Johncan
Record collector
Did you remove the transit screws from the suspension? Mine has two screws that hold the suspension tight during shipping. They are located between the T-Bar and the underside of the chassis.
John
Anyone recognize this Fons TT?
- Thread starter absolon
- Start date
Did you remove the transit screws from the suspension? Mine has two screws that hold the suspension tight during shipping. They are located between the T-Bar and the underside of the chassis.
John
absolon
Super Member
I found the strobe a bit garish looking but I've grown accustomed to it. The TT looks markedly better in a taller teak plinth I built for it.
The suspension on mine is not as soft as my Unamco suspended TT but dips visibly when I put the 600g weight I use on the record. More than sufficient isolation from footfalls and speakers. Mine came without transit screws so I've not looked at that, but I suspect Johncan is right.
The rings on mine are unquestionably a mat substitute. They are located at the outer and inner diameters of the groove region on a record and a third in the label region. As far as I can tell, they are glued in a shallow channel and I'm careful with them. Any additional mat tends to sag between the rings.
The motor is not isolated from the T-frame holding the platter bearing - this is very different from the 'typical' suspended belt drives out there. It's a DC motor so there is no 30 Hz or 5 Hz hum to reject as is needed with an AC motor.
Are the three suspension wingnuts loosened a bit? If they are screwed in all the way the suspension is very tight - and if the transit 'bits' are sticking outwards (away from the platter) then the whole thing will be rigid. When they are flipped inside, they stick into a ridge in the platter just above where the belt goes, making platter removal impossible - I took mine out. All hard to explain but you'll know it when you see it!
As well, the speed control pots and selection switches probably need a cleaning with proper electrical contact cleaner - the speed on mine has remained dead on for weeks (months?) now with no adjustments. I like the strobe platter - the looks of it encourages putting a record on to cover it up!
Keep at it - it should end up sounding about as good as the other tables you have.
Wow - except for the cartridge that's exactly what I have, the rosewood(?) CQ30 with an SMEIII (both purchased new). It has been unused for about 5 years and I'm going through most of my components and fixing them up.
First up I would like to replace the TT belt. It works but it's original and flabby. Is there an AK member that sells these? Or where to go?
The other thing it sounds like I should do is see if I have the 'plastic' bearing.
What kind of adjustment did you do to the springs?
For the forums info, I have an old gel(?) 'Platter Matter' mat for it that always seemed a nice fit for the unit. Fits perfectly within the outer platter ridge.
Original owner - welcome! The CQ-30 and SME III seem to work well together for me, and it does look good. I was going to put a different arm on it (Sumiko MMT) but a Big drawback of this table is that the arm board is not a simple slab of wood to replace. (it does look like it is, but if/when you take one apart you'll see...) I'd have to make a fairly complex fitting to install a new arm, or cover the existing hole with an aluminum or steel plate and drill a hole in the right spot.
I kept the original belt, but I did find a seller a while back online that had one. I think a Google search should turn something up. I don't think anyone here sells belts.
For the springs I ended up loosening them all the way - at which point the platter rubs on the top side. Then I sequentially tightened them up until the arm board portion sat flush with top deck, and left them at that. The platter doesn't rub and the the arm is free. There isn't much 'travel' but it's not a dirt bike either. I have found it to be much more sensitive to walking on the floor than an unsuspended table in the same location - I need to put it on a heavy base.
Thanks for the Platter Matter tip - I actually have one to try out!
Patchoulain
New Member
Hi - I don't *think* they're transit screws. According to the instructions the only means of securing the suspension in transit is a set of cardboard wedges.
Those screws seem to locate tabs that sit in a cutout in the platter, and might serve the purpose of locating the platter height properly(?), and preventing removal of the platter (which is a royal pain if you need to get to the belt).
I've got the TT apart at the moment, and I think I'll try it without the screws/pegs and see what happens.
Patchoulain
New Member
Thanks for that.
The motor mounting is a mixed blessing. It helps belt alignment, but measurements show quite a bit of breakthrough. Audibly, it's silent on 45, but sadly there's a kind of resonance, a high pitched feint noise, at 33.
I'm going to try removing the 'transit' screws and let the suspension out, as you suggest. This will mean making a shim to raise the arm board. The switches work fine (except the buttons pop out!), but a squirt with contact cleaner won't do any harm.
I agree about the cutout in the platter being there to hold the platter in place - and changing the belt on this table is not definately as easy as a Thorens or AR. If those tabs are placed facing outwards and the spring tower wingnuts tightened down you do end up locking the suspension in place - this was how mine was shipped to me. I took the pegs and bolts out.
Are you hearing a motor noise through a cartridge or with a stethescope held on arm board or the platter with no belt in place? That's a tough test, I'd suspect that for most 'traditional' belt drives (AR, Thorens, etc.) some noise gets through - one reason the modern high end tables went with seperate motor blocks sitting isolated from the main table.
One thing on mine is the motor does make a slight ticking sound heard very faintly - I suspect the brushes on the DC motor. I have no idea what to replace that motor with if needed, but I suspect a tape deck motor was the basis for it.
That sounds like what I did when I initially set it up... basically let the springs out as far as reasonable.
Perhaps. One of the downsides of this table is it's non-existent foot isolation which I don't mind so much (not as bad as cutting corners on the unit itself, it can be remedied externally, which they probably intended). I'm curious what an inch of layered bubble-wrap underneath it would do... help isolate or just make it bouncy. I remember a story of a fellow who inflated an inner tube, put a heavy base on that, then the CQ30... said it worked fabulous. I suspect it did, but not pretty.
steph_gaynor
Well-Known Member
Parts for Fons CQ30 -- Motor, Belt, Armboard?
Hi,
I have been enjoying my Fons CQ 30 w/ Sumiko MMT tonearm very much for both 78s and LPs. For lps, I am using a rebuilt/retipped Benz Glider which is heavenly. Expert Stylus in England did the work and it is just lovely. Any ways, I was wondering if anyone know a source for replacement parts for the Fons CQ30?
My motor is fine at the moment but given its age, I'd love to know if I could find a replacement. I was tuning the suspension to accomodate a heavier cartridge and looked closely at the motor from underneath and could not make out a brand or any specs.
My belt looks to be as new, but it would be great to know a source for replacement parts.
Finally, I see that my arm board was damaged by the overtightening of the tonearm mount. The bottom face of the board has some damage and what could be the start of 2 splits by the screw holes. They do not go all the way through but eventually I will want to replace this. I think if I were to remove this arm to try a different one the board would be toast.
Has anyone fashioned a tonearm board for this tt? If I were to try to have one made, what materials would be best.
thanks,
Stephanie
Hi,
I have been enjoying my Fons CQ 30 w/ Sumiko MMT tonearm very much for both 78s and LPs. For lps, I am using a rebuilt/retipped Benz Glider which is heavenly. Expert Stylus in England did the work and it is just lovely. Any ways, I was wondering if anyone know a source for replacement parts for the Fons CQ30?
My motor is fine at the moment but given its age, I'd love to know if I could find a replacement. I was tuning the suspension to accomodate a heavier cartridge and looked closely at the motor from underneath and could not make out a brand or any specs.
My belt looks to be as new, but it would be great to know a source for replacement parts.
Finally, I see that my arm board was damaged by the overtightening of the tonearm mount. The bottom face of the board has some damage and what could be the start of 2 splits by the screw holes. They do not go all the way through but eventually I will want to replace this. I think if I were to remove this arm to try a different one the board would be toast.
Has anyone fashioned a tonearm board for this tt? If I were to try to have one made, what materials would be best.
thanks,
Stephanie
absolon
Super Member
I've been giving some consideration to making up an armboard for mine in order to try a Luxman arm I have, but am not sure it is the same configuration as yours. My version of the TT uses a metal plate rather than a wood board and may or may not be the same size as yours (pic of mine here: http://audiokarma.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1076110&postcount=29 ).
Can you measure the dimensions of yours including thickness and also post a picture of the underside to show the mounting details? It will be a bit before I get to it, but if it matches mine, making two or three is as easy as making one. I have a woodworking shop and would likely use Purpleheart or Padauk.
Don't know about the motor, but belts are here: http://www.turntablebasics.com/belts/fons.html
Can you measure the dimensions of yours including thickness and also post a picture of the underside to show the mounting details? It will be a bit before I get to it, but if it matches mine, making two or three is as easy as making one. I have a woodworking shop and would likely use Purpleheart or Padauk.
Don't know about the motor, but belts are here: http://www.turntablebasics.com/belts/fons.html
Patchoulain
New Member
Nice to see there's still some interest in this TT! Afraid I can't help with the spares, although Origin (as suggested) should be able to help - at a price! The motor appears to be riveted to the subchassis, so removal won't be trivial.
I've now had some time to reflect on the Fons, and it does seem to be very good indeed, and makes a good show even when compared to a modern 'skeletal' deck (a Project RPM9).
The confounding thing is that the design *seems* so unlikely. The plinth is pretty insubstantial. The platter appears to have been a bell in an earlier life, and the method of record support (two rubber strips on the platter) seems inadequate. I haven't figured out the main bearing arrangement, but the spindle appears to rest on a couple of white plastic circular shims. The suspension isn't particularly 'bouncy'. The motor is, more or less, directly coupled to the main bearing and doesn't seem to be that quiet. As I suggested above, there's a definite 'ring' at 33 rpm, and I've tracked this down to some sort of sympathetic platter/motor resonance. And the final piece of design curiosity is painting a stroboscope pattern on the platter - useless if you want to account for cartridge drag when setting the speed. It all *looks* like an extravagant 'break the rules' prototype.
So, at first sight, it ticks virtually no boxes! But I've been using it with a SME III and an AT OC9, and as I say, the sound is superb. I'm sure there's a moral here
Pics again of mine:
http://patchoulian.googlepages.com/fonscq30
Rob
I've now had some time to reflect on the Fons, and it does seem to be very good indeed, and makes a good show even when compared to a modern 'skeletal' deck (a Project RPM9).
The confounding thing is that the design *seems* so unlikely. The plinth is pretty insubstantial. The platter appears to have been a bell in an earlier life, and the method of record support (two rubber strips on the platter) seems inadequate. I haven't figured out the main bearing arrangement, but the spindle appears to rest on a couple of white plastic circular shims. The suspension isn't particularly 'bouncy'. The motor is, more or less, directly coupled to the main bearing and doesn't seem to be that quiet. As I suggested above, there's a definite 'ring' at 33 rpm, and I've tracked this down to some sort of sympathetic platter/motor resonance. And the final piece of design curiosity is painting a stroboscope pattern on the platter - useless if you want to account for cartridge drag when setting the speed. It all *looks* like an extravagant 'break the rules' prototype.
So, at first sight, it ticks virtually no boxes! But I've been using it with a SME III and an AT OC9, and as I say, the sound is superb. I'm sure there's a moral here
Pics again of mine:
http://patchoulian.googlepages.com/fonscq30
Rob
Stanton681EEES
Addicted Member
steph_gaynor
Well-Known Member
motors, armboard continued
Hi,
I may email Origin just to see if they have fitted their motor inside a Fons. It is costly though.
It is fantastic, Absolon, that you are able to construct an armboard. I will send you a PM about this. The base you constructed for your Fons is so beautiful. Did the added weight and rigidity improve the sound?
I did notice that some Fons have metal arm mounting plate. I wondered if that was a customization or just a newer version. In the next week I will take a picture of arm board and measure it. I would love to see a close up of the metal version.
Also, if anyone gets a close look at their Fons CQ30 motor and can decifer the specs on it or a brand name, I would be most interested. Manufacturers like Hurst in the US may produce one that would be a match for a very reasonable amount of money. You just need to know all the specifications right down to the shaft dimension to find a match.
best, Stephanie
Hi,
I may email Origin just to see if they have fitted their motor inside a Fons. It is costly though.
It is fantastic, Absolon, that you are able to construct an armboard. I will send you a PM about this. The base you constructed for your Fons is so beautiful. Did the added weight and rigidity improve the sound?
I did notice that some Fons have metal arm mounting plate. I wondered if that was a customization or just a newer version. In the next week I will take a picture of arm board and measure it. I would love to see a close up of the metal version.
Also, if anyone gets a close look at their Fons CQ30 motor and can decifer the specs on it or a brand name, I would be most interested. Manufacturers like Hurst in the US may produce one that would be a match for a very reasonable amount of money. You just need to know all the specifications right down to the shaft dimension to find a match.
best, Stephanie
steph_gaynor
Well-Known Member
1974 Fons Armboard Closeup/dimensions
Hi,
My armboard seems to be the same as Packrat's -- he got a terrific shot of the underside and posted it a while back:
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=40572&d=1172082416
I did not flip my table upside down not wanting to disturb the setup just now. The dimensions of the part of the armboard which attaches to the arm are 11.3 length x 8.5 width x 1 depth cm.
This rectangular piece is stapled to a support block 3/4"/1.9cm thick. It extends about 2 cm under the main armboard. The thickness of the wood lessens by about .64 cm or 1/4 of an inch where attaches to a metal support. This diagonal attaching arm extends 2 inches/5.1 cm or so into the metal frame which holds it with wing nuts.
I noticed another problem recently that the top plate is uneven where I have the suspension the tightest by the tonearm. I need to redo the suspension and want to use better springs -- I tightened the spring to accomodate the Sumiko MMT tonearm and keep the platter spinning level but it may be more tension than the fiberboard top plate can handle.
It would be cool to fit it with a more rigid base altogether -- including a more rigid -- topplate, but I would not know how to begin to do such a thing. pipe dreams abound!
Best,
Stephanie
Hi,
My armboard seems to be the same as Packrat's -- he got a terrific shot of the underside and posted it a while back:
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=40572&d=1172082416
I did not flip my table upside down not wanting to disturb the setup just now. The dimensions of the part of the armboard which attaches to the arm are 11.3 length x 8.5 width x 1 depth cm.
This rectangular piece is stapled to a support block 3/4"/1.9cm thick. It extends about 2 cm under the main armboard. The thickness of the wood lessens by about .64 cm or 1/4 of an inch where attaches to a metal support. This diagonal attaching arm extends 2 inches/5.1 cm or so into the metal frame which holds it with wing nuts.
I noticed another problem recently that the top plate is uneven where I have the suspension the tightest by the tonearm. I need to redo the suspension and want to use better springs -- I tightened the spring to accomodate the Sumiko MMT tonearm and keep the platter spinning level but it may be more tension than the fiberboard top plate can handle.
It would be cool to fit it with a more rigid base altogether -- including a more rigid -- topplate, but I would not know how to begin to do such a thing. pipe dreams abound!
Best,
Stephanie
Attachments
steph_gaynor
Well-Known Member
cool Fons cq-30 in ebay in UK
It looks heftier than the one I have for sure. The seller responded to my question about the top plate and it is made of metal instead of the vinyl covered wood like substance top plate I have.
Too bad shipping to us is $125 GBP -- I would have bid on it for sure if it were in the US.
Have a look, it is a beauty! Stephanie
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120241542156&_trksid=p2761.l1259
It looks heftier than the one I have for sure. The seller responded to my question about the top plate and it is made of metal instead of the vinyl covered wood like substance top plate I have.
Too bad shipping to us is $125 GBP -- I would have bid on it for sure if it were in the US.
Have a look, it is a beauty! Stephanie
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120241542156&_trksid=p2761.l1259
