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TT suggestion for my system.....?

williwoods

williwoods

Active Member
Its bit of a loaded question I know.

My goal is to build the ultimate era correct budget system.

Currently I am running:

NAD 2200PE amplifier
NAD 1155 Pre
paid $160 for both

Ohm Walsh 2 speakers
paid $35 for the speakers

JVC QL-Y5F (Upgraded the rca's and stuffed it with 8lbs of clay)
paid $10 for TT and $85 for the rest of the upgrades/parts.

Denon DL-160 cart
paid $140 shipped

I have been using my JVC QL-Y5f TT for a while now and am pretty happy with it overall. However I just took my Amp and Pre in for repair/overhaul/maintenance to an authorized NAD guy, he was pretty impressed with my "budget" system but when I told him about my TT he seemed underwhelmed. I think his thing was that it was DD rather than belt and that its unsuspended. Since I am a constant tinkerer I am thinking about trying something else for fun.

Is there a more appropriate TT for my system that even a snob would approve of? Is there something that would have been the natural companion to the above system? The Ohm Walsh speakers seem to be perfectly suited to the NAD 2200 and are from the same era. Although my JVC is from the same era, I have a feeling that it would have been a little too middle of the road for my system.

Maybe a Linn? Is there something that would work well with the DL-160? Or is that Cart not smarty pants enough?

I am willing to spend more than what I have spent already but I am not going over $1000 including the cart (unless the DL-160 is appropriate), and remember I am not interested in anything newer than mid 80's. Of course if I can run into a bargain that is always welcome.


My listening is mostly Rock, Soul,Blues, Alt-Country, Reggae, Jazz, African/International and Hip-Hop music. I listen to stuff from the 60's all the way to contemporary stuff of these genre's.
 
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IMHO you shouldn't let your tech get in your head. Some guys will never admit that DD tables can be hi fidelity. You said you like it, who cares what he thinks.
 
markshan said:
IMHO you shouldn't let your tech get in your head. Some guys will never admit that DD tables can be hi fidelity. You said you like it, who cares what he thinks.
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Very valid point.

Although I did say that I like it, I have no idea what any other TT sounds like, hence my interest. I have been told its a nice sounding TT by the folks here. I am just spit ballin you know...
 
I've never owned a belt drive that I liked as much as my QL-A7, but I haven't owned a bunch. The best belt drive I spent any time with was a Systemdek with a glass platter, but I liked my JVC better. I'm sure others will weigh in.
 
Perhaps a vintage mid-80s AR or 70s/80s Thorens. Great tables that will outlive us all.

The Denon mates well with the stock Thorens arm.

D
 
any particular model on the Thorens and AR? I am familiar with the AR XA and ES1 not familiar with any Thorens except the name...
 
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FWIW, the JVC you own is no slouch and matches well with your present system. And does things better than many a belt drive. People who cut records for a living, respect it. And they're demanding about accurate reproduction uncolored.
 
Quite honestly I don't think there is anything wrong with your JVC.

If you are looking to change, very similar in concept would be a big vintage Denon DD table. The other end of the spectrum a Harman Kardon T-series, suspended, belt drive, like a T55, T60 or T65 ... the "working man's Linn" (although you'd have to switch cartridges for that).
 
The AR turntable or a Sondek are the ones to go for. If you want to try the turntable that many rate the best sounding of that era then there's the Pink Triangle, though note finding a good and and keeping it going can be challenging.

Many Japanese turntables were good, but not the best, whereas the cottage industry turntables were considered a cut above. They represented different philosophies, Japanese mass-made plastic compared to predominately British hand-made wood veneer.
 
It's funny - I purchased my 1st real stereo in the early 80's and I can distinctly recall drooling over those JVC direct drives at the time. All I could afford of course was the cheap plastic JVC belt drive that came with the package system I bought (which was Yamaha by the way). Perhaps that experience with the 1st belt drive pushed me towards other brands when I upgraded the turntable, about a year later (to the Akai AP-Q41 that I still have).

avole said:
Many Japanese turntables were good, but not the best, whereas the cottage industry turntables were considered a cut above. They represented different philosophies, Japanese mass-made plastic compared to predominately British hand-made wood veneer.
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I don't know ... bit of a generalization ... isn't it? I don't see much plastic in my Technics or my Sonys (unless you count composite plinths as 'plastic') or my Micro Seiki (which has a wood veneer plinth). There isn't much that is critical that is plastic in the Harman Kardon, and it's from the USA ... but it still has a wood plinth. The Linn is from Scotland and the AR is from the USA. And the QL-Y5F has a veneer-covered wood plinth I believe as well.

The cottage industry tables are predominately belt drive and of course there are some beautiful creations .... but I don't think they could front the needed development funds to buid a high-end DD turntable.
 
If you want to try something different and like to tinker, a suspended belt drive is a good option. I am fond of models from Ariston, Systemdek, Conrad Johnson, Oracle, AR is a nice choice, and Thorens are true classics- 125, 126, 150 and 160 to name just a few.

These are all great tables with great sound and performance and all within your budget.

Consider Linn as well- although you'll stretch your budget.

But please understand your tech's opinion is a biased and very limiting one, and also incorrect.

Suspended belt drive tables can be wonderful, but just because a table is a belt drive suspended table does not make it superior- and doesn't always make it a good table by default, either. Same can be applied to idler, non-suspended belt, and direct drive models too, to be fair.

There are many suspended belt drive tables that really are fantastic, though, and will perform exceptionally well, and prove quite enjoyable. Please see the above list- all great tables with great reputations.

Wonderful tables have been made from other design theories as well- the upper model Regas and much loved VPI Classic (non-suspended belt drives), Thorens much sought-after TD-124 and various Lenco models (idler drive), and popular and in-demand tables like the Yamaha GT-2000 and JVC TT 101 (direct drive).

As a tinkerer and with a decent budget in your pocket, I do encourage you to try out a quality belt drive suspended design- I'm thinking the ARs, Thorens, Linns (and somewhat the Systemdek and Ariston by default) will make fun, excellent choices!

But in the meantime, don't disregard that wonderful, strong performing and very capable JVC of yours.

Best of luck!
 
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Van_Isle said:
I don't know ... bit of a generalization ... isn't it? I don't see much plastic in my Technics or my Sonys (unless you count composite plinths as 'plastic') or my Micro Seiki (which has a wood veneer plinth). There isn't much that is critical that is plastic in the Harman Kardon, and it's from the USA ... but it still has a wood plinth. The Linn is from Scotland and the AR is from the USA. And the QL-Y5F has a veneer-covered wood plinth I believe as well.

The cottage industry tables are predominately belt drive and of course there are some beautiful creations .... but I don't think they could front the needed development funds to buid a high-end DD turntable.
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Not generalisation, more a perception. As you'd expect, the country where the cottage industry was based would have a different attitude to most others.

I said predominant British, because they were . Linn is Scottish, a part of the British Isles, and some models of the AR were made in Scotland, if I remember correctly.

I'm only commenting about perceptions here, not specifics. My Pioneer PL112D has a wooden plinth, too, but a good part of the rest of it is plastic. On the other hand, my SL1300 is mostly metal. That's the reality, but the perception was cheap plastic. The British do, after all, make the best turntables, amplifiers and speakers in the world :)
 
avole said:
The AR turntable or a Sondek are the ones to go for. If you want to try the turntable that many rate the best sounding of that era then there's the Pink Triangle...
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Pink Triangle is also a good choice- agreed.

The Ariston and Linn share much in common with the Systemdek (and the ARs, to a lesser extent but still very much valid) and should be included as well (although the Linn is stretching the budget).

avole said:
...Many Japanese turntables were good, but not the best, whereas the cottage industry turntables were considered a cut above. They represented different philosophies, Japanese mass-made plastic compared to predominately British hand-made wood veneer.
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This statement is a broad generalization and not accurate.

Example-

The Boston Audio Society thought very highly of the beloved (and deservedly so) Linn TT, but when the direct drive Sony PS-8750 came out, with it's HBMC (high bulk moulded compound) plinth, basically a polyester resin mixed with inert material (some may call it "plastic"), it became the new darling table of many of the members.

The Japanese manufacturers made some excellent belt and direct drive tables. One can point their fingers at the lower quality, lower priced options they offered to fit everyone's budget, but they also made plenty of fantastic, high quality turntables still sought after today.
 
KentTeffeteller said:
FWIW, the JVC you own is no slouch and matches well with your present system. And does things better than many a belt drive. People who cut records for a living, respect it. And they're demanding about accurate reproduction uncolored.
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Hear, hear.
I think it's pretty correct too.
The first I might try in your situation is try a different (/better) phono stage.
 
I'd Keep the JVC as a 2nd spinner for its ease of use,...and perhaps try one of the following belt drives in used but good condition...

Ariston rd 40
Ariston rd 60 ( if you can find one)
Ariston rd 80
Ariston RD90
Ariston RD11
Heybrook TT/2
Systemdek XII
AR EB-101
Thorens TD 160 IV or V + Rega RB250
Walker CJ55
Rotel RP850 , RP855, RP955
Rega Planar 2 + RB250
(or perhaps Nad's cloned version of the planar 2..can't remember the model #)
Rega Planar 3 + RB300
Manticore Mantra
Linn Basik
Linn Axis
...
and a few others that escape me right now...
depending on which you try..expect to source a new belt,,perhaps tweak the suspension where fitted..use a wall shelf where beneficial...new stylus or cartridge might be required and perhaps some fresh bearing oil...
a bit of research will help with fine-tuning and setup

look for well cared for examples...either of the above wont break the bank and were around mostly in the 80's..they should still give you a taste of how good vinyl can sound even on a budget...

the thing with analog is...the better the source... the better the final sound...(same for digital too but less obvious at the budget end of the market because cd players are not as cheap or easy to tweak as a turntable)
In the case of an vinyl spinner..that means ensuring everything before the phono stage is extracting the cleanest,most musical signal possible from the groove whilst adding the least coloration or distortion possible to that signal...

what you pay for with a good belt drive..either fixed or suspended is simply good engineering where it really matters...i.e. the moving parts and non moving parts that can cause unwanted vibration to influence the movement of the stylus in relation to the groove...

even a budget cartridge can sound impressive once your turntable allows it to work at its best...
 
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avole said:
Not generalisation, more a perception. .... The British do, after all, make the best turntables, amplifiers and speakers in the world :)
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Agreed ... perception.

thedelihaus said:
Hey- they also are home to Lucas Electronics!
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Ah, visions of getting towed off the ferry with my buddy and his Triumph TR6, complete with dead alternator, and less than 24-hours after he bought it (used mind you, but billed as 'fully restored').

Don't forget also the British mastermined gems like the Garrard Zero 100 :D

But don't get me wrong here ... lots of great suggestions provided whether from UK, Japan, US, etc.

Here's another that I don't think has been put out there yet (and sorry it is Japan) .... Micro Seiki? Perhaps a BL-51?

My approach is i've decided to keep 1 or 2 direct drives and 1 or 2 belt drives just because they are significantly different approaches to the same challenge.
 
My approach is i've decided to keep 1 or 2 direct drives and 1 or 2 belt drives just because they are significantly different approaches to the same challenge.
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:thmbsp: agreed
 
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