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why do you need a machine to clean records?

Here's Mark III of my wand. The slits are wider, and the spindle hole is much closer to the ideal size. (It's upside down, of course.) Took about Half an hour to make, including sanding for beauty.:D

I super glued the record drop mechanism so It wouldn't impede installation of the wand. So long automatic mode, BSR.:yes:

I believe nylon bristle brushes are available, but the cool thing is you can use any brush that you think is best. And you can brush and vacuum at the same time.

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that looks like that could work quite nicely!
 
Question directed at RCM devotees: How would using a spin clean followed up by a good vacuuming compare with a vpi or

Thanks

I've never used a spin clean so I can't accurately comment on it's quality of scrubbing but (IMO) vacuuming is always better than not vacuuming. I'd say do it if you can. And Rinse! Does a spin clean allow for rinsing? I'm thinking not - isn't it all one tank of "soap water"?
 
Air leakage is necessary, because what moves the water is not the vacuum, but the movement of air. The air has to come from somewhere -- through the fabric or something. It wouldn't be difficult to glue some velour along the slits to improve suction, but the fabric needs to be porous somewhere. With two pickups, it might be interesting to have the first pick up some of the crud in the fabric and the second complete the vacuuming. I like the idea of throwaway fabric,

I've found I don't have to sew the socks. I can just cut 3"x5" pieces, wrap them around the wand and hold them in place with office clips. The weight of the clips is about right to hold the wand against the record.

Anyway, the whole thing is so ridiculously easy and cheap that I can experiment with all kinds of configurations.

The air would come through the grooves as there's no way that the flat wand is going to to conform to them. And you need a hole in the fabric, a slit, for the debris to get sucked into the vacuum- that's all I'm saying. Obviously if you have a total seal you just end up with a wand stuck to the record. I'm only relating how the actual record cleaning machines do it as a way of trying to help.
 
I've never used a spin clean so I can't accurately comment on it's quality of scrubbing but (IMO) vacuuming is always better than not vacuuming. I'd say do it if you can. And Rinse! Does a spin clean allow for rinsing? I'm thinking not - isn't it all one tank of "soap water"?

You can rinse them after you're done, but they solution they use envelopes the dirt and makes it sink to the bottom. I have yet to have a record that hasn't sounded significantly better after a run through the spin clean.
 
Air leakage is necessary, because what moves the water is not the vacuum, but the movement of air. The air has to come from somewhere -- through the fabric or something.
Correct. That's why nylon mesh is ideal because it allows for maximum leakage.
 
The air would come through the grooves

I haven't done the physics, but I doubt enough air comes through the grooves.

I suspect there air flow through the fabric, just as there is air flow through floor vacuum cleaner brushes the dirt and water get swept along for the ride.
 
I Just Took A Look At the Wand On My VPI

I haven't done the physics, but I doubt enough air comes through the grooves.

I suspect there air flow through the fabric, just as there is air flow through floor vacuum cleaner brushes the dirt and water get swept along for the ride.

I believe the felt strips on each side of the slit in the tube create a space between the wand and the record surface. So the slit itself does not contact the record. So yes air from above the record would be pulled in along with the fluid.

At least thats the way I see it.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
I'm basically just saying that you should leave a slit in whatever it is for the crud to go up into the wand instead of getting sucked onto the fabric, by completely wrapping the fabric around the wand. And the velour-like material that is used on many record brushes, including what is on my Nitty Gritty, seems to work really well. I'm not saying there's anything magical about record cleaners- the nitty gritty looks like something I could have made in shop class.
 
I'm basically just saying that you should leave a slit in whatever it is for the crud to go up into the wand instead of getting sucked onto the fabric

I agree in principle. I'm just going to build several wands and experiment with fabric and placement. I already have something a lot better than sink washing, so it will be interesting to see if I can do better.

I don't think I'll reach the convenience level of the professional machines, but I see no reason why my device can't do as well at cleaning.
 
Thats pretty cool, can u use just a regular vacuum? not enough water to hurt?

Depends. I wouldn't use an expensive regular vacuum, and I definitely wouldn't use a bagless vacuum. Moisture would turn the dust to mud, then clay.

But unless you plan to do 50 in one session, I think most of the water will line the hose and evaporate. Small Shop Vacs are $30 at Lowes.

I'll report back as I experiment with fabric.
 
I agree in principle. I'm just going to build several wands and experiment with fabric and placement. I already have something a lot better than sink washing, so it will be interesting to see if I can do better.

I don't think I'll reach the convenience level of the professional machines, but I see no reason why my device can't do as well at cleaning.
You're onto something interesting with that design. I like the way you tethered the wand to the spindle.

I have a manual cleaning and vacuuming system I wrote about (with pictures) here:
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=192217

But here's a photo from it of the schnozzles i made (one for wash and one for rinse). I cut the slits the exact width of LP grooves and about 1/4 inch wide to let air in. I lined to two sides of the slit with strips of disposable pint pads available at the hardware store for under $3. I used 2-sided Scotch tape which holds them firmly, but still allows me to peel them off and replace them when they get dirty. I cut the slots with a putty knife heated over a plumbers torch, BTW.

The advantage to using paint pads instead of fabric is that they hold very little moisture and that's good IMO because I would think wet fabric would get wet and lay the water back down on the record.

I figure I want the vacuum to be strong enough to completely dry the LP in two revolutions by actually lifting the water off the LP and not simply evaporating it by passing air over it.

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My Solution

Thats pretty cool, can u use just a regular vacuum? not enough water to hurt?
I use a system similar to the suction machines you see in hospitals. I mounted a mason jar to a hobby box. The hobby box is mounted directly below the VPI wand assembly. There is a pipe that extends from the bottom of the wand assembly, through the hobby box and extending down in the jar ~2 inches.

The hose to the vaccum is hooked up to the hobby box, therefore the air and water are sucked into the jar where almost all the water stays. I've had no problems.
 
I use a system similar to the suction machines you see in hospitals.

I've thought about making a small collector that does the same thing as a Shop Vac, but for $30 I'm inclined to go with ready-made.
 
I use a system similar to the suction machines you see in hospitals. I mounted a mason jar to a hobby box. The hobby box is mounted directly below the VPI wand assembly. There is a pipe that extends from the bottom of the wand assembly, through the hobby box and extending down in the jar ~2 inches.

The hose to the vaccum is hooked up to the hobby box, therefore the air and water are sucked into the jar where almost all the water stays. I've had no problems.

What is a hobby box? Pics?
 
I spent yesterday renovating my digitalizing station.

The receiver is a Yamaha RX-550 ($10), Cassette player, a Yamaha KX-W282 ($10), Technics 1200 Mk2 with AT Series VIII cart ($175), BSR TT(free), Behringer FCA-202 DAC ($5), Homemade computer made largely from Garage sale, ebay and hand-me-down parts. Shelving from WalMart.

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I believe the felt strips on each side of the slit in the tube create a space between the wand and the record surface. So the slit itself does not contact the record. So yes air from above the record would be pulled in along with the fluid.

Keep what Mr. Pig says here in mind if you're going the DIY route. The slot on either the Nitty Gritty or the VPI is not directly facing the vinyl surface.

On the VPI, the velvet strip rides along the surface of the record while the slit is aimed towards the oncoming record. I hope that makes sense. I've attached the crudest drawing ever to help.
 

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Okay, after a year or more of planning and intending to do it, I finally made my RCM. I was going to take an old vacuum motor, which I have, and build it into a box to make it look very professional, but I could never seem to find the time to do that what with all my other projects. So I finally just set up an old turntable on a workbench, then went to Sears and bought their $30 Shop Vac. It works great! It has plenty of suction power to dry 98% of the record in a single pass. Another pass or two and it's done.

The most time consuming part was making the wand (took about half an hour -- not counting the time for the epoxy to dry). Following the ideas of a DIY RCM website I found, I took the crevice tool and cut off the end, then filled the opening with a piece of scrap. I epoxied that in place, which formed a completely tight seal on the end. Next I put my Dremel tool in a stand (for stability) and, using a cutoff wheel, fed the crevice tool sideways to cut the slot. The slot is about a sixteenth of an inch wide. I made it a little longer than necessary for airflow -- otherwise it forms a seal and just sticks to the record.

Finally, I took an extra pad that came with my hand held MoFi record cleaner thing (kind of like a DiscWasher, but much better -- it's that black thing to the left in the first picture), and I trimmed off some thin strips to line the sides of the slit. I put my slit on the narrow surface of the wand, to minimize surface contact with the record. Maybe because of the rapid airflow, the velvet material doesn't seem to retain much water, if any.

Before modifying the crevice tool, I tried just covering the original opening with microfiber cloth, held in place with a rubber band. I cut a slit in the fabric to improve airflow. That didn't work too well -- even though the vacuum sucked up most of the liquid, the fabric soaked up a lot of liquid too, which just got smeared around the surface of the record. I was looking to avoid the work of modifying the crevice tool, but this lazy version didn't work for me.

Here are some pix of the homemade wand:

This is a shot of the end, capped with epoxy:

DIY-record-cleaner2.gif


Here is the tool, showing the side slit:

DIY-record-cleaner1.gif


For fluids, I'm using MoFi Record Wash, which is made for RCMs (no alcohol, as you don't need an evaporating agent, obviously). I apply the fluid in a small puddle directly on the record surface, then spread it and wash with my MoFi record brush. For very dirty thrift store finds, I add a step with MoFi's Super Deep Clean Record Wash, which I apply with my old DiscWasher brush. Sometimes I finish with a distilled water rinse/vacuum. I'm not sure that's necessary though.

So, how does it work?

I wish I had taken the time to do this years ago. The difference is, as others have stated, no less than astounding. Albums that were unlistenable due to surface noise, including a couple of very expensive reissues that I never got around to returning but could never listen to because of the crackling -- those albums are now dead silent. How brand new albums arrive in that state, I don't know, but the vacuum RCM fixes them.

I even had one album that I bought yesterday where the stylus would jump the groove at the beginning of the record. I thought it was a groove defect, and I was about to return it when I took a closer look at it. It looked like a scuff or some crud was on the edge of the album. I figured it was worth a try, so I vacuum cleaned it, and it played perfectly. No more groove jumping.

I have lots of thrift store records that are in good shape, groove wise, but filthy. Even after sink washing with high pressure water and lots of elbow grease, they would still be crackly, and the stylus would dig out all kinds of crud. After vacuum cleaning, they are amazingly quiet.

Not only are the records quiet, but they sound better in every way. I'm really glad I finally did this.
 
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