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VPI Classic alignment - looking for mint protractor

jblnut

jblnut

Don't Overthink It
I have finally come to the inescapable conclusion that the VPI alignment jig that ships with the Classic is just not suitable for highly resolving cartridges. I've suspected as much for a few years but since I have now thrice tried and failed to get good sound out of great cartridges (which sound fantastic on my other table when aligned with a Mint "best tractor" mirror protractor), the issue has to be the VPI jig. The problem is IGD. The VPI alignment sounds great on the outer grooves, but degrades quickly once past halfway through the album side.

I don't notice this issue with my AT33EV or OC9/II. Perhaps they have a more forgiving stylus profile ? It is highly noticeable on these 3 carts I have tried:

Transfiguration Temper Supreme (Soundsmith ruby rebuild)
Transfiguration Spirit III
Supex SD-900 MK IV (Soundsmith ruby rebuild)

I'm now into the holiday blackout period for getting a Mint made for my VPI. Does anyone have one they'd be willing to lend me for a week ? Happy to pay shipping both directions if so.

Thanks!

jblnut
 
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This probably doesn't help, but I had trouble with my Scout so I downloaded the "stupid protractors from vinylengine (I think) and after using it, I checked it against the VPI jig and it was right in the center of the dot on the jig.
 
That's why (I think) I need the Mint - it also helps you get the alignment exactly correct. Just matching up the stylus point only tells you that the distance is correct. You also need to get the cantilever - especially with more advanced diamond cuts - perfectly aligned.

jblnut
 
Sorry, I don't have a mint protractor for the Classic. But what I can tell you is that, for the same reason as yours, I got the mint for my Scout II. Works very well. It definitely makes a difference. Hope you find someone that can lend it to you for your Classic. You may also want to try VPI's own forum and ask there.
 
I check the relationship of the cantilever to the cartridge body before I align. This way I can use the cartridge body to align. Anyway, the OP did not state what alignment the VPI jig puts it into, like Stevenson, Baerwald (Lofgren A) or Lofgren B........

I
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That's not easy to answer from all of the reading I have done. The VPI is supposedly a "special" alignment that Harry uses, and the Mint can be made for any of them. Unsure what his "default" setting is if you don't ask. I always align with the cantilever which is one of the pluses of the Mint approach.

I posted on the VPI forum - thanks for that suggestion edwyun!

jblnut
 
I'm using Baerwald. I also use the cantilever. I'd feel pretty safe saying this is what VPI is using.
 
Have you checked aspects of alignment other than tangency? Vertical tracking angle and azimuth might come into play as well.
 
Cartridges themselves are not the problem with IGD, but rather the stylus they are using. As the spiral groove of a record gets closer to the label, the music becomes more and more compressed. Big, fat stylus simply can't correctly trace the ever reducing modulations found in the inner grooves. Only stylus shapes like Fineline or Shibata can truly dig out all of the stuff and not get side-swiped by shrinking groove modulations. There is also the usual problem of cartridge and arm compatibility (resonance wise) which can also contribute to the problem.
 
Hello
I am no expert in turntable setup but I had a Classic for 3 years and the Mint "best tractor" and setup my table a few times with different carts and even used the VPI jig and there is a big difference in the over hang between the two with the Mint "best tractor" being the best result. I just upgraded to the Classic 3 a few months ago and also I got a good deal on the Smart Tractor the difference between that Mint "best tractor" was night and day I thought I had a new cartridge. Also I like to throw this out there have you check your azimuth I like to use Michael Fremer method with a Digital Multi Meter and a test record to measure the crosstalk, the VPI eyeball method is not that great. I still the Mint "best tractor" I would be willing to sell. PM me if your interested

Regards
Dave
 
If there is a difference in overhang, then they are not the same alignments. There are really only 3 basic alignments (yes there are others) that most people use: Stevenson, Baerwald (Lofgren A) or Lofgren B. The difference between the 3 alignments is where the "null" points are (there are 2 null points with eachalignment). The null points are theoretical points in which a tonearm that sweeps is actually perpendicular to the V groove of the record. This happens because the record master was cut on a lathe, in a straight line (like a linear tracking tonearm) and thru the record, the sweeping tonearm is only correct in these 2 theoretical positions. The differences between the 3 alignments is basically where the greatest tracking errors occur. A Stevenson puts most of the tracking error at the beginning of the record, with very little at the label. Baerwald (Lofgren A) or Lofgren B average out the tracking error to reduce the "average" error, Lofgren B having the lowest overall average of the 3.
 
What a difference! Gooch was kind enough to sell me his unused Mint for my Classic. With that in hand the Transfiguration I recently purchased from AK's favorite barnyard animal is now making spectacularly beautiful music. I am now playing with loading on the Xono to get the Spirit III to open up a bit. I was running the standard 100 ohm setting but it seems to be a bit more dynamic at 250. More time is necessary here...

Gonna be a fun night!

jblnut
 
And it looks cool as hell on the table...love the purple body. Had to use longer screws to get more weight on this end of arm as the Classic arm usually needs weights for carts of less than 8 grams.

Jblnut
 

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The counter weight was already all the way forward - the Classic can't deal with super light carts unless you add a head shell weight (which I have but looks dorky). By using longer and slightly heavier screws, I was *just* able to get back up to 2g of tracking force without resorting to the weight.

jblnut
 
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