As for INFLUENTIAL this list is a disaster in omitting the DYNACO A-25 which had exceptionally affordability, decent bass response, and tremendous midrange tone that outsold all other consumer speakers during the late 60's-70's. It was probably THE speaker that catapulted hifi stereo to the emerging baby boomer generation rather than having hifi stereo the domain of select hobbyist. If that is not influential then what else comes close?
Audioholic's 10 most influential speakers of all time.
- Thread starter RamblinE
- Start date
BMWCCA
Addicted Member
Does anyone writing such drivel these days even possess enough of an historic frame of reference to begin to pontificate on such a subject? Apparently not!
Even if you accept "most influential" as the basis for the list, how absurd is it to spend as much time as they did on the L100 discussing "east-versus-west" nonsense without even a mention of the fact that the 4310 was intentionally voiced with its non-linear response to mimic the ubiquitous Altec studio monitors of the era but in a smaller form factor? That omission alone discredits the rest of the list, and those who made it. And Thiels as "most influential"? Come on! Other than their being over-priced and under-performing examples perpetuating the living-room "audio shrine" to show off to your fellow McMansion neighbors, have these idiots ever compared them to better-sounding speakers at a tenth their price? I laugh every time I go into the local showroom and have to endure their sound.
I agree with others here that cutting this list off at 50-years practically eliminates most of what are truly "influential" to speaker development since that time. Sort of like discussing the most "influential" automobiles but starting the range in the '40s, eliminating the T-Model or Model A.
Happy New Year to everyone! :thmbsp:
Even if you accept "most influential" as the basis for the list, how absurd is it to spend as much time as they did on the L100 discussing "east-versus-west" nonsense without even a mention of the fact that the 4310 was intentionally voiced with its non-linear response to mimic the ubiquitous Altec studio monitors of the era but in a smaller form factor? That omission alone discredits the rest of the list, and those who made it. And Thiels as "most influential"? Come on! Other than their being over-priced and under-performing examples perpetuating the living-room "audio shrine" to show off to your fellow McMansion neighbors, have these idiots ever compared them to better-sounding speakers at a tenth their price? I laugh every time I go into the local showroom and have to endure their sound.
I agree with others here that cutting this list off at 50-years practically eliminates most of what are truly "influential" to speaker development since that time. Sort of like discussing the most "influential" automobiles but starting the range in the '40s, eliminating the T-Model or Model A.
Happy New Year to everyone! :thmbsp:
JimPA
Distinguished Member
Our forum member formerly from Chicago has the best historic frame of reference on this subject matter.
Humm,(Bose 901's) There you go haters.. Happy New-Year!
Best-
Boozehound
Best-
Boozehound
Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
Yeah, no ESS is almost criminal. Stats have been popular for much longer that the Magneplanar approach (They're panels, but not stats, right?). Even Radio Shack was doing stats.
At least they gave Wharfedale a mention for their US-marketed offerings in the '60's (and Goodmans as well). It's not like I expected the W90 or even the W60 mentioned, but the W*0 models sold quite-well in the states... Certainly plenty kicking around)
Ten years from now, you'll be reading about influence of external DAC's and the growing head-fi market.
This list IMO has a different set of flaws than the list published by the Absolute Sound several weeks(?) ago. I don't much see the sense in putting Classic ARs and KLH as two entries, for example, as they are variations on a theme.
And while the Bose 901 has it's fans, it didn't INFLUENCE anybody, and remains, after nearly 50 years, the only speaker that radiates more power to the rear than to the front . Of course that may be due to the fact that Bose sued anybody that tried.
And while the Bose 901 has it's fans, it didn't INFLUENCE anybody, and remains, after nearly 50 years, the only speaker that radiates more power to the rear than to the front . Of course that may be due to the fact that Bose sued anybody that tried.
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Agreed. Especially since they included a third member of the genre, the Advent.
Depending on you perspective, more or less is sort of "correct", and least from a market standpoint.
You have to remember, this is a few peoples opinion that they decided to publish.
IMHO people put more weight into these lists then they deserve.
A way to sell a boring issue perhaps.
Influential is kind of a safe description to me, as they avoided the "best" label.
But then did they influence current speaker design? Doesn't seem like it, nor do you see many copy cats these days.
I guess their point is influenced the market, in general.
The Maggies and Klipsch are the only ones still around, more or less in their current form.
That does say something to me.
Had a few of these, over the years, with the exception of the Maggies, none would be a first or second choice IMHO of course.
As a side note, I don't agree with the small soundstage of Maggies. What model are they listening to?:scratch2:
As mentioned, I might have squeezed in the AMT's, as they main reason their was a lull, had to do with ESS's problems, and patents not expiring.
Not to mention getting a handle on how to really use it to it's full capabilities.
You have to remember, this is a few peoples opinion that they decided to publish.
IMHO people put more weight into these lists then they deserve.
A way to sell a boring issue perhaps.
Influential is kind of a safe description to me, as they avoided the "best" label.
But then did they influence current speaker design? Doesn't seem like it, nor do you see many copy cats these days.
I guess their point is influenced the market, in general.
The Maggies and Klipsch are the only ones still around, more or less in their current form.
That does say something to me.
Had a few of these, over the years, with the exception of the Maggies, none would be a first or second choice IMHO of course.
As a side note, I don't agree with the small soundstage of Maggies. What model are they listening to?:scratch2:
As mentioned, I might have squeezed in the AMT's, as they main reason their was a lull, had to do with ESS's problems, and patents not expiring.
Not to mention getting a handle on how to really use it to it's full capabilities.
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As is the dome tweeter, introduced in the 1958 AR-3. That's a lot more common than acoustic suspension woofers in current model speakers.
frommerstop
Super Member
In what way, other than signalling the end of an era, was/is the Klipschorn influential? Besides being passed the 50 year threshold set for this list, very few speakers actually followed in it's footsteps and those that did have all fallen far from successful.
Similarly, I don't see how any small box acoustic suspension speakers need be mentioned after the AR - that WAS a speaker that undeniably spawned a large change in home audio. Did the Bose 901 spawn a lot of clones, or new designs from competitors that explored their "direct reflecting" principals? I can only think of one and it only lasted a couple years. As much as I LOVE Maggies, I don't see them as having really changed all that much of the audio landscape either. Maybe three, or four other companies tried to make similar products, Yankee, Eminent Tech and arguably Apogee come to mind, not exactly a groundswell!
I'd have to give some credit to the suggestion of the Bose Cubes & subs though. They may not have advanced the SOTA in high fidelity audio, but at least they WERE influential... much as I hate to admit it, those little sub/sat systems have actually changed the way most folks look at speakers.
As far as omissions, I'd say the Dahlquist DQ-10 is a biggie... it certainly started a major rethinking about baffles and staggering drivers for time alignment... I cant see companies like Vandersteen, Snell, or Thiel becoming what they did without the DQ-10 having got the ball rolling. Of course there have been all sorts of innovative designs that didn't really change the course of audio, AMTs, Walsh drivers, etc., but good as many were, if they didn't catch on, for one reason or another, it's hard to put them in a list of "most influential speakers".
Frankly, I don't think the author of the article has a solid understanding of what the word "influential" means.
Similarly, I don't see how any small box acoustic suspension speakers need be mentioned after the AR - that WAS a speaker that undeniably spawned a large change in home audio. Did the Bose 901 spawn a lot of clones, or new designs from competitors that explored their "direct reflecting" principals? I can only think of one and it only lasted a couple years. As much as I LOVE Maggies, I don't see them as having really changed all that much of the audio landscape either. Maybe three, or four other companies tried to make similar products, Yankee, Eminent Tech and arguably Apogee come to mind, not exactly a groundswell!
I'd have to give some credit to the suggestion of the Bose Cubes & subs though. They may not have advanced the SOTA in high fidelity audio, but at least they WERE influential... much as I hate to admit it, those little sub/sat systems have actually changed the way most folks look at speakers.
As far as omissions, I'd say the Dahlquist DQ-10 is a biggie... it certainly started a major rethinking about baffles and staggering drivers for time alignment... I cant see companies like Vandersteen, Snell, or Thiel becoming what they did without the DQ-10 having got the ball rolling. Of course there have been all sorts of innovative designs that didn't really change the course of audio, AMTs, Walsh drivers, etc., but good as many were, if they didn't catch on, for one reason or another, it's hard to put them in a list of "most influential speakers".
Frankly, I don't think the author of the article has a solid understanding of what the word "influential" means.
portnoy
AK Member
I'd sure like to get my KLH-1's (w/analog bass computer) back. I sold mine at a drachma sale in sto elliniko in 1989.
If you don't like picky posts, skip this.
If you don't include the Quad ESL 57 because its older than 50 years old, it seems to me you can't include the AR 1, 2, or 3 (and maybe the 4 -- I can't remember when it came out). Later iterations of the 2 and 3 make the 50 year cut, but it seems to me that the Quad also had a few revisions.
Granted the Quad wasn't the first ESL, and ESLs in general have always been outliers in the market, but the Quad did make all other speaker manufacturers rethink what could be accomplished.
I also am surprised to hear that the EV Interfaces were the first speakers to use T/S parameters in their design. My impression, based on an article in an old SAE (I think) journal, is that the Jensen 2 and 3, which were pretty much the first calculated design (rather than cut and try) ported speakers were designed using work very similar to that of Thiele and Small. If this article isn't overstating the case, as the first ported (tube not hole) speakers, these Jensens should be on the list, if they aren't also too old. I do think the Interfaces were influential in introducing passive radiators to the larger market -- drone cones of the cut and try variety had been around, but EV actually designed them mathematically.
And going back to the beginning of the thread, I don't think Voigt is associated with transmission lines -- that was Bailey -- but with tapered quarterwave pipes.
And I think Weathers was the first with a commercial sub sat system, though again this was early enough in the sixties that it may not make the date cut.
If you don't include the Quad ESL 57 because its older than 50 years old, it seems to me you can't include the AR 1, 2, or 3 (and maybe the 4 -- I can't remember when it came out). Later iterations of the 2 and 3 make the 50 year cut, but it seems to me that the Quad also had a few revisions.
Granted the Quad wasn't the first ESL, and ESLs in general have always been outliers in the market, but the Quad did make all other speaker manufacturers rethink what could be accomplished.
I also am surprised to hear that the EV Interfaces were the first speakers to use T/S parameters in their design. My impression, based on an article in an old SAE (I think) journal, is that the Jensen 2 and 3, which were pretty much the first calculated design (rather than cut and try) ported speakers were designed using work very similar to that of Thiele and Small. If this article isn't overstating the case, as the first ported (tube not hole) speakers, these Jensens should be on the list, if they aren't also too old. I do think the Interfaces were influential in introducing passive radiators to the larger market -- drone cones of the cut and try variety had been around, but EV actually designed them mathematically.
And going back to the beginning of the thread, I don't think Voigt is associated with transmission lines -- that was Bailey -- but with tapered quarterwave pipes.
And I think Weathers was the first with a commercial sub sat system, though again this was early enough in the sixties that it may not make the date cut.
Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
He included an opening disclaimer on the Blose system (the sub & satellites system, not the 901), and I agree with him. It DID do a lot to change people's perceptions about what type and how BIG (or more-specifically how SMALL) a speaker system really needed to be in order to get what most people (and not necessarily audiophiles) consider acceptable, full-range performance. That system may have sucked, but through brilliant marketing, it really did change the face of the industry and spawned some very-worthy imitators that did the sub/satellites thing much, much better than Blose did.
And believe me when I say this, I have VERY-good reason to hate the "home theata' in a box" idea that Blose pioneered. Trust me on this, I am speaking from the heart here. Five years of my a**hole upstairs neighbors using one to try and drive me out so they can have this property all to themselves (an idea that backfired on them). I DESPISE the classic sub/satellite systems with every fiber of my being.
And like someone already said, the Klipschorn really just signalled the end of the huge corner-speaker era, but AR, on the other hand, signalled the beginning of smaller speaker systems and big bass from a much-smaller footprint.
By the way, I had no idea that Quad's first ESL model WASN'T the first electrostatic model out there.
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Blose? C'mon Twanger, that's unworthy of you.
dnewma04
The Healer
Missed your post earlier, agree on the AR/KLH/Advent comment, obviously. I think the Bose influence can be seen with any speaker that utilizes the backwave or any attempt at being moderately omni-directional.