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What does a bad tube amp sound like?

dave g II

dave g II

New Member
i realize it is a weird question but I just received a 60’s era Electrohome console with a Lorraine 40 radio, Garrard turntable and a 6bq5 output amp. Previous owner threw in a nat king cole record box set. I got the TT cleaned and lubed it works great and the NKC record sounds great. The problem is every other record I play sounds like crap. Painful to listen to very harsh highs.

My question now that I will start working on the amp and preamp “will recapping fix this?” Or is newer music just not meant to be played on older gear?

I suspect leaking coupling caps are the issue. I hope

I have a wave generator and a scope. Bought both recently and both are vintage and currently being recapped so I am unable to run a signal through it. I did bypass the crossover and speakers with a pair of Polk audio bookshelf and it still is “shrilly”


I have not found a before and after video on YouTube to hear what a bad amp sounds like so I am reaching out to you guys

Thanks in advance
 
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You made me look for a FM antenna :p

The tuner actually sounds pretty good. Tried a pat benetar record and it was really bad (she is normally shrilly). The stylus is an astatic 137? Ceramic. The TT is a Garrard type A suppose to be a fine TT Recommendation on a new cartridge?
 
dave g II said:
You made me look for a FM antenna :p

The tuner actually sounds pretty good. Tried a pat benetar record and it was really bad (she is normally shrilly). The stylus is an astatic 137? Ceramic. The TT is a Garrard type A suppose to be a fine TT Recommendation on a new cartridge?
Click to expand...

Astatic ceramic cartridge is going to sound shrill and bad. The rubber suspension which holds the needle gets hard over time, and ruins the sound of those old cartridges. The Garrard is nicely made, but the Type A tracks very heavy, and is not going to be easy on your records. It is also very fiddly to make work 100% properly.

I suggest to get a turntable like an audio technica AT-LP60 which has a magnetic cartridge with a built in phono preamp, and hook it up to the auxiliary/tape input of the amplifier. This will be a monumental improvement in sound quality from your old console.
 
Perhaps the cart just needs replacing. Needle Doctor should be able to get you an OEM unit or depending on you TT setup you might be able to upgrade to a sonotone.
 
If the tuner sounds good and the vinyl does then I agree it is most likely the cart.... The type A isn't the lightest tracking thing but there is much worse out there (like the newer plasic BSR)
 
The rubber piece in the cartridge does get hard over time so you should probably take a look at it.
 
The harsh highs are most likely from a bad needle the hard rubber piece would cause skips when heavy bass is used.
 
Not true. The rubber piece actually acts as the pick up and in my experience and many turntables with this problem, when it gets hard, it either muffles the sound or it does not work at all.

A new needle may not cure this. Without actually being there and hearing what you are hearing, it might be something else entirely.
 
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I found an b&o sp-2 or a sp-1 ver 2 cartridge in the unit. Any thoughts on swapping that in? I here it is finicky to install?

Regarding 2-4 watts of output that is ok as they are GOOD watts
 
Your Garrard type A has a release lever that separates the headshell from the arm. Remove headshell and you will see how to remove cartridge and reinstall....it’s not rocket science.

You should be looking at two screws holding the cart inside the headshell....

That is once you remove the headshell...

Shure has a replacement cartridge for the type A....

I found a new headshell and cartridge combo for the type A on Amazon.

VTG SHURE M7 D-M PHONO CARTRIDGE
 
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dave g II said:
I found an b&o sp-2 or a sp-1 ver 2 cartridge in the unit. Any thoughts on swapping that in? I here it is finicky to install?

Regarding 2-4 watts of output that is ok as they are GOOD watts
Click to expand...

Djcoolray said:
Your Garrard type A has a release lever that separates the headshell from the arm. Remove headshell and you will see how to remove cartridge and reinstall....it’s not rocket science.

You should be looking at two screws holding the cart inside the headshell....

That is once you remove the headshell...

Shure has a replacement cartridge for the type A....

I found a new headshell and cartridge combo for the type A on Amazon.

VTG SHURE M7 D-M PHONO CARTRIDGE
Click to expand...
 
Now I am going down a rabbit hole. I have 80 bux in this system plus a bit of sweat getting the TT working again. I would like to keep the Console as close to original as possible. Avoiding a phono amp.

I looked at carts suggested and the costs start piling on. I think my great deal console is turning into a costly endeavour. A sailboat is cheaper.

Assuming I keep th TT in the console and not use a phono amp is there a decent reasonably priced non vintage cart for it?
 
dave g II said:
Now I am going down a rabbit hole. I have 80 bux in this system plus a bit of sweat getting the TT working again. I would like to keep the Console as close to original as possible. Avoiding a phono amp.

I looked at carts suggested and the costs start piling on. I think my great deal console is turning into a costly endeavour. A sailboat is cheaper.

Assuming I keep th TT in the console and not use a phono amp is there a decent reasonably priced non vintage cart for it?
Click to expand...

No - the only modern ceramic cartridges are the ones used on record players such as the crosley cruisers and similar at the very bottom end of the market. Quality ceramic cartridges have not been made in decades.

Maybe you will get lucky and find a Sonotone, a Decca Derem, or maybe even one of the better Ronnette cartridges which still have a compliant rubber suspension. It is really a gamble though without guaranteed results.

Also, how is the idler in the Garrard?
 
I should say, if your objective here is to restore the console rather than have the best possible sound, go to www.thevoiceofmusic.com, and email Gary and ask for advice about the best cartridge he has for your application. He's got lots of old stock, I've bought from him many times. Just keep in mind that an ceramic on an old changer will never sound as good as even the most basic hifi turntable from the 70s or 80s, especially with newer bass intensive records.
 
You'd probably get better results with an inexpensive MM cartridge and associated cheap phono stage. We are not talking megabucks here; an old MM Shure cartridge (say M75 off the 'bay) will sound pretty good. Or there is a very cheap Audio Technica made in China for very little (say $25). There's a long thread about this in the turntables section. Ask there for suggestions of a really cheap phono stage too.

Whatever cart you choose to use, if your Type A has hardened grease, you will need to clean that out.

Good luck with the restoration. And, welcome to the tubes and vinyl rabbit hole.
 
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