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Amplifier recommendation

M

myoldstereo

Active Member
I just got back into stereo gear and was thinking about getting a new amp (integrated).
The amp I am using is one I got from my mom several years ago. It is a Technics SA-AX540.
Speakers are Bose 901 series V and Cerwin Vega 211P with 12" drivers and one little tweeter. So I need something with a tape monitor or pre in main out for the Bose EQ to connect.
I do want to go modern, something with DAC and Bluetooth. Currently I play both sets of speakers at the same time because it sounds good to me, so it should have connection's for two sets of speakers.
I do like to listen at low volume so does that mean I need a powerful amp with 100 WPC or more? The current amp is 100 WPC I think. I basically want to connect a CD player, turntable and tape deck. Looking to spend around 800.00 or less.
Also, I have this ADC Sound shaper 2 Mark 2 EQ that I would like to use but not sure if it will work with the Bose EQ connected. I came across the Bose at a flea market and got them pretty cheep. I have always wanted a pair of them but did not fully understand the EQ scenario.
My turntable is a Technics SL-5300 that I recently repaired myself.
I'm just looking to improve the sound but don't know what to look for spec wise. I know none of my gear is high end, just middle of the road quality if that.
So I would love to hear some input on all of this. I don't have the money to build a super high end system but if I were to purchase new gear over the next couple years then maybe I could end up with something pretty nice. I do love the look of vintage gear but from what I have read online (mainly here) the newer gear is much better. Don't need to debate that at this time, just looking for a new amp suggestion. Looking forward to hearing from the experts!
Thank you and have a nice day!

Jeff
 
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We just had a similar request a day or so ago here. Unfortunately, there are no reasonably priced (i.e. $1000 and under) integrated amps with a processor loop or pre out/amp in jacks (tape monitors haven't been offered on new equipment for quite a while now). The only receiver I'm aware of that has such capability is the Outlaw Audio RR2160MkII receiver at $1000. Otherwise you'll need to look at separates or vintage equipment.

You can use the Bose EQ and ADC EQ simultaneously. You just connect one through the tape monitor loop of the other (it doesn't really matter which, as both should have switches that allow you to defeat the EQ while still using the tape monitor). However, due to the amount of boost that the Bose EQ offers at the extreme ends of the frequency range, one should exercise caution not to exceed the capabilities of the amplifier.
 
If you have 901's and like to listen loudly. You need almost 300 watts per channel. There were some big old Technics receivers made back in the 70's during the power wars. There are some big ones made to day, but unless you have lots of money they are out of reach of most folks. I think the smallest power we ever sold with 901 was 100 watts and serious owners were always back for more power.
 
Also remember that a 100wpc amp with 2 sets of binding posts is just 50wpc with 4 speakers. I don't think you will find what you need for 800.
Sorry
 
DeadTrader said:
Also remember that a 100wpc amp with 2 sets of binding posts is just 50wpc with 4 speakers.
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Well, it depends. Remember that when you halve the impedance of your output (that's assuming that both sets of speakers have the same impedance), you're (theoretically) doubling the amp's output. Of course, very few home amps are capable of actually doubling their output power this way, at least when going below 8Ω (the original Aragon amps could), but in most cases, you're going to get at least some increase in output.

Of course, it's mostly academic, because the difference in loudness when doubling the power is only 3dB. Noticeable, but not significant.
 
Looking at the 901 five manual. It says not to power a set of conventional speakers along with the 901's. Only, with a second stereo amp for the conventional speakers.

I'm not familiar with your current Amp. If your second set of speakers are also 8 ohm rated. I would check if your Amp is rated for 4 ohm load. If it is wired for two pair to run in parallel.

Maybe a used Bryston preamp and 3B power Amp. But, likely north of your $800 budget.
 
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swechsler said:
We just had a similar request a day or so ago here. Unfortunately, there are no reasonably priced (i.e. $1000 and under) integrated amps with a processor loop or pre out/amp in jacks (tape monitors haven't been offered on new equipment for quite a while now). The only receiver I'm aware of that has such capability is the Outlaw Audio RR2160MkII receiver at $1000. Otherwise you'll need to look at separates or vintage equipment.

You can use the Bose EQ and ADC EQ simultaneously. You just connect one through the tape monitor loop of the other (it doesn't really matter which, as both should have switches that allow you to defeat the EQ while still using the tape monitor). However, due to the amount of boost that the Bose EQ offers at the extreme ends of the frequency range, one should exercise caution not to exceed the capabilities of the amplifier.
Click to expand...
Hello and thank you for responding. I checked out the Outlaw receiver that you linked, nice unit and has most everything on my wish list. And 1000.00 is fine. I was hoping to stay closer to 800 but will do what I have to do. I don't have a problem with "separates either, I just need to get educated on them as well. A month or two ago I chatted with a person from Crutcfield he recommended two receivers but both are not available.

www.crutchfield.com

Audiolab 6000A Play (Silver)

Stereo integrated amplifier with Bluetooth®, DTS Play-Fi®, and built-in DAC
www.crutchfield.com www.crutchfield.com
www.crutchfield.com

Yamaha R-S700

Stereo receiver
www.crutchfield.com www.crutchfield.com

I have seen the Yamaha on ebay but not crazy about buying used electronics on ebay. I did not look for the other one based on price tag. But now that I'm into this a bit further I realize I need to up the budget.
The Outlaw is getting the most attention to me at the moment, thank you for linking it to me. Now I just need to understand how the Bose EQ connects to a pre-amp and power amp combo (separates).
I don't mind spending 1000 on an amp, I just want to be sure that it will make my system sound much better. It sounds good now but could be better. For some reason I think the amp is the place to start. I have a nice Shure M97xE cart running on that turntable but maybe that needs to be updated as I do have a re-pop stylus on it. And my speakers are not high end either so there is that. I just sank 600.00 into the Vegas, they have totally rebuilt drivers and crossovers and I refinished the cabinets and built new grills for them. So they need to stick around, bought them new when I was teenager.
The current system seems to have plenty of power but it lacks the high end, I have the treble and bass cranked all the way for the Bose and they still sound dull. I'm hoping a new amp will improve that, what do you think?
Thanks again!

Jeff
 
Old Guy8 said:
Looking at the 901 five manual. It says not to power a set of conventional speakers along with the 901's. Only, with a second stereo amp for the conventional speakers.

I'm not familiar with your current Amp. If your second set of speakers are also 8 ohm rated. I would check if your Amp is rated for 4 ohm load. If it is wired for two pair to run in parallel.

Maybe a used Bryston preamp and 3B power Amp. But, likely north of your $800 budget.
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Thank you! I did a quick search and I see they are several thousand dollars. I just cant sink that kind of cash into a stereo, but thank you for pointing out that option. I do have the Bose manual downloaded but must have missed the part where the do not recommend using them with other speakers. And I'm not sure how to check the amp for the OHM load. I need to get educated on the whole OHM thing.
 
I had the Outlaw RR2160 for a few years and it did everything I asked of it till I brought home a pair of 4ohm Canton Karat 300's. It did 165 watts per into 4ohms but it wasn't enough to get them to sound like when I auditioned them when it was connected to a powerful high current amp. I did run 2 pair of speakers with the Outlaw. ML LX16's 4ohm and various 8ohm floor standers. I called Outlaw before doing so and they said it was OK just don't drive it to stupid loud levels. It never hiccupped once. It's a great choice for the money.

Check my signature for what I'm running now. The Parasound amp and pre cost me 2100 on sale and it was worth every penny. A high current power amp will power pretty much any speaker you want with 400 watts into 4ohm's. It was exactly what the Karats needed with control, separation and all the rest. Going with a power amp opens up a world of choices in speakers even the difficult to drive ones so it future proofs your system.
 
sanford12 said:
I had the Outlaw RR2160 for a few years and it did everything I asked of it till I brought home a pair of 4ohm Canton Karat 300's. It did 165 watts per into 4ohms but it wasn't enough to get them to sound like when I auditioned them when it was connected to a powerful high current amp. I did run 2 pair of speakers with the Outlaw. ML LX16's 4ohm and various 8ohm floor standers. I called Outlaw before doing so and they said it was OK just don't drive it to stupid loud levels. It never hiccupped once. It's a great choice for the money.

Check my signature for what I'm running now. The Parasound amp and pre cost me 2100 on sale and it was worth every penny. A high current power amp will power pretty much any speaker you want with 400 watts into 4ohm's. It was exactly what the Karats needed with control, separation and all the rest. Going with a power amp opens up a world of choices in speakers even the difficult to drive ones so it future proofs your system.
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Well sounds like the Outlaw might be good for me. I don't see myself getting into super expensive speakers down the road but I do have interest in the preamp idea. I need to do a lot of reading on this to really understand it all. Thank you!
 
myoldstereo said:
If I was to get an amp that was only capable of supporting one set of speakers then could I use something like this?
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I think the recommendation was due to the fact that other speakers generally won't sound good with the Bose EQ enabled, and the 901s won't sound good without it. However, presumably that's for having the speakers in two different rooms. If you're playing them in the same room simultanously, and it sounds good to you, then it should be fine. Since the CVs are rated at 4-8 ohms impedance, using an impedance matching switch box like the one you linked is probably a good idea (it's not just a case of not having enough speaker terminals; you could always double up the connections), since the combined impedance will probably* be under 4Ω, which is the lowest that pretty much all receivers and integrated amps can handle. Note that it will probably decrease the total amount of power available to the speakers, but if you listen at low levels (as you stated in your OP), this shouldn't be an issue.

* I say probably, since without actually seeing the impedance graph for both speakers, the 4-8Ω impedance rating on the CVs is a little vague. But it's best to err on the side of caution.
 
I have an Adcom GTP500 pre and a Yamaha P3500S that work very well together and cost $450 used. The amp is 350wpc @8ohms and the pre has a two tape loops but really doesn't need them - my EQ is just inline with the pre-out to amp-in.

Yamaha pro amps are exceptional and I recommend their performance highly. But they are butt ugly. The Adcom is wonderful in every way.
 
swechsler said:
That Yamah is from 2010 (I'm actually surprised that they still offered tape monitors so recently). It's unlikely you'd be able to find one new.
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Ya I didn't think I would find a new Yamaha since its no longer available from Crutchfield. Did see one on ebay but I am not comfortable purchasing electronics on ebay unless I knew it was from a member here that I trust.
Regarding the idea that the Cerwin Vegas wont sound good with the Bose EQ has me thinking. I tried them with and without the Bose EQ and they actually sound much better with it. I'm sure I'm the only one in America that has Bose and Vegas running at the same time, it just kinda happened one day. About two weeks after getting the Vegas finished up I saw the Bose for 200.00 and jumped on it. Next think you know I have all four speaks going.
I have enjoyed this learning process and this forum has been a wonderful asset. Before I came a member most of my google searches led me here, so here I am. Last night I learned how the Bose EQ would be connected if I were to buy separates. I do like the idea that you have more options down the road with them and I do believe the sound would be cleaner. But I also really like the Outlaw RR2160 integrated amp. It looks sweet and has just about everything I wanted. Im sure I would be happy with it for many years to come. And it certainly must produce a better sound than this old Technics home theater receiver that I am currently using. I just need to learn more about the impendence (OHMS) and wattage. I don't want to overpower my speakers or underpower them. The Bose manual says 10 wpc minimum but I don't see a max. Someone mentioned I need 300wpc to really unleash them so I have more research to do on that alone. I do like to get loud on occasion but not like heavy metal concert loud, I have to respect my ears! As a drummer, carpenter, cabinet maker and concert goer my ears suffer enough. I have a semi soundproof room (24 x 20) I built for drumming. But there are time's I want to listen to music while the wifey watches TV in the room above me. That's when the low volume comes in. So I think you answered my question on do I need a big WPC amp for low volume, answer is no.
Thank you for all your help, this thread has got me going in the right direction. I appreciate all the input from everyone!
Have a great day!

Jeff
 
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