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The lesser known Dual 481A!

Double_Dee

Double_Dee

New Member
Man what a beast. A Dual with an S shaped tonearm! And what an eerie resemblance to the 1239A...
So my girlfriend's dad loves going to the flea market (or polish market as we call it in hungary for some god forsaken reason...) and sometimes finds amazing stuff. Recently I helped him acquire his first turntable (first good one at least), a Dual CS617Q, and I also got into the Dual craze for a bit. He knew this, and when he found a vintage looking Dual on the market (for approx 50 bucks) he bought it immediately to put away for me. He sent me a picture and I was driven crazy. From the pics it looked like the 1239A, one of my dream Duals! A true rarity and an oddball among all the straight arm models. And he got home and sent me some more pics.

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Hm... I have never heard of a 481A. Very weird. Looked around a bit and it seems to be the exact copy of the 1239A, just without changer mechanics. A bummer, but nothing heartbreaking. But I kept looking and it seems to be a very elusive little fella. No data on VinylEngine, no manuals, no reviews. Google mostly comes up emptyhanded. So I figured I would shout into the void in 2025 - Hey I have this turntable! It's cool! If you also have it and wonder if you found some knockoff - no, it's totally legit. Other than the manual on Dual's page I can't find a lot about it but it's legit!

If you have it also - share pics and tell me how do you like yours! Maybe there's a story with it too! Vintage gear always comes with a story in my experience :D

I'm still waiting for some of the cables and adapters I need to operate it, and I want to give it a nice looking grainy wooden plinth. I will update you on the workings in a few days after I tried it. Needs a good cleaning and lube.
And for those who know their Duals: The steuerpimpel seems to be intact : DD
476329211_2974177432737124_5139988101536094982_n.jpg
 
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Wow!!! Welcome to AudioKarma, @Double_Dee ! That is indeed the epitome of the proverbial Dual "Tank!" Unfortunately I know nothing about it to help you along, but have a hunch you scored quite heavily there!! Is it a belt or idler drive? I'd be tempted to leave it exactly as it is unless that plinth is somehow blemished, something that is difficult from your picture to ascertain, and just give it a deep-cleaning along with the usual lubrications necessary. The fact that the steuerpimpel is intact suggests that it hadn't been used a ton so you might have stumbled on to a very lightly used relic/gem! Vinylengine does not show a 481 A, instead only the 481 and there is but one piece of information about that one, that it is a belt-drive which I suspect yours is also. Enjoy the ride and let us know how it sounds once you have it serviced and cleaned up......I bet you're going to be quite pleased! Carry on, amigo......

PS - I'm finding a CS 481, could it be that there is a CS in front of the 481?
You can see the 481A service manual, sparse as it is, here:

Dual suggests that the service manual for the 481 is to be used for all other servicing which you can see here:
 
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Congratulations!
Is the platter bearing like the standard changer type or a single point support type? There is German site dual-board.de that would definitely have some information on this beast.

Regards,
 
Fishead said:
Wow!!! Welcome to AudioKarma, @Double_Dee ! That is indeed the epitome of the proverbial Dual "Tank!" Unfortunately I know nothing about it to help you along, but have a hunch you scored quite heavily there!! Is it a belt or idler drive? I'd be tempted to leave it exactly as it is unless that plinth is somehow blemished, something that is difficult from you picture to ascertain, and just give it a deep-cleaning along with the usual lubrications necessary. The fact that the steuerpimpel is intact suggests that it hadn't been used a ton so you might have stumbled on to a very lightly used relic/gem! Vinylengine does not show a 481 A, instead only the 481 and there is but one piece of information about that one, that it is a belt-drive which I suspect yours is also. Enjoy the ride and let us know how it sounds once you have it serviced and cleaned up......I bet you're going to be quite pleased! Carry on, amigo......

PS - I'm finding a CS 481, could it be that there is a CS in front of the 481?
You can see the 481A service manual, sparse as it is, here:

Dual suggests that the service manual for the 481 is to be used for all other servicing which you can see here:
Click to expand...

The plinth isn't damaged per se, but ya know... It's a dull grey plinth. I think some nice woody colors would elevate it so well. And no, there isn't a CS. It's just 481A. Found the instructions too, but thanks for linking them. I think I can try it out tomorrow! I'll be back...
 
Fishead said:
(...) Is it a belt or idler drive? (...)
Click to expand...

That's a belt-drive model, Andreas.

Generally speaking, the 461 (belt-drive), 481(A) (also belt-drive; A variant with S-shaped arm), 491(A) (direct-drive) and 496 (ULM-ified 491) didn't really belong to the regular Dual line-up(s), which is why one won't find these in the regular Dual catalogues (the accessory catalogues aside). Instead these were intended as small(er) chassis integration models for industrial customers like for example Grundig, ITT or Wega, which would primarily use these for all-in-one systems like for example the RPC 450, the Stereo 7700 Hifi Compact or the KS 3341-2/SE. And as some of the higher-ranking system models would already feature remote control capability, Dual also offered RC variants of some of these 4xx models like for example of the 491A as used in the Grundig XPC 6500 TP or ITT HC 9071.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
lini said:
That's a belt-drive model, Andreas.

Generally speaking, the 461 (belt-drive), 481(A) (also belt-drive; A variant with S-shaped arm), 491(A) (direct-drive) and 496 (ULM-ified 491) didn't really belong to the regular Dual line-up(s), which is why one won't find these in the regular Dual catalogues (the accessory catalogues aside). Instead these were intended as small(er) chassis integration models for industrial customers like for example Grundig, ITT or Wega, which would primarily use these for all-in-one systems like for example the RPC 450, the Stereo 7700 Hifi Compact or the KS 3341-2/SE. And as some of the higher-ranking system models would already feature remote control capability, Dual also offered RC variants of some of these 4xx models like for example of the 491A as used in the Grundig XPC 6500 TP or ITT HC 9071.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
Click to expand...
Yes I've also seen a few vids of them in all in one systems! They can look cool but I prefer them on their own.
 
Yes, Manfred, I discovered that as well and thank you for confirming......I think I may have seen that Saba used them in their combo systems too.
 
Fishead said:
(...) I think I may have seen that Saba used them in their combo systems too.
Click to expand...

Yup, Saba also offered at least one system with a 4xx Dual. Not quite sure, wheter Telefunken also offered one with a 4xx, but Schneider definitely offered several.

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
So
Here's how we are right now
IMG_20250307_143735.jpg
I was wrong actually, idk what I missed but the steuerpimpel is actually obliterated.
Otherwise it's a bit gunky but everything that should connect seems to be connected to me but I would love some feedback on that because I lack the experience.
When connected to power it immediately starts spinning and repeats the start mechanism. Moves arm over record, puts it down and gets back up immediately. Goes back to place and repeat. This is classical no-SP behavior right?
 
Update:
So here we are.
I made something resembling a steuerpimpel but it might be worthless, I may have got the size wrong.
As soon as the 481 gets a whiff of electricity it starts spinning and starts repeating the start mechanism. BUT if during the descent of the arm you flip it over to stop, it will just lower the arm correctly and start playing normally. Then if you flip to start, it returns to the main position and starts everything all over. Flipping to stop during play does nothing.
If you wait for the music to end, it returns to the base and immediately starts the record again, but this time it stays in the groove.
 
Sounding like you need a steuerpimpel that does the job correctly. Also, the plate that the steuerpimpel "glides" across should be absolutely free of any oil or grease.....sometimes this can be the problem when this plate has been lubricated by someone who is not aware of this. Also, one way to re-set the auto-mechanism is to put the lock on your tonearm in its resting position so that it can't move......then, push the lever to Start and let it go through its cycle with the arm locked down. This tends to correct any problems associated with the auto-mechanism and might, I say might, resolve your issue. However, without a proper steuerpimpel, or something that works as it should in its place, you're probably not going to get the performance that would be expected. There was a trick provided in one of the Dual threads that involved taking a piece of electrical wire, probably around 14 or 12 gage, and stripping a piece of insulation from it and pushing it on to the post where the steuerpimpel goes leaving just a tiny amount beyond where the post ends so that the thing will glide on the end of the insulation.....some say it works just fine, but I haven't tried it myself. You can order steuerpimpels from a number of sources but as a crutch temporarily, this trick might work for you.
 
Double_Dee said:
When connected to power it immediately starts spinning and repeats the start mechanism.
Click to expand...
Clearly not what it should be doing, unless the auto-mechanism is out of its usual cycle and maybe some other reasons that I'm not aware of, but I'd sure try the arm locked down push to start thing and see if it doesn't correct itself.....
 
There are two service PDF's that deal with specific issues with many Dual turntables that can be found over at Vinylengine by member "dualcan". One specific issue is the main cam and how the shutoff lever (231) and friction plate (232) need to be controlled properly or "the tonearm will repeat at end of play ad-infinitum". This is exactly what was going on with 1219 just recently. The PDF allowed me to take everything apart and service the main cam, eliminating this issue.
 
mfenberg said:
There are two service PDF's that deal with specific issues with many Dual turntables that can be found over at Vinylengine by member "dualcan". One specific issue is the main cam and how the shutoff lever (231) and friction plate (232) need to be controlled properly or "the tonearm will repeat at end of play ad-infinitum". This is exactly what was going on with 1219 just recently. The PDF allowed me to take everything apart and service the main cam, eliminating this issue.
Click to expand...
Well, VE is a bit sissy to reach from hungary due to dispute between the owners and some people who have been mass downloading manuals and uploading to their site (can view with VPN but can't register to view profiles) but I'll try my best to look that up. Thanks.
 
mfenberg said:
There are two service PDF's that deal with specific issues with many Dual turntables that can be found over at Vinylengine by member "dualcan". One specific issue is the main cam and how the shutoff lever (231) and friction plate (232) need to be controlled properly or "the tonearm will repeat at end of play ad-infinitum". This is exactly what was going on with 1219 just recently. The PDF allowed me to take everything apart and service the main cam, eliminating this issue.
Click to expand...
I'm wondering if it might be possible to send @Double_Dee copies of those PDFs? Since he can't access (as many can't) them himself?
 
Fishead said:
I'm wondering if it might be possible to send @Double_Dee copies of those PDFs? Since he can't access (as many can't) them himself?
Click to expand...
In the meantime I found Dualcan's website. I'll link it here, just in case anyone who stumbles here wants to find these pdf-s too

Tumblr

DIY Dual Motor Service guide Entretien du Moteurs Dual The attached guide will help in servicing Dual and PE motors. Included are a few extra hints on the electronic boards of the later Dual motors...
dualcan.tumblr.com
 
Wow! Good work @Double_Dee ! I think that about covers what you're going to need to know.....did you try making a steuerpimpel from wire insulation? How about cycling the mechanism with the arm locked down?
 
Double_Dee said:
In the meantime I found Dualcan's website. I'll link it here, just in case anyone who stumbles here wants to find these pdf-s too

Tumblr

DIY Dual Motor Service guide Entretien du Moteurs Dual The attached guide will help in servicing Dual and PE motors. Included are a few extra hints on the electronic boards of the later Dual motors...
dualcan.tumblr.com
Click to expand...
You definitely want the guide for servicing cams!
 
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