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What does a bad tube amp sound like?

I agree ceramic usually doesn't sound HIFI but the electrovoice ceramics that magnavox used are quite good.
 
In my experience on Magnavox anyways the phono ceramic in is usually EQed in a way that it is not flat so converting it to magnetic won't make it sound the best even with phono amp.
 
maxhifi said:
No - the only modern ceramic cartridges are the ones used on record players such as the crosley cruisers and similar at the very bottom end of the market. Quality ceramic cartridges have not been made in decades.

Maybe you will get lucky and find a Sonotone, a Decca Derem, or maybe even one of the better Ronnette cartridges which still have a compliant rubber suspension. It is really a gamble though without guaranteed results.

Also, how is the idler in the Garrard?
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Fortunate that TT was cared for some work must have been done on it. I lubed it and fixed a couple of mechanical issues. Oiled the bearings and the idle wheel is soft. Bonus. I have caps coming to start on the amps. Very happy with the mechanical performance.
 
Thank you all for input. MM cart is the way to go. I will start looking for a new phono stage.

I appreciate the quick and sage advice from all of you. Cheers
 
dave g II said:
Thank you all for input. MM cart is the way to go. I will start looking for a new phono stage.

I appreciate the quick and sage advice from all of you. Cheers
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With the MM cart, make sure you get one rated to track at up to 5 grams. The Stanton disco type cartridges were good for this. A light tracking cart will be completely incompatible with the arm bearings and trip mechanism of the garrard, and will tend to skip and mistrack.
 
arts said:
"What does a bad tube amp sound like?"

A transistor amp:p

Sorry,couldn't resist....
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I thought that's how a GOOD tube amp sounds :)

It's those bad ones with rolled off bass and treble, and a damping factor of 0.5 I don't like.
 
regore said:
Just buy a new stylus and move on from there. They're very reasonable in price and may even fix your shrill playback.
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Agreed.. I know magnetic sounds better but plugging a phono magnetic preamp into preamp that is expecting ceramic cart is going to sound worse than using ceramic. I tried it on my magnavox console. Even though people say ceramic is at line level the preamp circuitry for ceramic still being equalized ususually by having the highs rolled off and bass boost which helps fix the issues with ceramic carts. Without removing that circuitry the magnetic preamp is going to make it sound very bass heavy with the highs rolled off.
 
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dave g II said:
i realize it is a weird question but I just received a 60’s era Electrohome console with a Lorraine 40 radio, Garrard turntable and a 6bq5 output amp. Previous owner threw in a nat king cole record box set. I got the TT cleaned and lubed it works great and the NKC record sounds great. The problem is every other record I play sounds like crap. Painful to listen to very harsh highs.

My question now that I will start working on the amp and preamp “will recapping fix this?” Or is newer music just not meant to be played on older gear?

I suspect leaking coupling caps are the issue. I hope

I have a wave generator and a scope. Bought both recently and both are vintage and currently being recapped so I am unable to run a signal through it. I did bypass the crossover and speakers with a pair of Polk audio bookshelf and it still is “shrilly”


I have not found a before and after video on YouTube to hear what a bad amp sounds like so I am reaching out to you guys

Thanks in advance
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What you got is the 1960s equivalent of a boombox. How do you think should it sound? And stop playing vinyl on it - with every attempt you irreversably damage your records.

There are good sounding tube amplifiers, but you will unlikely find them in a console, unless it was custom made and was ultra expensive in its day - the equivalent of today's boutique high-end.
 
for_p1 said:
What you got is the 1960s equivalent of a boombox. How do you think should it sound? And stop playing vinyl on it - with every attempt you irreversably damage your records.

There are good sounding tube amplifiers, but you will unlikely find them in a console, unless it was custom made and was ultra expensive in its day - the equivalent of today's boutique high-end.
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It uses 6bq5 tubes which should be pretty HIFI sounding.
 
tonyg88 said:
Agreed.. I know magnetic sounds better but plugging a phono magnetic preamp into preamp that is expecting ceramic cart is going to sound worse than using ceramic. I tried it on my magnavox console. Even though people say ceramic is at line level the preamp circuitry for ceramic still being equalized ususually by having the highs rolled off and bass boost which helps fix the issues with ceramic carts. Without removing that circuitry the magnetic preamp is going to make it sound very bass heavy with the highs rolled off.
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Plug the magnetic preamp into the tape or TV input of the console, those are true line level inputs.
 
None of the ceramic phono inputs Inhave looked at had any EQ other than the high input resistance. When loaded with the proper Z (1-2Meg) a ceramic cart has a falling output with frequency that is similar to the RIAA curve.
 
If this were mine, I'd overhaul the Type A, fit it with a magnetic cartridge, and add in a phono preamp underneath to marry the mag cart to the stock input. The Type A is decent, but its not the best thing ever made. In proper working order they do sound fine though. I've got two of them myself. they like "DJ" cartridges that run in the 2-5 gram range. One of mine has a Shure SC35C, the other is either a Stanton 680e.v3 or a Pickering V15, I don't honestly remember which is mounted right now. They respond well to conical stylii too, no alignment is possible so a nail shape that doesn't get fussy about alignment needs is a good thing.


and yeah, the ceramic carts are equalized almost entirely by loading. Feed them with a normal line-level sort of device and the ceramic phono input behaves just like anything else. You'll typically see a 1-2M resistor at the input and maybe a small value cap, but thats it.
 
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