• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

When it sounds good it sounds good!

Mister Pig said:
Wabbit season duck season wabbit season duck season wabbit season wabbit season duck season....BLAM!!! Duck picks his bill up. Don't think the duck was the smart one... pretty sure it was the wabbit.

Regards
Mister Pig
Click to expand...

Bugs: "Yeah, I'm a rabbit alright... Do you wanna' shoot me now or wait til you get home?"

Daffy: "SHOOT HIM NOW! ... SHOOT HIM NOW!"

Bugs: "You stay out of this! He doesn't have to shoot you now."

Daffy: "He does SO have to shoot me now!"

[Walks over to Elmer Fudd]

Daffy: "I demand that you shoot me now!"... [Sticks tongue out at Bugs] ... "Myah."

*BOOM!!*


I love that one....

Daffy: "Aha!!! .... PROnoun trrrouble."
 
Last edited:
Gang-Twanger said:
Bugs: "Yeah, I'm a rabbit alright... Do you wanna' shoot me now or wait til you get home?"

Daffy: "SHOOT HIM NOW! ... SHOOT HIM NOW!"

Bugs: "You stay out of this! He doesn't have to shoot you now."

Daffy: "He does SO have to shoot me now!"

[Walks over to Elmer Fudd]

Daffy: "I demand that you shoot me now!"... [Sticks tongue out at Bugs] ... "Myah."

*BOOM!!*


I love that one....

Daffy: "Aha!!! .... PROnoun trrrouble."
Click to expand...

Your despicable.....:D

Regards
Mister Pig
 
stoutblock said:
I am a firm believer that if you think it sounds good, it does.

I have two audio buddies that have both been into audio for a very long time. Although they both don't know each other, they separately come over from time to time and we end up listening to my system. Although I never ask for their input, they both seem obligated to give it. One of them is always very complimentary and likes the direction and progress I have made in finding a good sounding system. The other one is not necessarily negative, but he focuses more on the gaps in my system that keeps it from being perfect.

Sometimes I think both these guys don't really care about the music I am actually playing but only on how the system is playing it?

I appreciate both of their inputs to some degree but I have to say I have learned to mostly ignore both of them. Just because one of them is satisfied with what he hears does not mean I am, and just because the other is not satisfied does not mean that I am not. I think audio expectations are a very personal thing and completely subjective by nature.

I guess it is a complement to me when I go to their homes and they go out of their way to get feedback from me on their systems. I just say it sounds nice. Then I focus on talking about music and listening to some.... Drives them both crazy!

I guess it depends weather you have a system so you can listen to music or have music so you can listen to your system. :smoke:
Click to expand...

I view the first guy as having great respect for your system as well as your opinion on gear, yours AND his, so I wouldn't want to confuse respect with shallowness or materialism. And he does seem to care about what you have to say, and that's a good thing (The other guy sounds like he cares about what HE has to say). Anyway, just putting that out there.:)
 
Last edited:
Gang-Twanger said:
I view the first guy as having great respect for your system as well as your opinion on gear, yours AND his, so I wouldn't want to confuse respect with shallowness or materialism. And he does seem to care about what you have to say, and that's a good thing (The other guy sounds like he cares about what HE has to say). Anyway, just putting that out there.:)
Click to expand...

Maybe, maybe not.

I'm kind of that way with cars. My friends will often let me drive their cars so I can make suggestions as to how to prioritize future work. I've recently driven a modded Integra and commented to the owner that I thought the suspension was underdamped, and I don't think that he took it to mean I was disrespectful but actually acknowledged my input.

I know my own car probably needs some suspension work as well; stock dampers with 90K miles on them aren't getting it done anymore. Switching to some better, non-RFT, and upsized tires have mitigated that somewhat but I still would soften up the springs but turn up the damping a little had I the $$$ to play. (why are coilovers so expensive?)

yes, it's the car I use to haul my ass around on a daily basis. Just like your receiver and speakers are what you use to listen to the news every morning :P
 
Nice thread, we have all heard the BEST sound system on earth, just walk out the door and visit nature(birds tweeting, wind blowing the leaves, waves crashing, crickets, thunder, pure and unadulterated, wireless, natural sound the way we were meant to perceive it, can we improve on that? So the quest for the best sound system seems pointless when dollars and SENSE are involved.

It is an empty quest that has no end, only to satisfy ones sensory perceptors, but it sure is a fun hobby. I'll probably stick with what I have, maybe a new amp when this one burns out, but it's all old, used, and sounding fine.
 
stoutblock said:
I am a firm believer that if you think it sounds good, it does.

I have two audio buddies that have both been into audio for a very long time. Although they both don't know each other, they separately come over from time to time and we end up listening to my system. Although I never ask for their input, they both seem obligated to give it. One of them is always very complimentary and likes the direction and progress I have made in finding a good sounding system. The other one is not necessarily negative, but he focuses more on the gaps in my system that keeps it from being perfect.

Sometimes I think both these guys don't really care about the music I am actually playing but only on how the system is playing it?

I appreciate both of their inputs to some degree but I have to say I have learned to mostly ignore both of them. Just because one of them is satisfied with what he hears does not mean I am, and just because the other is not satisfied does not mean that I am not. I think audio expectations are a very personal thing and completely subjective by nature.

I guess it is a complement to me when I go to their homes and they go out of their way to get feedback from me on their systems. I just say it sounds nice. Then I focus on talking about music and listening to some.... Drives them both crazy!

I guess it depends weather you have a system so you can listen to music or have music so you can listen to your system. :smoke:
Click to expand...

My bold.

In this case, IMO, this only means that it sounds good to you. Sounding good to you doesn't necessarily mean that it will sound good to anyone else. I've heard some systems that the owner loved while I'd rather listen to a table radio.

Acquiring validation from other interested parties seems to be part of this hobby for some.
 
JoeESP9 said:
My bold.

In this case, IMO, this only means that it sounds good to you. Sounding good to you doesn't necessarily mean that it will sound good to anyone else. I've heard some systems that the owner loved while I'd rather listen to a table radio.

Acquiring validation from other interested parties seems to be part of this hobby for some.
Click to expand...

If the credibility of the source of the validation is known then said validation (or otherwise) can be a very useful metric in building a system....provided improving it is a desired result.
 
Of course! Don't ask for an opinion if you don't value that opinion. I have two long time buddies whose audio opinions I value highly. One has MG-3.6's and a custom 15" TL sub woofer the other has NHT Super Zero One's and an older (servo) Velodyne subwoofer. Their systems sound nothing alike. However, I value both of their opinions.
 
Gang-Twanger I really like the musichall headphone amp. It is a nice sounding unit. For the price point I think it is hard to beat. Has a really great warm tube sound.
 
I definitely agree with diminishing returns, and it starts with high level midfi for me.
I happily listen to Adcom / Klipsch KG4 setup that I assembled for under 1K, and also the high level Denon mini system that's 1K.

Although I am slowly coming to appreciate the 62 grand system and the different aesthetic experience it offers, it's not worth 62 times the money in my book.

If I were advising my sons and daughters on audio, I would recommend them to stop with good midfi and never venture into the prohibitively expensive hifi land, with it's infamous diminishing returns - there is plenty of enjoyment to be had in variety of midfi setups...
 
Gang-Twanger said:
Hey vintage... How's that Music Hall amp treating you? I think another person who bought the Dentons is using one of those, so I've been wondering if I might be able to score one.
Click to expand...

I'm the other person :D. It really is a lovely amp, sending it back for something different hasn't crossed my mind yet. It definitely isn't warm, but not analytical either, nice and musical. It's definitely more musical than my NAD C350, which sounds on the dry side in comparison. I bought the demo model on Music Direct for $450. You may be able to find the predecessor, the a15.2, for a nice price used.
 
If I were advising my sons and daughters on audio, I would recommend them to stop with good midfi and never venture into the prohibitively expensive hifi land, with it's infamous diminishing returns - there is plenty of enjoyment to be had in variety of midfi setups...
Click to expand...
So, if i understand correctly, what you're saying is that "good enough is good enough" and one should not strive to do better?

I would strongly opine the the point of diminishing returns is a very different place from individual to individual.

Sometimes it's difficult, but i try not to impose my own biases on others, particularly those closest to me.
 
It is not so much where the point you enter into diminishing returns is but how far past that point you are prepared to go. This depends more on the pleasure you gain out of small improvements rather than an objective measure of improvement/$. I am certainly 'guilty' of going well into diminishing returns territory but still gain a great deal of pleasure out of the improvements I get with each upgrade.

It must be similar for those who collect rooms full of vintage equipment. There is little or no logical justification for assembling a vast collection of similar performing gear yet it appears some gain a lot of pleasure out of doing so.

Steve
 
Last edited:
gongli said:
I definitely agree with diminishing returns, and it starts with high level midfi for me.
I happily listen to Adcom / Klipsch KG4 setup that I assembled for under 1K, and also the high level Denon mini system that's 1K.

Although I am slowly coming to appreciate the 62 grand system and the different aesthetic experience it offers, it's not worth 62 times the money in my book.

If I were advising my sons and daughters on audio, I would recommend them to stop with good midfi and never venture into the prohibitively expensive hifi land, with it's infamous diminishing returns - there is plenty of enjoyment to be had in variety of midfi setups...
Click to expand...

With all due respect. You don't know what the 62 grand system is capable of given its set up and placement in a room. Having it all tucked into one corner of a room like the old all in one rack systems is going to handicap any system. The room and the placement of gear, especially speakers is equally important as the hardware that is picked out...if not more so. You cannot make the best of gear reach its potential when improperly set up. Making any kind of value judgement and or recommendation based on listening to this system in this set up is misleading and irresponsible. Sorry to be a bit harsh with that last statement, but it really is the case.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
I'm probably guilty of over spending on audio gear and as I get older I and pulling way back but back in my heyday; when Audiogon was free and bargains where there for the taking I did a ton of buying/selling. I made a little bit of money as I went from piece to piece. Every year I would burn part of my tax return on the system. Never cutting into savings or any monthly expense, I had to make the upgrade money selling off gear. I was constantly trolling for the killer deal. I ended up with a system well past $30K. This may not make a lot of sense to most of you but I loved doing it! I would hang onto an amp or speakers for 6 months to a year and let em fly. I always wanted a Nakamichi PA7, so I bought 2 of them and a PA5. It was a great setup but I let them go and put the money into a couple Mark Levinson amplifiers. I was all over the place. I learned a lot about what I like and don't like. I got to know quite a few local audio heads and listen to a lot of great music. So even though I was guilty of having what I thought was too much tied up into audio, it's not like I walked into an audio store, pulled out my checkbook week after week and laid down money for the next great thing. I am a firm believer that you never know what a piece of equipment will sound like until you get it in the rack and listen to it for a few months. It's sometimes only after you sell it off that you realize how great it was. Now I am more interested in the music and just listening. I got burned out with all the the packing, shipping and people who complain. It was a fun hobby and I built a pretty nice system that I didn't have to go out on a limb to afford. In deed I had $30K tied up in a system that at times I didn't care for. I kept at it until I put a system together that made me happy. I was lucky and it was a lot less than $30K - but it still gives me those wow moments I live for when listening to music.

So getting back to the OP's post; What some might see the hassle of constantly looking for better and better, can lead you to a firm understanding of what you like over time. Buying used gear let me play and learn for little or no money. I actually liked all the back and forth. It was never about "I'm better than you" in fact I rarely played the main system when people were around. I wasn't looking for compliments or criticisms. I know that no one hears the way I do, or has my messed up musical tastes, so each system sounds different to each individual. It's about learning and experiencing. I'm sure I'm not the only one out there who has gone down this path. If I am, I wonder what all that competition for gear was back in the 90's.

One last thought,

I killed the WABBIT!!! (I had to throw that in)
 
I've been building and changing my system for 40+years. I'ts evolved from a 2 channel system to a full blown 5.1 surround system. I still use it 2 channel +sub with my TT and FLAC files streamed over the house wired network. I love the 2 channel sound I get and the 5.1 sound from Blueray when watching movies. Will I change anything now? Hard to say, I might upgrade the phono but the sound is great to my ears. Wife loves it as well so maybe I'll just keep things as they are.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom