Thorens TD-150 Project

[dean man jim]

Thank you for the tips guys, i actually have all the documents for this TT, including the owner's and "service manual", i also added the drop of oil on each end of the motor shaft (bearings) but it still seems noisy with the belt on, not so much with he belt off, tried longer belt still does it (unless i change the mat to a thicker one, or try the cork mat), i'll have to try a thicker oil, as far as the platter, trust me it is pitted, at first i thought it was just tarnish, and i would be able to get rid of that with noxon 7, but it made it worse, because some of the polish residue stayed inside the craters...Also have violette bookmarked for when i am ready to get the oil and a new belt.
sorry for the bad quality pic. :stupid:
View attachment 212450

My own opinion is that job #1 is to get the motor running smoothly. When I first got my TD150 it had sat for who knows how many years and the motor was noisy. Upon advice from other TD150 owners I changed the bearing well oil and oiled the motor bearings with quality automotive oil and let the table run for a day or two. The noise when away and hasn't come back as I am doing much better maintenance as opposed to the decade or two before I got it

So you might try emptying the platter bearing, wipe it out with an absorbent scrap of cotton, and put a drop of a good quality 30 weight motor oil (not synethetic, I'd follow Violette's advice at this stage for sure) on the bottom motor bearing while the table is nearly upside down and let it seep in for a few minutes before turning the table upright. Then put another drop of the oil on the upper motor bearing and use the same stuff in the platter bearing well, letting the inner platter settle as per Violette's instructions. Install the belt, turn the table on, and walk away for a day or so. It worked for me anyway.

If this gets the motor quiet it would be appropriate to learn to set the springs and buy a good belt (from Joel/Violette). At that point you might as well buy his 'maintenance kit' with the various weights of oil along with the belt. As a package I think it's a very good deal and the oil is good stuff.

It's probably just as well to not worry about the platter yet. It is a very high quality casting that was dynamically balanced.

After the table is working and well set up with a decent cartridge (that TP13A arm is under-rated, it can handle a high quality MM or MC cartridge as long as the cartridge is medium to low compliance) and if you decide you love the table and are willing to spend a few dollars you might *then* explore letting an expert refinish it (such as an autobody place?). Or, sourcing a parts table with a great platter? Also at that stage there are a suite of cheap tweaks you can do that will each improve the peformance of the table. Combined these tweaks move the table to a different place altogether imho.

Jim

 

[Divotdog]

Jim is right on, let that oil soak into the motor bearings and then let the motor run for a day or two, the motor in the 150 in this thread was seized up and it wouldn't even turn, after the above procedure it is dead silent now.

 

[Zodia]

The mistake i made the first time was to, use a light oil (air tool oil) and not let it run, instead of just adding one drop and leave be without running the motor in order to allow the oil to seep in, that is pretty much all i need to do then, i just might leave the original tone arm , i kind of like it, and it doesn't sound bad at all with the 380 Stanton that came with (only needs stylus).
This weekend i am going to do all of that, plus try the wet sanding of the platter, if all goes well i will give Joel (violette) a ring and get his kit.
Again thank you for the info, that is what i like about forums like AK, informative and knowledgeable people, willing to help less in the "know" people like myself.

 

[Sir Bakerman]

Zodia,

I wet sanded mine until it was nice and bright, Then I took a buffer wheel put it on my power drill. Put some jewelers polish on the wheel and turned on the drill, holding the platter edge against the spinning buffer wheel gave me a beautiful mirror like finish. I need to do it again just to clean up some minor spots but it looks pretty good.

Sir B

 

[Zodia]

That is exactly what i did, the first time, and failed :dammit::thumbsdn:

And then it dawned on me, how about using a brown scuffing pad (the type used in bodyshops to prepare base paint for clear coating) and then use a buffing wheel on a bench grinder and this is what i got

Could have come out better, there are still some deep scratches that i don't dare try to remove, because with my luck i will end up making it worse, my main concern was the humm from the motor, which is now gone, i had to take the entire TT apart, disassemble every single component, clean, polish, lube and reassemble, and the end result is absolutely amazing, next item on my list, is a good cart to use with the original tonearm, any suggestions?

 

[Sir Bakerman]

I would put a Shure V15 Series III, with a Jico replacement stylus.

You will be VERY happy.

 

[rkay5]

Hi,
I use a Denon DL160 HOMC on my TD150 I wouldn't use a Shure V15 or any high Compliance cartridge with the TP13 or TP13A as the mass of arm will work best with mid to low compliance cart. 10 to 20x10-6cm/Dyne

 

[Zodia]

Thank you for the suggestions.
But since i am broke at the moment, i found a listen(able) match for time being, i installed a Shure M72B, not the best i've heard, but it'll have to do for now...

 

[ehoove]

Back to the original thread. After our conversation and a review of this thread I may just save the 9cc arm for a TD150 Project, and use a more vintage arm for the TD160! How is the plinth and other upgrades progressing?
Regards,
Jim

 

[Zodia]

Yeah i realize i sort of derailed this thread for a moment, it wasn't my intention, my apologies.

 

[Divotdog]

Back to the original thread. After our conversation and a review of this thread I may just save the 9cc arm for a TD150 Project, and use a more vintage arm for the TD160! How is the plinth and other upgrades progressing?
Regards,
Jim

The 150 has been on the side burner for awhile but perhaps I will throw a couple of teaser pics of a few of the upcoming mods on here in the next day or two.

Yeah i realize i sort of derailed this thread for a moment, it wasn't my intention, my apologies.

No problem! :thmbsp:

 

[ehoove]

Yeah i realize i sort of derailed this thread for a moment, it wasn't my intention, my apologies.

No foul called here, all things Thorens are good in my world. I was just curious what Divotdog was planing for the TD150.
Regards,
Jim

 

[Zodia]

No foul called here, all things Thorens are good in my world. I was just curious what Divotdog was planing for the TD150.
Regards,
Jim

Cool, but i understand how some people get upset when someone else hijacks their thread, and since i am new here i felt the need to apologize, don't want to make any enemies, know what i mean?
Not that it would happen, because i have found the peeps here to be very friendly, helpful and knowledgeable, an all around great bunch.
Thank you guys for making me part of the community.

 

[ZebraBlvd]

Zodia, for you to make significant waves around here you would have to have a Battleship attitude. Reading your post's I see nowhere that you stepped on anybody's toe's or thread. And besides, you got a :thmbsp: from the OP, Divotdog which means all is cool.

 

[Cesari0]

This is a very helpful thread... I'm about to embark on a TD150 II project.

I have a couple of questions, as I'm modding mine not just rebuilding.

Things I have questions about is:

-Has anyone tried removing the suspension.
-Separating the tonearm from the suspension (cutting the armboard section off of the suspension)


Regards, Csari0

 

[hags]

TD 150 belt info

Here's some info from recent belts I bought for my Thorens TD 150 MkII AB.

From what I've learned the belt should be .70mm thick.

I've ordered belts from Thakker, Violette/Joel, and a genuine Thorens belt from Acoustic Sounds.

The belt that was on the table when I bought it measured .86mm thick. This is after years of sitting so who knows if it was correct and just swollen or what. This belt was not marked.

The replacement belt I got from Violette/Joel measured .47mm, by far the thinnest belt I received. It ran slow, noticeably slow while listening to music as well. This belt was not marked.

I ordered a belt that was "custom" made by Thakker to Thorens spec.s. This belt measured .75mm and also ran fast. The belt was marked "Thakker".

The belt I ordered from Acoustic Sounds worked out the best. It measured .69mm and the speed was dead on. The belt was marked "Thorens". These are new manufacture, not NOS. They are genuine Thorens belts made to the correct spec.s.

All belts were of similar lengths when slightly tightened. I used my Mitutoyo model 500-137 digital caliper to measure thickness and a KAB Speedstrobe to check speed.

My money's on the Acoustic Sounds genuine Thorens belt. The rest were too far off from the specified .70mm belt. The Thakker is not too far off and I may have received a bad sample, it did however run fast. I wouldn't waste my time ordering the other belt from Germany, that belt wasn't even in the neighborhood with regard to thickness or speed and it wasn't marked, a complete waste of money.

I am not affiliated with Acoustic Sounds in any way. They happen to offer a genuine Thorens manufactured belt that meets specs, is priced very competitively and are based in the US.

 

[Divotdog]

This is a very helpful thread... I'm about to embark on a TD150 II project.

I have a couple of questions, as I'm modding mine not just rebuilding.

Things I have questions about is:

-Has anyone tried removing the suspension.
-Separating the tonearm from the suspension (cutting the armboard section off of the suspension)


Regards, Csari0

I have not tried removing the suspension completely, but I would think that this would defeat the purpose of buying a Thorens to start with, a lot of the signature sound comes from a properly tuned suspension. There are some articles at the Analog Dept. regarding replacing the springs with a piece of rubber hose, I have no idea how well this works as I have never tried it.

As for removing the tonearm from the suspension, I would think that maintaining the proper VTA would become quite difficult. Sometimes reengineering a well engineered product can become an exercise in frustration.

 

[Divotdog]

Here's some info from recent belts I bought for my Thorens TD 150 MkII AB.

From what I've learned the belt should be .70mm thick.

I've ordered belts from Thakker, Violette/Joel, and a genuine Thorens belt from Acoustic Sounds.

The belt that was on the table when I bought it measured .86mm thick. This is after years of sitting so who knows if it was correct and just swollen or what. This belt was not marked.

The replacement belt I got from Violette/Joel measured .47mm, by far the thinnest belt I received. It ran slow, noticibly slow while listening to music as well. This belt was not marked.

I ordered a belt that was "custom" made by Thakker to Thorens spec.s. This belt measured .75mm and also ran fast. The belt was marked "Thakker".

The belt I ordered from Acoustic Sounds worked out the best. It measured .69mm and the speed was dead on. The belt was marked "Thorens". These are new manufacture, not NOS. They are genuine Thorens belts made to the correct spec.s.

All belts were of similar lengths when slightly tightened. I used my Mitutoyo model 500-137 digital caliper to measure thickness and a KAB Speedstrobe to check speed.

My money's on the Acoustic Sounds genuine Thorens belt. The rest were too far off from the specified .70mm belt. The Thakker is not too far off and I may have received a bad sample, it did however run fast. I wouldn't waste my time ordering the other belt from Germany, that belt wasn't even in the neighborhood with regard to thickness or speed and it wasn't marked, a complete waste of money.

I am not affiliated with Acoustic Sounds in any way. They happen to offer a genuine Thorens manufactured belt that meets specs, is priced very competitively and are based in the US.

I agree completely, I have been using the Acoustic Sounds genuine Thorens belts for a long time now, IMHO the best belt on the market for these tables. :thmbsp:

 

[Cesari0]

I have not tried removing the suspension completely, but I would think that this would defeat the purpose of buying a Thorens to start with, a lot of the signature sound comes from a properly tuned suspension. There are some articles at the Analog Dept. regarding replacing the springs with a piece of rubber hose, I have no idea how well this works as I have never tried it.

As for removing the tonearm from the suspension, I would think that maintaining the proper VTA would become quite difficult. Sometimes reengineering a well engineered product can become an exercise in frustration.

Don't get me wrong, I have worked on many Thorens, I was just wondering if getting rid of the suspension would be something somebody has tried.

In regards to the suspensionless tonearm, I was thinking of using more than one tonearm on the turntable, since the suspension can only hold one arm, I was thinking or removing the tonearm section completely, which would allow me to set up a couple of arms.

I have a 3 plinths to make, I planning to tackle all 3 at the same time, since my other 2 turntables are idlers, which makes them straight forward heavy plinths. I more interested in the possibilities of the TD150II.

Regards, Cesario

 

[dean man jim]

Don't get me wrong, I have worked on many Thorens, I was just wondering if getting rid of the suspension would be something somebody has tried.

Regards, Cesario

Do check out the last two TD150 projects documented at the Analog Dept website. CLD plinths, springs removed and replaced with other less compliant devices. One of the completed projects is sporting a Graham arm and Ortofon Jubilee LOMC cartridge.

Jim