A/D/S line pecking order?
- Thread starter savv
- Start date
digital_delay
New Member
ADS order
only going by what i have owned:
L710 series 2 - just got last saturday and need to hear more
L500 series 1 - THE biggest bargain of the entire ADS line IMO (along with being their best 2 way IMO) i have owned: L200c, L300, L400 series 1 (woofers are RARE), L420, L470, L500, L520 and L7e (sounds like it was made by a different company) ... these have gone for <$50 on ebay recently. will not sell
L470 ... nice looking ... IMO better sounding than the L420, but not the L400. will sell soon
L400 series 1 (series 2 is a completely different speaker (smaller) and as a result they made very few rubber surround replacement woofers for the series 1) also excellent and kicks the L420 and L470 IMO ( i still have all 3 and did a side by side recently). will not sell (i have too much invested in replacement woofs)
L7e .... nice speakers, but i will sell as they just seem different (bass less tight???, no silk dome tweets) they actually sound pretty good until you put them next to older ADS. will sell soon.
L300, L200 (just sold mine on CL for $100) and the ridiculously overvalued L400 series 2 (smaller than S1).... these 3 i buy when the price is right because money is no object to those who want them. you could buy a nice set of L810's for what you'd spend on the little L400's.
.... the bigger ones are a bit out of my range at present.
only going by what i have owned:
L710 series 2 - just got last saturday and need to hear more
L500 series 1 - THE biggest bargain of the entire ADS line IMO (along with being their best 2 way IMO) i have owned: L200c, L300, L400 series 1 (woofers are RARE), L420, L470, L500, L520 and L7e (sounds like it was made by a different company) ... these have gone for <$50 on ebay recently. will not sell
L470 ... nice looking ... IMO better sounding than the L420, but not the L400. will sell soon
L400 series 1 (series 2 is a completely different speaker (smaller) and as a result they made very few rubber surround replacement woofers for the series 1) also excellent and kicks the L420 and L470 IMO ( i still have all 3 and did a side by side recently). will not sell (i have too much invested in replacement woofs)
L7e .... nice speakers, but i will sell as they just seem different (bass less tight???, no silk dome tweets) they actually sound pretty good until you put them next to older ADS. will sell soon.
L300, L200 (just sold mine on CL for $100) and the ridiculously overvalued L400 series 2 (smaller than S1).... these 3 i buy when the price is right because money is no object to those who want them. you could buy a nice set of L810's for what you'd spend on the little L400's.
.... the bigger ones are a bit out of my range at present.
soundmotor
super modified
savv said:
Analog & Digital Systems -
Its earliest form was BRAUN/ARIA and later ADs/BRAUN. The 1st incarnation of the logo alone was ADs. It coincided with the BRAUN drivers used in the early designs. They also used Acron drivers in the 1st generation L200 called just the 200. All this occured prior to ~1977.
The second version is the classic ADS used exclusively until ~1990. This logo was shown both within & without a boxed perimeter. You'll notice a striking similarity between the ADS logo & the NAD logo of the same period. Yes, there is a connection although tenuous. This period encompasses all the classic "L" designs from New England speaker standard, wood boxes & cloth grilles up to furniture grade veneers & formed metal grilles.
From 1990 up to late 1993 it was a/d/s/. This logo was designed by Frog Design out of California. This was the drift period & introduced plastic cabinets (CM) & abyssmal towers (M). Very few bookshelves (B7/B8/L7e/L8e/L9e) were made & the 2-ways were the best of those.
From 1994 on it is ADST, but who cares? The last 2 logo changes chart a company that lost its way.
DEI is the new owner of the brand, They use the last 2 company names. The brand sits in a backwater now.
The above is IIRC so forgive me if there is some factual blurring.
soundmotor
super modified
sydsfloyd67 said:
The L200/L300 tweeter uses a smaller magnet than the one used in the larger speaker. The efficiency is lower. Here is a breakdown of tweeters -
206-0101 - Used on early 200/300 series. It has a sticky outer coating.
206-0101A - Used on later models. Sticky coating is on inside of dome & the parts can be used interchangeably. The "A" stood for automotive. Models that use this 1" dome tweeter are as follows:
L10, 200, L200, L200c, L200cc, Delta Lab M1, 200i car speaker
300, L300, L300c, L300cc, 300i car speaker
206-0126 - Used in the later versions of some of the above speakers. It has a shiny black plastic dome. A little less efficient than the doped fabric dome but with better detail.
L200e, L300e, 200is, 300is
The 206-0126 can be used interchangeably with any of the 0101 versions but a minor crossover change depending on the model may be needed. Some of them had a series pad on the tweeter & it should be reduced in value.
For any of the above, you'll find the front plate of the tweeter with & without the stamped ADS logo.
Large bookshelf speakers also used a 1" dome tweeter but with a bigger magnet. The earliest versions often had a set of hotdog shaped holes surrounding the tweeter.
206-0100 was later replaced by the 206-0116. They are interchangeable.
The 3-way bookshelves & small towers used a 3/4" dome of identical construction to the above.
206-0107 was replaced by 206-0117. They are interchangeable.
The largest bookshelf (L980) & large tower (L1590) used a 3/4" with larger magnet than any of them. It was the 206-0118 and it has no equivalent.
The L2030 (& maybe the L1530) used the 206-0119. A 1" with samarium cobalt tweeter. Wilson Audio used these in an early version of the WAMM.
For any of the above, you'll find the front plate of the tweeter with & without the stamped ADS logo.
Around 1988, all new models started using the copolymer tweeters. No 3/4" version was made, only a 1". There were essentially 4 versions.
206-0122 rectangular plate (fits earlier rectangular plate routed openings but the plate is thicker.
206-0123 round plate. Identical to the 0122 except for the plate.
206-124 round plate. Same plate as the 0123 but with larger magnet.
206-128 round plate. Identical in size to the 0124 but front plate is billet aluminum. Perhaps the finest tweeter ADS ever made.
Last edited:
soundmotor
super modified
Mark B said:
The first high-end component car speaker. I've got both 320i & 320is versions. They are keepers. The mistake that ADS made was not offering a 6" version & not modifying the chassis so they would be more easier to install in cars that had factory grilles. When the 320i (& rarer 315i) were conceived, factory speaker locations were nearly always a single speaker in the dash or a pair of speakers on the rear deck. You had to cut own opening for the front.
soundmotor
super modified
GordonW said:
I have. You heard the best there was in that series. the L2030s were horrible relative to other designs. Think about it, "dual 14" woofers, SIX dome midranges, and a dome tweeter" (actually, it was 4 mids). One of these things is not like the others. As good as that tweeter was, it was hard pressed to keep up. You could actually turn-off 3 of the mids and then, the L2030s sounded pretty good at low levels & nearfield. The L1530s however just plain rocked under any condition!
soundmotor
super modified
lfender said:
The L690 & L990 are the odd men out in the ADS line. They were basically adaptations of the L570 2-way & L880 3-way (sort of) configured as small towers.
As I understand it, NAD approached ADS to build them a pair of towers. ADS did the design work, ordered cabinets from Hados in Germany and readied to go on the project. NAD however had a change of heart & decided to go to Braun in Germany and they essentially copied the ADS prototypes. Now what is weird is that ADS owned Braun's hifi arm & needed things to keep it busy. It is likely after the purchasing decisions were made at ADS, the job got moved. I believe the NAD models were MR20 & MR30 which caused confusion later as they had TV monitor with the same name.
Around 1991, NAD could no longer get any cooperation from Braun as far as getting spare parts from them. ADS was getting ready to divest itself of Braun anyways back to Gilette and who knows what was happening over in Germany? NAD approached ADS & ADS built them replacement parts with the Braun part numbers on them. They are however exact ADS L690 & L990 parts by another name.
soundmotor
super modified
bignfat said:
And boy can the C1500 crossover be hot-rodded to give you even better performance too!
The nice thing about the PB1500 is that if you blow those woofers, who cares? In fact, pulling them before they blow & selling them to a L630/L730 owner would be an act of kindness. Because the bass cabinets are large & the system active, you can replace them with virtually any car subwoofer spec'd to work in a sealed box. In other words, nearly any of them.
In the interim, if you want to get even better performance from it, do the following: If the unit is set up so that the woofers are facing you, rotate it 180-degrees and face the woofers at the wall. Leave a 3-5" distance from the wall & adjust to get better bass. Also, thumbtack a towel or piece of foam in front of the woofers to further attenuate the vocals thats sometimes creep out depending on your crossover point. The C1500 is a 12dB/octave crossover & that is not enough when a small speaker is used like the L400. You cannot set the crossover point low enough on the PB1500 & not get a sub/sat transition suck-out. Also, your imaging should improve too as you no longer have a 3rd vocal source in the room.
soundmotor
super modified
uriah Heep said:
The L1230 was probably the best "all-rounder" of the early era ADS. The L1230 is really a repackaged L810 and the narrow baffle & vertical array of the mid & tweeter gave it a slight acoustic advantage over the L710/L810 bookshelves. While it did not have the impact of the L1530, that is easily remedied with a modest subwoofer. They can hold their own with nearly anything.
soundmotor
super modified
LBPete said:
No cast frames were used on the early generation speakers such as the 00, 10, 20, & 30 Series. This includes most of what has been previously discussed & other models such as the L910, L10, BC8, 620, 700, etc.
Cast baskets were used at the upper-end of the mid-era ADS speakers & were found in the L880, L980, L1090, L1290, & L1590, Series I & II for all. Also the home subwoofers such as SW2, SW4, SW5, SUB10 & SUB12. The lower-end range L470, L570, L780, L690, & L990 (Series I & II where applicable) all used stamped frames.
When the CM, M, & SAT Series came out, they went back to stamped frames.
soundmotor
super modified
LBPete said:
The L880's can be seriously upgraded by subsituting the stock 10" woofer for and ADS S10 automotive subwoofer if you can find them. They do pop-up cheap on eBay periodically as no one really knows what they are. By current state of the art, they are rather wimpy in comparison to current car subwoofers.
The S10 has approximately 2x the magnet and it will lower the box "Q" of the L880 considerably to both flatten out & deepen the bass response. Not to mention the S10 used a Kapton voice-coil former vs. aluminum and is much more durable.
soundmotor
super modified
MTY said:
The first version M towers were awful. In the bass section of the crossover, the coils would saturate at high-power input and shut off the amp. Nakamich Stasis amps were most vulnerable. There was an upgrade to the Series II M towers that addressed this with beefier coils. It is easy to tell because the new coils looked like transformers rather than spools and they were mounted on a separate PCB. It was also offered as a retrofit to the early M towers if anyone complained about the shutdown problem. The revised versions had dramatically improved bass output and sounded pretty good.
The earlier L towers were a rock & roll speaker. The L1590's exemplified that. Not the best acoustically but damn fun to listen to LOUD. The L1090 was probably the best musically of this group. They are way undervalued too IMO. Likely because you can't get parts without parting out another. Perhaps the rarest of all of them is the L1590 in rosewood w/ PA1 biamplifier module cutouts on the back.
Last edited:
sydsfloyd67
Contributor
DD., Thanks the good info. What is going on with 'ridiculous' overpricing on the small (second then) L400? Last one I saw on ebay went for $350. Is that common? Do they sound that good or different than the little L300 or the much larger L500 or 520 or 570? Thanks, -sfdigital_delay said:
soundmotor
super modified
sydsfloyd67 said:
They sound the best when used with a subwoofer and high-passed. They have a 7" woofer shoehorned into a box too small for it. It gives them a pinched-up bass response. IMO, they are not as good as either the 300, 520, or 570 unless the bass input is restricted to them as in the L2300 SubSat system (2x L400s & a PB1500).
ADS made them a long time after the PB1500 went away as there was demand from the dealers for a small utility speaker larger than the 300 yet smaller than a traditional bookshelf.
sydsfloyd67
Contributor
Ah. That's was why I was after them, just hoping that the L300C could get even better if it could retain the sound quality and add a little more bass. I guess not. -sfsoundmotor said:
soundmotor
super modified
sydsfloyd67 said:
They may have briefly made a Series II version of the L400 in the 94-95 years. I seem to recall seeing something like that at CES. The major difference was that they had a 6 1/2" woofer essentially making the L400 a SAT6/S600 in a different cabinet. That would have certainly tamed the bass response as the L400 cabinet had a bit more internal volume that the SAT6/S600 versions.
I don't know though if these were ever actually made in quantity or were just vaporware to fill up their booth. You'd want to seem them with the grilles off. The original L400 woofer would extend to nearly the sides of the cabinet whereas a revised version would have a ~1" border around it.
soundmotor
super modified
MTY said:
My comment was relative to the L towers which are anything but polite. "Hi there fella!" & "in your lap" is probably the best way to describe their party girl forwardness.
The early 2-ways certainly had some of the New England characteristics, but by '83 when the model series changed over, they were more along the lines of the Tonmeister art not unlike Braun, Canton, Heco, Visonik, et al.
digital_delay
New Member
sydsfloyd67 said:
not trying to denegrate the L400 S2. my point was that for $350 you could get 4 or 5 pairs of L500's or a REALLY nice set of L710's or L810's (maybe even dinged up brauns)
they sound fine ... no better IMO than my 17" tall L400 S1's and a good bit short of the L500's .... they do have a bigger woof than the L300's and a bit fuller sound ... they are cute a heck, i'll admit ... that must be the draw, because $350 can buy you a whole lot more speaker.
IMO, with the L500, ADS hit a sweet spot for their 2 ways .... i took my L500's down to make room for the L710's ... and while i am happy to have the 3 ways, i thought there would be a more drastic improvement than i am hearing initially .... maybe time will fix that.
i have heard people here express preference for the S1 over the S2 ADS speakers .... some also seem to find them very similar ... does anyone here have precise knowledge of any differences? .... older drivers better?
is there a concrete reason for one being better than the other?