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What is/are the most probable cause(s) of this TT problem?

DangerBoy

DangerBoy

Active Member
I'm looking at buying a very cool and very retro Zenith record player and speaker system. I'm guessing it to be mid to late 60s to maybe early 70s. It's the kind with the cylindrical speakers with upwards facing full range drivers and the inverted hyperbolic cones above them to disperse the sound radially. It's so cool and retro looking, I really want to restore it and get it working again. :smoke:

The guy selling it says the main issue with it is that the tonearm tends to auto-return all the time and doesn't stay on the record very long. What is/are the most likely cause(s) of that?

The thing apparently does play and makes sound but I expect to have to replace most of the caps and other components, etc. Might want to replace or re-foam the full range drivers as well. Not sure if the amplifier part is tube or solid state. I will go to look at it tonight.
 
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With a fully automatic turntable, these problems are often caused by hardened lubrication in the mechanical system that moves the arm. Cleaning off the old lube and replacing it with fresh is the usual remedy.
 
It should be an easy fix. As the poster above said. clean off all the old lubricant and install new lube. There is a movable tooth in the main gear that turns to operate the auto function. Something is causing this tooth to be out in the trip position all the time.

Under normal operation as the turntable arm gets closer to the center of the record the arm connects with a metal bar that starts pushing the tooth out. The tooth gets pushed back because it's not sticking out far enough to trip the main gear until the tooth is pushed further out in one rotation by the arm moving rapidly toward the center of the record by the lead out groove. During the reject cycle the tooth gets pushed back in so it doesn't trigger again. Most likely either the bar that pushes the tooth out is not moving back properly and is pushing the tooth out again or something is not pushing the tooth in during the automatic cycle.
 
All of the above.

A time saver on getting the mechanism functioning can be a heat gun or hair dryer. As long as you are careful around plastic parts, it can safely and quickly soften the old lube and release stuck pivots and so on. Sometimes it can show you where you need to focus your attention on the more thorough cleaning. On some Dual changers I've had to apply heat just to be able to get some pieces apart.
 
Its probably a Voice of Music changer. Those are simple. The whole mechanism can be unbolted in one "unit" and you can flush and re-lube it fairly easily. If you take pictures as you go and if you're a bit mechanically inclined it shouldn't be more than a couple of hours for a first time through. You likely need new motor mount grommets and an idler wheel as well. thevoiceofmusic.com should be able to set you up with service info, parts, and whatever else you might need for it.

Again, assuming its a V-M. I know Zenith were using those in the mid 60s. I have a MicroTouch 2G in a circa 1964 console that I rebuilt for a friend's mom. I say I have it because it hasn't gone home yet.
 
I bought the system! It's a 1960s Zenith Z565 Moderne Record Player and Circle of Sound speakers. Below are pictures of the actual system that I purchased.

The system wasn't working when I got it because the internal fuse was blown. The seller told me he accidentally blew the fuse while doing some tinkering on the unit but prior to that it was working and could play records but there were problems as described earlier with the auto-return system.

I haven't decided yet what my plans are for this system other than I do intend to resell it and try to make a little profit on it. I want to make it something very cool and desirable for hipsters to own. I also intend to create some threads chronicling the restoration or modernization process.

There are a number of ways I can go with this. Option 1 would be to simply recap it, get everything including the mechanicals working 100% and resell it. I could do some upgrades to the speakers as part of this option.

Option 2 is doing everything in Option 1 and then also installing a Raspberry Pi Media streamer system inside the unit so not only will it play records and look very retro and cool, it can also play digital music streamed from a network share or Internet source via wifi and mobile devices via Bluetooth or Airplay. The media streamer system would be remotely controlled from a smart phone or tablet and would be tied into the auxilliary input side of the built-in amplifier. Upgrading the speakers would definitely be on the plate for this option.

Option 3 would be adding the Raspberry Pi streaming system and doing the speaker upgrades in Option 2 but would also entail doing away with the built in amplifier and replacing it with a modern solid state amplifier inside the chassis. This would likely improve the sound and reliability quite a bit but would render most of the sound control knobs useless and likely add a few layers of complexity that I haven't even conceived of yet.

I will post a thread about the upgrading and modifications to the Circle of Sound Speakers in the speakers Forum. Not sure where I should start the thread for doing all of the mods and upgrades to the record player unit and adding the media streamer system. I would welcome people's suggestions on this.

View media item 12153 View media item 12154
 
yep, VM changer, probably a 1200 series or something awful close to it. They look like this from the bottom side. This is a model 1252 out of a 1963 console but VM made a ton of nearly identical machines over the years. The knobs and other trim bits changed but the guts really did not.

anyway that whole section in the middle where the gunky grease is will be the problem. 100_0566.JPG

This is quite probably what the idler wheel looks like.

100_0587.JPG

as you can see, the whole mechanism will drop out of it for service.

100_0609.JPG

basically take it out, clean all of the old lube out, sparingly install new grease and put it back together.
 
Does anybody happen to know what voltage the power transformer in that record player puts out? There is no writing on the transformer whatsoever. The light bulbs used to illuminate the control dials are TS-1847s rated for 6.3 V.
 
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