Best improvement / bang for buck

[Audiofreak71]

I 100% believe you. I need to study up on this... actually have a box of acoustic tiles a friend gave me for studio use... you know roughly 18”x18” black squars with jagged designs... suppose i start by googling and reading but if you have any specific suggestions, would love to hear.

If money is a factor you can DIY your own panels and bass traps , there are threads here on how to do it as well as many online. You can buy already assembled panels as well in a wide variety of styles and colors to fit your decor , they are of course more pricey than DIY but if you don’t want to go the DOY route there is that option as well.

I made my own panels but I have a mixture of already made panels as well that I got for a steal. My Corner bass traps are an acoustic panel frame with rock wool cut in a triangle that goes in the corners where I need them. Doesn’t take long to do and you get the exact results you want.

Audiofreak71

 

[Audiofreak71]

I have a 5.0 system in my family room, std house family room open to kitchen, second set of speakers in living room with switch box, controlling mains in family room and living room. I can only have one system in the house, so I've maximized the system. Like many here most equipment is vintage, I like 5.0 music, if I can add the TV its a bonus. The system up until 2 weeks ago was B&K reference 20, MC2200 (from Joseph H), Adcom 2535 (running 3 channel), Marantz CD5001, Sony PS-X7. Speakers JBL L200t3 (mains in family room, JBL L166 in Living room, JBL center (new last year to match JBL voice) and JBL 4301 as rear/surround. I was pleased with the way it sounded but the B&K did have a lot of adjustment, it mostly ran in stereo front/rear. TV connected with optical cable, old basic DTS. I been shopping for a new/used AV preamp for the the last year, missed on few, watched Audio Classics for a used MC, any well rated was 800-1000. So I took a leap 3 weeks ago, bought a refurbished Emotiva XMC-1. The jump from the B&K (1998) to the Emotiva is amazing in sound quality and adjustment. Just learning the all of the settings, choices set-up programming, has taken 2 weeks, I haven't done room correction yet. The reference stereo, is in a class by itself, straight line bypass, main speakers only. I'm hearing new sounds, better sounds, greater sound stage. The DTS for TV offers so much more sound. So I am reading what I can on set-up and how to use the preamp with all it's hookups/ connections. Listening to Pandora through just a 3.5 mm plug to RCA input as I type this, surprised how good it sounds. So what do you think I should do besides read/ adjust and learn.

Sounds like your getting your system the way you want , congratulations on the new gear. Imo what you should do next is get rid of Pandora, get Tidal or Qobuz and in the near future work on getting rid of that 3.5mm connection for a more solid streaming rig. Once you’ve done that you will really be taking advantage of what streaming has to offer.

Audiofreak71

 

[isotopesope]

Also signed up for free 30 day trial of Tidal HiFi which has better file format over spodify... we’ll see...

I’m intrigued to try Tidal myself. Perhaps once I get my Airport Express streaming setup dialed in on my 80’s McIntosh 2 channel music system. My 1/8” toslink adapter seems lost in mail, so still can’t run the Airport Express through my DAC. I could use Tidal on my Marantz 5 channel home theater system though... hmmmm.

I use YouTube Premium now and am pleased with it, though know it’s not the most “audiophile” high fidelity service out there. I stream more casually though, than seeking audio perfection... however, perhaps that will change. I also find YouTube has a much better selection of the obscure metal stuff I am drawn to, at least compared to Spotify.

 

[isotopesope]

Yeah, seems like a good buy. I know it's a rather silly position but I'd put mine on a shelf rather than sell for $150-$200. Presently my AV7005 is still in use in a system, but has been superseeded by an AV7705 in an ATMOS setup.

I can only guess they were trade ins? Yeah, I’d rather shelf it or gift it at that price. I’m probably grossly underutilizing my AV7702mkII only running it as 5.0. I do dare myself to try an Atmos setup with it someday.

 

[daveg3588]

What would be a good streamer to use in my system?

 

[Audiofreak71]

What would be a good streamer to use in my system?

There are many avenues you can take, one is pretty budget friendly and that’s with the Chromecast Audio , easy to hook up and you can use your phone or tablet to stream Tidak Qobuz etc through it . The Bkue Sound Node ii is another one , it cost more but is a better streamer . There are so many but those you can check out to start if you haven’t already.

Audiofreak71

 

[EL Duke-A]

Sounds like your getting your system the way you want , congratulations on the new gear. Imo what you should do next is get rid of Pandora, get Tidal or Qobuz and in the near future work on getting rid of that 3.5mm connection for a more solid streaming rig. Once you’ve done that you will really be taking advantage of what streaming has to offer.

Audiofreak71

Good suggestions here from audiofreak.

I found the steaming sound from my hdmi roku stick direct to avr/processor is better than optical. Your new xmc-1 looks killer - maybe going hdmi route for music will let you take full advantage of that bad boy.. i find the roku plus via hdmi to be solid in my system (better than bluedento bluetooth receiver or iphone via lightning to rca... actually... now that i am on free trial for tidal - i need to retest this... roku tidal app does not do master files... just hifi... but bluedento should pipe master files based in specs... will test and let you guys know.

you may not be a subwoofer person, but i find the addition of a sub to all my systems to be a good upgrade... just my opinion though and i know others don’t feel the same... good used subs usually can be had locally on CL or facebook market place for $100-150. Expect your jbls do a good job on low end so maybe not needed as much. I cross my subs over at 50 hrz for mains and 60 for center... so picking up where my speakers roll off (crossover points are 10 above low end of stated frequency range for each speaker respectively).

Anywho - congrats on your recent upgrade... let us know what you try and how it goes. Emotivas have always intrigued me so look forward to hearing more.

cheers.

 

[EL Duke-A]

I’m intrigued to try Tidal myself. Perhaps once I get my Airport Express streaming setup dialed in on my 80’s McIntosh 2 channel music system. My 1/8” toslink adapter seems lost in mail, so still can’t run the Airport Express through my DAC. I could use Tidal on my Marantz 5 channel home theater system though... hmmmm.

I use YouTube Premium now and am pleased with it, though know it’s not the most “audiophile” high fidelity service out there. I stream more casually though, than seeking audio perfection... however, perhaps that will change. I also find YouTube has a much better selection of the obscure metal stuff I am drawn to, at least compared to Spotify.

Maybe give tidal a try on your 5 channel setup... free for 30 days... try and cancel if you don’t like... hope to take a deeper dive into master tracks tomorrow... but it sounds better than spodify... how much better is tbd.

btw - listening mode on theater systems for music... not sure what options your marantz has... but i like thx music or all channel stereo.,, something to play around with.

I’m jelly of your mcintosh amp btw... never heard one but would really like to some day.

 

[EL Duke-A]

Okay - so with tidal app going from phone via bluetooth to bluedento receiver/streamer is, better than roku app via hdmi to receiver... at least to my ears. Its a subtle difference but i’d say better. The bass and mids are a bit crisper and those master files are amazingly tight and clear.

i tested rca and optical out of the bluedento... cant hear a difference there... so both seem about the same to me

 

[Audiofreak71]

Okay - so with tidal app going from phone via bluetooth to bluedento receiver/streamer is, better than roku app via hdmi to receiver... at least to my ears. Its a subtle difference but i’d say better. The bass and mids are a bit crisper and those master files are amazingly tight and clear.

i tested rca and optical out of the bluedento... cant hear a difference there... so both seem about the same to me

What are you streaming to? If you can download Mconnect it works off a Dlna/UPNP connection and sounds much better than streaming Bluetooth. It’s a one time fee of $8 at least when I used it it was .

Audiofreak71

 

[EL Duke-A]

What are you streaming to? If you can download Mconnect it works off a Dlna/UPNP connection and sounds much better than streaming Bluetooth. It’s a one time fee of $8 at least when I used it it was .

Audiofreak71

Never heard of dlna/upnp or mconnect... did a bit of googling and i’m rather confused by what i’m reading... can you explain this in simple terms?

i have tidel app on my iphone, a roku + stick and the bluedento bluetooth HD audio receiver with 5.0 aptx hd (whatever that means)...

are you saying i should use mconnect and hardwire to the receiver? Or get mconnect and do airplay into roku? Just a bit confused by all this...

Was reading that other service you mentioned QoBuz does not require all this extra consideration...

 

[Audiofreak71]

Never heard of dlna/upnp or mconnect... did a bit of googling and i’m rather confused by what i’m reading... can you explain this in simple terms?

i have tidel app on my iphone, a roku + stick and the bluedento bluetooth HD audio receiver with 5.0 aptx hd (whatever that means)...

are you saying i should use mconnect and hardwire to the receiver? Or get mconnect and do airplay into roku? Just a bit confused by all this...

Was reading that other service you mentioned QoBuz does not require all this extra consideration...

To save on confusing anymore I’ll try and explain how I used to have my setup .

I have an Oppo udp-203 it has UPNP/Dlna so I had Mconnect on my phone tidal was connected to mconnect which was connected to my oppo via UPNP connection. Sound was excellent. Just going up one notch at a time .

Now I am using Roon which uses my oppo as the core and is connected to my MacBook Pro connected to my router , I use Qobuz Hires and the sound is another level . It all just depends how much clarity you want to achieve via streaming, you can try to achieve the most natural sound with the greatest clarity or you can have a simple Bluetooth setup , it’s all subjective and their are many options which is a win win for all of us.

Audiofreak71

 

[EL Duke-A]

To save on confusing anymore I’ll try and explain how I used to have my setup .

I have an Oppo udp-203 it has UPNP/Dlna so I had Mconnect on my phone tidal was connected to mconnect which was connected to my oppo via UPNP connection. Sound was excellent. Just going up one notch at a time .

Now I am using Roon which uses my oppo as the core and is connected to my MacBook Pro connected to my router , I use Qobuz Hires and the sound is another level . It all just depends how much clarity you want to achieve via streaming, you can try to achieve the most natural sound with the greatest clarity or you can have a simple Bluetooth setup , it’s all subjective and their are many options which is a win win for all of us.

Audiofreak71

wow - thanks for the intel. Question - so with your old setup... was that a wireless connection from your phone with mconnect to the oppo w/ UPNP... is that like a wireless connection option for devices on the same network? Googled it and it seemed something like this... i think my ps4 pro has upnp (universal plug and play - interesting & easy to remember)... maybe i could use that to give it a try.

so i guess mconnect allows your phone to connect to the network via upnp... and then push tidal via the upnp connection... you just need a device on the other end connected to the network to grab the upnp signal (wirelessly?)...

Am i think about this the right way?

 

[JoeESP9]

For those who are really frugal and want to know if bass traps will improve the sound of their room, take four pillows and stack them in a corner. Turn each pillow so the stack is as high as possible.

Listen for a day or two. If it sounds better you might consider buying or building some bass traps.

Don't have any spare pillows? Walmart has microfiber polyester stuffed pillows @ ~$27 for two Queen sized ones. If they're not efficacious use them as pillows. I don't know if memory foam pillows will work as well.

 

[EL Duke-A]

For those who are really frugal and want to know if bass traps will improve the sound of their room, take four pillows and stack them in a corner. Turn each pillow so the stack is as high as possible.

Listen for a day or two. If it sounds better you might consider buying or building some bass traps.

Don't have any spare pillows? Walmart has microfiber polyester stuffed pillows @ ~$27 for two Queen sized ones. If they're not efficacious use them as pillows. I don't know if memory foam pillows will work as well.

i had that box of tiles my friend gave me... so you gave me this idea ... just wedged them in the corner from floor to about 6 ft high... my wife will hate it... but its temp to see how it works... thanks for idea.

 

[Audiofreak71]

wow - thanks for the intel. Question - so with your old setup... was that a wireless connection from your phone with mconnect to the oppo w/ UPNP... is that like a wireless connection option for devices on the same network? Googled it and it seemed something like this... i think my ps4 pro has upnp (universal plug and play - interesting & easy to remember)... maybe i could use that to give it a try.

so i guess mconnect allows your phone to connect to the network via upnp... and then push tidal via the upnp connection... you just need a device on the other end connected to the network to grab the upnp signal (wirelessly?)...

Am i think about this the right way?

Yes you are right in the ballpark. I am not sure what Roku uses if anything other than Bluetooth for connectivity it may do UPNP but I’m not sure, if not then you would need a device that has this for mconnect to work.

Audiofreak71

 

[Audiofreak71]

i had that box of tiles my friend gave me... so you gave me this idea ... just wedged them in the corner from floor to about 6 ft high... my wife will hate it... but its temp to see how it works... thanks for idea.

A more wife friendly and fairly inexpensive way is to do the rock wool cut into a triangle for corner fitment but you would have to build the corner cover to make it look better , but just the rock wall alone will provide the bass traps you need.

What @JoeESP9 said is correct though for a quick way to test if a bass trap will work in your room for the absolute cheapest way to go about it is to at the filler in the corners.

Audiofreak71

 

[isotopesope]

Thanks! The MC-752 amp is a secret gem in the McIntosh amp lineup, IMO. It sounds so good, but with it not having blue meters or a glass face it really flys under the radar. It’s direct coupled, yet I’ve never heard a McIntosh autoformer amp to compare.

I rarely listen to music on my Marantz system, but switch between multichannel stereo and pure direct two channel if I do. The one SACD I own is a 5.1 mix of Dark Side of the Moon, which is pretty fun to listen to on the 5 channel.

My living room is long and narrow, with each system at one end or the other, so for music I always listen to my McIntosh system. Plus, I mainly listen to records, and only have a TT on my MX-117.

 

[EL Duke-A]

On my gosh... i’ve read up a bit on the whole Hi-res audio streaming services like tidal and amazon HD... my conclusion... HD audio is arguable not ready for the masses. I predict improvements/simplification in how it works over next few years - at least i hope that happens.

okay, you need wi-fi vs bluetooth, but then you cant use any of the native apps... you have to use mConnect or Helos or play-fi etc and have your streaming service populate those apps w/ content... good grief! ... as charlie brown would say.

And... why in the heck can’t apple tv or roku just stream HI-res audio??? They are connected to the internet and stream 4k video with dolby atmos sound files... what am i missing???

My bluedento bluetooth reciever with 192 dac chip and aptX hd sounds killer to me. I’m just going to be content here for a while and see if the Hi-res audio streaming world can get its act together. (I dont even know if my iphone with acc can take advantage of the aptx hd... but at this point, i dont care...)

if someone has figured out an easier way let me know, otherwise, i’m going to wait for roku and apple tv and the streaming services to hopefully sort this mess out.

i guess if i had a modern network AVR, maybe its easier... but that cost money as do the wi-fi receivers like the bluesound node 2i ($550... thats the cost of a new mid-grade avr)...

sorry - just needed to vent a bit... all better now.

i’m going to focus on my acoustic panels and try to forget all about this.

 

[isotopesope]

Yeah in all my recent Bluetooth research I discovered iPhones can only use the lower quality AAC Bluetooth codec and can’t utilize the higher quality aptX codec that android devices use... which is part of what kept me from jumping on a Bluetooth receiver since I have an iPhone. after learning my “ancient” Airport Express has that 1/8” optical out has lead me to wanting to try the WiFi connection of AirPlay for streaming, which I think allows for better sound quality?? FINALLY got my adapter yesterday, so plan on messing around with it today.

Again, streaming is a casual thing for me, but I’m interested to see just how good it’s going to sound going iPhone8 YouTube app > AirPlay via WiFi > Airport Express optical out > Topping D30 > MX-117 > partridge in a pear tree.