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When does power output @ 2Ω become important?

I put in my 2 cents and stand by them!
Regards,
Jim
 
guiller said:
Please bear in mind that the OP specifically asked about the AR-3A speakers. Unless I am mistaken, they are not the most difficult loads to most amps (the rated impedance is 4 ohms), I mean, perhaps what you mentioned would be more than enough, probably good even for some far more difficult loads. As I've mentioned, in my concrete experience of several years, the AR's just behave nicely with non high current amps, like the Nikko Alpha 2, provided they have enough power (I would use 100+ wpc). Perhaps somebody could bring in a plot of the actual impedance versus frequency for the AR-3As. Or perhaps the OP could ask in the Speakers forum, given that it is for these speakers that the question was raised.

PS: this is the basic data sheet for the AR-3As : http://audio-database.com/AR/amp_speaker/ar-3a-e.html
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Understood. I was simply stating that manufacturers that choose to print a 2 or 4 ohm spec, doesn't make the amp a 2 ohm or 4 ohm capable amp any more than an amplifier that doesn't publish a 2 ohm or 4 ohm spec. I never said that AR-4x's were hard to drive either, It's been my experience that they are not.
 
I think I read someone saying the tweeter of 3a can sometimes go 'down' as low as 2 ohm and therefore require an amp capable of driving that - true?
 
davidro said:
I think I read someone saying the tweeter of 3a can sometimes go 'down' as low as 2 ohm and therefore require an amp capable of driving that - true?
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I am not aware of that. Actually, I was looking in the net for the impedance spectrum to look for the minima, but didn´t succeed in doing that. Why don´t you ask in the speakers forum? There are real experts in those vintage AR´s over there that perhaps wouldn´t look into this thread.
 
davidro said:
I think I read someone saying the tweeter of 3a can sometimes go 'down' as low as 2 ohm and therefore require an amp capable of driving that - true?
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I would say "no". Any, halfway decent, amp is going to be fine with a tweeter dipping down to 2 ohms. It would be nice to know the frequency where the impedance dropped to 2 ohms. There's not a whole lot of power that's thrown at the tweeter. If you have some software that has an FFT, or other spectrum measuring function, you can see that music is very bass and midrange heavy. There's not too much power directed at the tweeters. Since this is the case, there's not a high average high frequency power that the amplifier has to develop. That makes the current through the output transistors have a much lower average than if the woofers and or midrange drivers were 2 or 4 ohms.

It'll be fine as long as your goal isn't to have the speakers for parties, etc. If you needed a party amp, I'd totally go the pro amp route.
 
My amp is Marantz PM5003. It is capable of driving 4 ohm at 55W only. I haven't actually felt as if I need more 'volume' though. I Listen to classical music mainly and frankly when I hear bass0heavy pop music the bass is pretty damn overwhelming indeed. But I wonder stronger amp would make the AR sound 'better', which is why I'm looking for a more powerful one.
 
davidro said:
But I wonder stronger amp would make the AR sound 'better', which is why I'm looking for a more powerful one.
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IMO, generally, only if your demands exceed what the Marantz can deliver. That said, some report better sound even at lower volumes with a higher powered amp. Of course, without checking for clipping or other signs of distress, it's hard to say why such things might be perceived.
 
whoaru99 said:
IMO, generally, only if your demands exceed what the Marantz can deliver. That said, some report better sound even at lower volumes with a higher powered amp. Of course, without checking for clipping or other signs of distress, it's hard to say why such things might be perceived.
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That's what I'm wondering about. I have used amps that are 30-40W stronger than my Marantz on another pair of speakers but wasn't able to tell the difference. Heck I can't even tell the difference between the Marantz and my NAD. But AR-3a being 4 ohm speakers and how people talk about air suspended woofer requires a lot of power etc I'm just curious you know. Do people mean volume when they talk about 'power'?
 
whoaru99 said:
IMO, generally, only if your demands exceed what the Marantz can deliver. That said, some report better sound even at lower volumes with a higher powered amp. Of course, without checking for clipping or other signs of distress, it's hard to say why such things might be perceived.
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For the specific case of the AR-3, that is indeed my experience. Driving them with some amplifiers in the 55-65 wpc range (Sony TA-3650 and Nikko NA-1050) was one thing, but the moment I fed them with a Nikko Alpha 2 (120 wpc), the sound improved a lot. Not that this changed the moderate volume levels I use (I´m a classical music lover). However, all the other aspects of sound quality at moderate levels improved. Certainly, the Alpha 2 is a dual mono amp and of better quality than those mentioned. The bottom of the line is: David and I listen to similar types of music and I´ve noticed a big improvement in sound quality by using a more powerful amplifier, so, I would suggest that this possibility is one to be tried, independently of the reasons that may be behind this behavior, IMHO.
 
guiller said:
For the specific case of the AR-3, that is indeed my experience. Driving them with some amplifiers in the 55-65 wpc range (Sony TA-3650 and Nikko NA-1050) was one thing, but the moment I fed them with a Nikko Alpha 2 (120 wpc), the sound improved a lot. Not that this changed the moderate volume levels I use (I´m a classical music lover). However, all the other aspects of sound quality at moderate levels improved. Certainly, the Alpha 2 is a dual mono amp and of better quality than those mentioned. The bottom of the line is: David and I listen to similar types of music and I´ve noticed a big improvement in sound quality by using a more powerful amplifier, so, I would suggest that this possibility is one to be tried, independently of the reasons that may be behind this behavior, IMHO.
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Guille I'll have to get myself a more powerful amp no matter wht in that case :D
 
davidro said:
Guille I'll have to get myself a more powerful amp no matter wht in that case :D
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Yes, this came as a surprise to me as the Nikko was used to power my main system. After I bought the Byston 4B, the Nikko remained jobless and I decided to give it a try on my bedroom system. I was very surprised, as I always listen with low levels in my bedroom. For example, the solo piano recordings sound so natural now on those AR-3´s that it came as a suprised to me.
 
David, many people report that the AR-3A´s mate well with lower powered tube amps, like the Dynaco ST-70 (35 WPC). This certainly means that power is not the only variable in the game. Do you have a chance of finding one locally at a reasonable price?
 
Not really Guille. I've always been interested in that Dynaco. I even considered importing a kit from the States and make one myself but the costs was going to be more than 1.5K. So I gave up :(
 
Leak goes for pretty much the same money....before restoration that is. And that's if you can find one!
 
guiller said:
Yes, this came as a surprise to me as the Nikko was used to power my main system. After I bought the Byston 4B, the Nikko remained jobless and I decided to give it a try on my bedroom system. I was very surprised, as I always listen with low levels in my bedroom. For example, the solo piano recordings sound so natural now on those AR-3´s that it came as a suprised to me.
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Actually Guille have you powered the 3a with the 4B?
 
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