of those heatsunk driver transistors look like they have been re-greased.
The diodes I wouldn't disconnect, just get them parallel to the edge of the board over the pins.
4 polarized electrolytic caps for each amp channel :
0.68uF 25v
1.5uF 25v
10uF 16v
330uF 6v
and the TWO per channel 2sc1451 (EBC) metal can replacements:
This is what I had been using, it is a larger case for more heat dissipation (8w with heatsink) which is NOT needed in this case. There is plenty of gain, but it is only available at mouser.
mouser: 512-KSC2682YSTU to-126 (ECB) 180v .1a 1.2/8w 200mhz 100-320hfe $0.31 ea
SO, I found another available at digikey OR mouser:
This transistor actually has more gain, but less heat dissipation, but the dissipation is enough for this application, plus the pinout is the same even though it is a smaller case.
522-ZTX696B @ $1.46 NPN TO-92E EBC 180v 0.5a 1.5w 70mhz 150-500hfe
ZTX696B-ND @ $1.62 ea
This will be a first pass shotgun type repair, as we are not sure what is causing it, but there are GOOD reasons to suspect the caps and the transistors. The cost of these parts is rather small making it a worthwhile try.
The diodes I wouldn't disconnect, just get them parallel to the edge of the board over the pins.
4 polarized electrolytic caps for each amp channel :
0.68uF 25v
1.5uF 25v
10uF 16v
330uF 6v
and the TWO per channel 2sc1451 (EBC) metal can replacements:
This is what I had been using, it is a larger case for more heat dissipation (8w with heatsink) which is NOT needed in this case. There is plenty of gain, but it is only available at mouser.
mouser: 512-KSC2682YSTU to-126 (ECB) 180v .1a 1.2/8w 200mhz 100-320hfe $0.31 ea
SO, I found another available at digikey OR mouser:
This transistor actually has more gain, but less heat dissipation, but the dissipation is enough for this application, plus the pinout is the same even though it is a smaller case.
522-ZTX696B @ $1.46 NPN TO-92E EBC 180v 0.5a 1.5w 70mhz 150-500hfe
ZTX696B-ND @ $1.62 ea
This will be a first pass shotgun type repair, as we are not sure what is causing it, but there are GOOD reasons to suspect the caps and the transistors. The cost of these parts is rather small making it a worthwhile try.
Maddart
Active Member
I will get the 4 different caps and the ztx696b on order monday.
Q5 and Q6 appear to be the targets for replacement. Which cap locations will be targeted?
.68uf cap out of stock at mouser.
Can order thru digikey again although meeting the minimum will be a little harder this time.
Can these caps/transistor be used anywhere else in this unit?
p930-nd .68uf/50v .18cents
p932-nd 1.5uf/50v .18 cents
p910-nd 10uf/16v .19cents
493-1742-nd 330uf/10v .31cents
ZTX696B $1.63 each
Q5 and Q6 appear to be the targets for replacement. Which cap locations will be targeted?
.68uf cap out of stock at mouser.
Can order thru digikey again although meeting the minimum will be a little harder this time.
Can these caps/transistor be used anywhere else in this unit?
p930-nd .68uf/50v .18cents
p932-nd 1.5uf/50v .18 cents
p910-nd 10uf/16v .19cents
493-1742-nd 330uf/10v .31cents
ZTX696B $1.63 each
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Maddart
Active Member
Good morning MTF
I was looking over the schematic and it appears that c1,c2,c4 and c8 are the caps being selected for replacement. There are only 3 electrolytic caps on this board.
A couple of items:
c4=10uf
c1=.68uf
c2=330uf-not correct?
c8 can't find location (missing?)
Also there appears to be a MJ diode on one side if the horseshoe heatsink next to the c1448. it appears that there was at one time a MJ diode next to the a740 that has been bypassed?
It appears that 240 Volts sx-1010 amp boards are set up the same way as my unit looking at his photos.
I was looking over the schematic and it appears that c1,c2,c4 and c8 are the caps being selected for replacement. There are only 3 electrolytic caps on this board.
A couple of items:
c4=10uf
c1=.68uf
c2=330uf-not correct?
c8 can't find location (missing?)
Also there appears to be a MJ diode on one side if the horseshoe heatsink next to the c1448. it appears that there was at one time a MJ diode next to the a740 that has been bypassed?
It appears that 240 Volts sx-1010 amp boards are set up the same way as my unit looking at his photos.