Blank Cassettes - reccomendations.
- Thread starter Hemmlock
- Start date
Scorpion8
Addicted Member
I just picked up 6 Maxell MX-90 and MX-S-90 tapes at SA that had radio talk shows recorded onto them (talk about over-kill). Previous owner never even used the labels, so they all look brand new. $1. I've picked up many almost-new blank cassettes here and re-used them. It helps cut down on the number of my NOS stash I have to dig into ....
Pardon my being late. I just found out about this forum. Here's a repeat of my post on homerecording.com:
Based on a review in the May 1980 issue of Modern Recording, I would chose the TDK. Maxell always advertised like they were the best and everyone knew it; but according to this review, their UD-XLII was only average as high-end cassettes went, while TDK SA came out on top. In the high-bias tapes, seven were compared. Here's how TDK SA and Maxell UD-XLII compared.
R/P response @ 0VU record level:
TDK 24Hz-9.8kHz, Maxell 24Hz-9.4kHz
R/P response @ -20VU record level:
TDK 23Hz-25.6kHz, Maxell 23-25.0kHz
Maximum REC level for 3% THD @ 400Hz:
TDK +6.0, Maxell +4.5
MOL @ 10kHz:
TDK -2.5, Maxell -4.0
PB sensitivity @ 1kHz, 0dB REC level:
both -0.5
PB sensitivity @ 10kHz, -20dB REC level:
TDK -18.5, Maxell -20.75
SNR, "A" weighted, Dolby off, Re: 3% THD, 400Hz:
both 56.5
SNR, "A" weighted, Dolby on, Re: 3% THD, 400Hz
TDK 64.5, Maxell 63.5
THD @ 0VU REC level, 1kHz (in %)
TDK 0.9, Maxell 1.05
The machine used for the tests was a Nakamichi 1000. TDK was better in all the areas except the two where they were tied. In fact, TDK was the winner in the contest of all seven type II tapes.
TDK SA is still being made, but TDK's top-of-the line today is SM. I recently bought a bunch of SM, but I can't say I've used it enough yet to comment much from personal experience with it.
Based on a review in the May 1980 issue of Modern Recording, I would chose the TDK. Maxell always advertised like they were the best and everyone knew it; but according to this review, their UD-XLII was only average as high-end cassettes went, while TDK SA came out on top. In the high-bias tapes, seven were compared. Here's how TDK SA and Maxell UD-XLII compared.
R/P response @ 0VU record level:
TDK 24Hz-9.8kHz, Maxell 24Hz-9.4kHz
R/P response @ -20VU record level:
TDK 23Hz-25.6kHz, Maxell 23-25.0kHz
Maximum REC level for 3% THD @ 400Hz:
TDK +6.0, Maxell +4.5
MOL @ 10kHz:
TDK -2.5, Maxell -4.0
PB sensitivity @ 1kHz, 0dB REC level:
both -0.5
PB sensitivity @ 10kHz, -20dB REC level:
TDK -18.5, Maxell -20.75
SNR, "A" weighted, Dolby off, Re: 3% THD, 400Hz:
both 56.5
SNR, "A" weighted, Dolby on, Re: 3% THD, 400Hz
TDK 64.5, Maxell 63.5
THD @ 0VU REC level, 1kHz (in %)
TDK 0.9, Maxell 1.05
The machine used for the tests was a Nakamichi 1000. TDK was better in all the areas except the two where they were tied. In fact, TDK was the winner in the contest of all seven type II tapes.
TDK SA is still being made, but TDK's top-of-the line today is SM. I recently bought a bunch of SM, but I can't say I've used it enough yet to comment much from personal experience with it.
vintage vic
New Member
graywolf said:
the best tape in spite of the tests is denon. it is the longest lasting tape made.
tdk has ended up usually on top of many "test" tests but over the years it has always had the same problem which is oxide and tape surface flaking. i spent ten years away from tdk after knowing it had the oxide flaking problem and in going back to it i experied the exact same problem.
the denon tapes i think it is are the best cassette tapes made bar none. all of my denon tapes 15 years later still play with no oxide shed and are clean and crisp as the day i recorded them.
vic
pioneernut
I need help
I've got TDK SA90's from 1983 that still sound great, no oxide shed at all. I've played those tapes on crappy stereos to fine 3 head decks and they work great. I haven't seen any excessive dirt collecting on the tape guides, or pinch roller. Even the Maxell UD-XLII's I've got work great too after all these years.
I have heard Denon made excellent tape, but I rarely saw it for sale back in the day. Also, I'm not saying you didn't have a problem with your TDK's but I truely feel that TDK made excellent tape and hopefully others would agree.
Now my only wish, would someone like RMG make metal bias cassettes. No one makes them, Ebay is outragous, and there has to be a market worldwide for some high end cassettes.
- Mike
I have heard Denon made excellent tape, but I rarely saw it for sale back in the day. Also, I'm not saying you didn't have a problem with your TDK's but I truely feel that TDK made excellent tape and hopefully others would agree.
Now my only wish, would someone like RMG make metal bias cassettes. No one makes them, Ebay is outragous, and there has to be a market worldwide for some high end cassettes.
- Mike
graywolf
Sonically Challenged
TDK's SM is their studio mastering tape. It normally comes in short lengths (10 to 60 minutes) for recording one take , the 20 minute (10 min/side) seems to be the most common. AFAIK, it is the same tape as SA, but it has higher grade housing. I did not even know they made it in a 90 minute version.OldSkool said:
BTW, they used to make an SM-X version which was (supposedly, I have never used it) about the highest grade high-bias cassette out there.
The 90-minute version has apparently been discontinued. I think I got my 60-minute ones from here: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/TDK-SM60-Cassette-10Pack?sku=930868
I've been away from recording for years and I'm just now getting back in. Did 3M get their dropout problems fixed? In the tests I quoted further up, 3M came out three times as bad as any of the other contenders for dropouts. This matches my experience from back then as well.
lorne
Sonic Lizard
Well, if any of you guys in the USA are finding stuff like this you can count yourself lucky. Japanese manufacturers have ceased supplying any of the tape that enthusiasts have embraced for (in some cases) decades.
First to vanish was metal. The last metal available was about four years ago: Axia (Fuji Industries) K Metal, TDK MA EX type IV and Sony Metal-ES. And then the last of the better Type II tapes quickly disappeared: Sony ES-II, TDK AD-2. The high end products mentioned in this thread had vanished long before those. Incidentally I believe that the ES-II this may have been the last, high quality tape emulsion ever engineered, and it may have come from a video tape of the same name. I met a Sony engineer who had been a project member, and he said the emulsion was excellent.
So, I expect that the US market MAY be the last place you will find stuff that audio dudes are looking for, and I can't think of where it might be currently manufactured. I've tried to find out but to no avail. I suspect that it is all NOS. I suspect that because of America’s penchant for large inventories, there are still cashes of this stuff around. The clock is ticking on that score.
What I have said above supports Arkay completely. Eventually, and perhaps sooner than later, the only thing you are going to find readily available on the shelves will be Normal Type I. There is a reason and it goes like this:
We'll skip the obvious — and go straight to where the market remains sufficiently buoyant to ensure any production at all in the immediate future. This is in the so-called Third World and developing countries that still use cassette players — parts of Asia including Afghanistan, the Indian subcontinent and perhaps parts of Africa. In some areas of the world, cassette remains a form of oral communication. Illiterate populations living on the margin can pass messages and information using the cassette, not to mention music and entertainment. A lot of the machinery that is used is NOT very sophisticated or sonically discriminatory. High grade, Type II tape is not a requisite. As long as the shell and the emulsion are reasonably resilient, the market is supplied by Normal bias Type I tape.
This brand is part of the big Japanese chemical complex, and the parent company is “Taiyo Corp”. Most of their stuff seems to be produced in Japan. Their computer archive and backup media under the ‘THAT’S brand is very respected, and I buy it over anything else on the shelves.
NEXT: In my next post, I want to introduce a survival plan based on Hemmlock's original question at the head of the thread. What is the best bang for the buck? Forget hunting up NOS and paying for shipping and previously hoarded stock. Just how good or bad is the stuff we can still conveniently buy? Just how do the current emulsions compare with the old standbys. Can a high-end deck that can be set up to optimally use one of today's more ubiquitous emulsions produce an acceptable recording? We'll never see the likes of Type IV again outside of private sales and trading. But can we live with what happened after CrO2 emulsion?
pioneernut
I need help
I too looked at the Japanese websites for Maxell and TDK tape and was astonished that the marketing for audio cassettes is very kiddish, with bright colors, no specs, and finding Type II tape was non-existent. The writing is on the wall, buy the Type II tapes you can find cause I really think it'll be history in another year. This is an area that I think RMGI should seriously consider investing production in. Even if Type IV tape is unfeasable, Type II, could have a market worldwide if TDK and Maxell drop out of the game. I bought a bunch of TDK SA90's out of fear they'll be gone soon.
- Mike
- Mike
lorne
Sonic Lizard
Hi Pioneer nut; you're quite right about that. And the reason is quite simple. The market that remains for tape is in the hands of Japanese middle school children. These young people don't always have the pocket money or the part-time jobs [arbaito] in order to buy the mini-disk players they want to own. But they may have an older brother or sister who hands down their Walkman type players — typically much more compact than the clunkers that arrived in the US and Canadian markets. Even a 100 yen or so differnce in the price of a couple of tapes may be significant to them, and so Normal bias tapes make up most of what very little gets put on todays display shelves.
I've not looked recently, but not so long ago Yodobashi camera and other major outlets had Type II tape, AND it was packaged in that cutesy way with cats and mascots in colored shells. TDK AD-2 was the last tape product to carry any specs on the packaging. Now, an interesting question is, did the tape emulsions of some of the former series make into the kiddy product packaging. I don't mean the prime cuts, but the tertiary end stuff of the late 90's. Perhaps. I have some Type II tape that was all cutsied up and it sounds pretty good. For a while I was buying any stock that did not say CD something on it in the perhaps vain hope that it was not bumped somewhere in the bandwidth like some tapes are reputed to be. I bought boxes of a TDK tape that comes in a pink wrapper containing pink shells. A cutesy cat decorates the wrapper. There is no series name or anything — just the tape type and EQ. I've used a lot of it to transcribe a friend's old LP collection for him.
My preferred machine is an A&D (Akai) GX-9100EX. This is an upper-end machine that I can manually calibrate for each tape I record on. Usually I DON'T use any noise reduction. The TDK is nevertheless very quiet. In fact one advantage of most of these surviving tape series is their quietness. A walking cat is stencilled on the TDK shell. Perhaps it's significant of something.
If I wanted the best recording, I'd find another method R to R perhaps. A hull is not hard to find here. But the remaining cassette stock is cheap and convenient, and my results have pretty good. Maybe not quite as exciting as the OLD TDK metal I have here, but c'est la vie. Anyway, I can keep some the juice in the original by keeping NR off and it is quieter.
So the moral of the story is not to be put off by the package. But what about yur finding no Type II in your searches. I'll look around in the next few days, and if I see some, I'll let you know, and we can go from there. Thre may be some Sony CDix-II left. You can see the specs below. Forget about the Type IV mentioned there.
My own situation is that I'm stocked right up with virgin tape. And three days ago I bumped into a pile of abandoned Sony CDix-II and Axia PS-II that was recorded on once by what appears to have been a pro — 77 units!
Attachments
Jay Pemberton
Active Member
wil816 said:
Oh man, you HAVE been away a long time! 3M totally got out of the tape business, audio and video alike, back in 1996. They sold their tape division (by then called 'Magnetic Media Division' or such like) to Ampex, which was changing its name to Quantegy around that time. From what I remember in the mid-1990s, most all the Scotch cassettes I saw at the end (usually in drugstores) were Korean made. Nothing I'd expect to confuse with any of the American-made product of 'back in the day'. Luckily I got most all my worthwhile old tapes where the pressure pads were the infamous foam-rubber type re-shelled into shells with the better copper-spring variety, back when I could get empty replacement shells from Radio Shack.
To anyone else here: How about some links to those kitchy Japanese tape sites with the cats and whatnot? I'd like to see some of that.
jleon92f
Addicted Member
Total Media..
Hi,
I buy my cassette tape from,
http://www.totalmedia.com/default.asp?CID=JO0506A&OID=-1&bustype=01
$.99 cents each Maxell XL II
John.
Hi,
I buy my cassette tape from,
http://www.totalmedia.com/default.asp?CID=JO0506A&OID=-1&bustype=01
$.99 cents each Maxell XL II
John.
pioneernut
I need help
Heres TDK Japans only page on Audio Tape, Type 1, AE series tape, this one isn't in the cutsy packaging, but I can't even find TDK SA90, it was just there like 6 months ago. The link to buy TDK SA90 is gone on the USA website, but its still listed. I think thats a hint right there that its history.
http://translate.google.com/transla...fe=off&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools
Heres Maxell Japan's cutsy Happy Tape formulas.
http://translate.google.com/transla...fe=off&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools
Lorne, I feel sorry for your selections of tape available in Japan. Its a good thing you managed find some Sony tape and have some stock. I have funny feeling whats left here in the US is simply stock piles left over in warehouses. Most of that tape is made in Japan, and assembled in Malasia or Mexico around here.
Take care, Mike
http://translate.google.com/transla...fe=off&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools
Heres Maxell Japan's cutsy Happy Tape formulas.
http://translate.google.com/transla...fe=off&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=/language_tools
Lorne, I feel sorry for your selections of tape available in Japan. Its a good thing you managed find some Sony tape and have some stock. I have funny feeling whats left here in the US is simply stock piles left over in warehouses. Most of that tape is made in Japan, and assembled in Malasia or Mexico around here.
Take care, Mike
