Chevy Malibu a winner.

[Bigerik]

I have a stock 1989 Civic with under 100K on the original motor. Without mods I don't see how this car can be more fun to drive then the current Civic. There is no comparison.

Easy. The new one weighs near enough 1000 lbs more than the old ones. The late eighties/Early nineties Civics were incredibly light on their feet and responsive. The vast majority of them did not need power steering, which again made them more responsive. They were slower in a straight line, but again, due to the smaller engines and lighter weight, they felt more responsive.
Now, your hundred thousand mile Civic is more than just a little tired. DO a complete suspension overhaul (struts, springs, EVERY bushing, etc.), a COMPLETE tuneup, and then go take it for a run against a new one. In just fun to drive category, it will eat the new Civic alive. No comparison.

 

[Carmine]

Very true but all these old cars were bricks and basically had no engine management whatsoever.

You'll have to qualify what you mean by "old". Engine management is basically using an o2 sensor to keep the fuel mix as lean as possible, 70s technology that is still the basis of engine management in 2008. The main engine/transmission management improvements that have reduced fuel consumption and improved tailpipe emissions are as follows:

Sequential multi-point fuel injection
Distributor-less ignitions
Electronic overdrive transmission

Your '91 Olds would have all of these technologies, without the safety equipment mentioned in my earlier post. (Perhaps a driver's airbag) It probably has a fairly decent coefficient of drag (aerodynamics), although that really doesn't come into play in city driving.

They are definately heavier but you would think they could get at least the same mileage or better. There aren't that many that do get better.

There is really nothing around in 2008 that didn't exist in 1991 that would have a major effect on fuel economy. Even cylinder de-activation offers little improvement until you reach a steady cruising speed.

I would agree with you that most people have more/buy more power than they need. There were still folks driving at 80+ when gas was $3+, and people still jack-rabbit away from traffic lights just to be first to the next red light. But that's behavior, not technology.

I also feel your pain.. I daily-drive a similar design car as your Olds, a '93 New New Yorker (FWD, EFI V6, Overdrive) and get about 27 MPG on the highway. To get that economy from a new car, I'd have to drive some kind of cramped "kids-car", which I have no desire to do. Since my car has only 204,000 miles on it and was paid for many years ago, I have no desire to change anytime soon.

 

[arrow 68]

If by "clueless" you mean "Biased, prone to stereotype, and quick to pass judgment without regard for fact." I would tend to agree, although I say this is a human characteristic, not anything reserved strictly for Americans.

[/irony]

Arrow 68 since your profile gives no geographic location; do you consider yourself one of the "clueless" masses, above average, or something else entirely? :scratch2:

First of all I am American born and raised. All you had to do is read the thread to figure that out. Second of all why would you compare your newly redesigned vehicle to another manufacturers in the manor that Chevrolet did. I thought it was dumb. And I am sure I am not the only one. That's why they stopped running the add.
I can give you 62,000,000 reasons why I think so many Americans are clueless. We should be leading the world in many more areas then we are. We spend to much time beating our chests, and professing how great we are. We invent so much, become complacent while we thump our chests, and then fall behind while some other Country picks up where we left off, and perfects what we invented. It's frustrating, and sad to see this happen.

 

[arrow 68]

Easy. The new one weighs near enough 1000 lbs more than the old ones. The late eighties/Early nineties Civics were incredibly light on their feet and responsive. The vast majority of them did not need power steering, which again made them more responsive. They were slower in a straight line, but again, due to the smaller engines and lighter weight, they felt more responsive.
Now, your hundred thousand mile Civic is more than just a little tired. DO a complete suspension overhaul (struts, springs, EVERY bushing, etc.), a COMPLETE tuneup, and then go take it for a run against a new one. In just fun to drive category, it will eat the new Civic alive. No comparison.

This car had 54,000 on it two years ago. and it has 94,000 on it now. There is no need for any of what is mentioned above. Many things were upgraded before I bought the car. And I have the receipts from Honda. Again, a stock 88-91 Civic is not going to eat anything alive. I have been driving this car since June 05'. I drove a 93 Integra before. That car will fly. The regular 1.8 red-lines at 6800 if my memory serves me correctly. I had that car pegged over 130 MPH several times for more than a mile. Scared the **** out of myself. The car was revving at just over 5000 RPM's at about 130 MPH. I thought that was amazing. And the car had no mods.

 

[Bigerik]

This car had 54,000 on it two years ago. and it has 94,000 on it now. There is no need for any of what is mentioned above. Many things were upgraded before I bought the car. And I have the receipts from Honda. Again, a stock 88-91 Civic is not going to eat anything alive. I have been driving this car since June 05'. I drove a 93 Integra before. That car will fly. The regular 1.8 red-lines at 6800 if my memory serves me correctly. I had that car pegged over 130 MPH several times for more than a mile. Scared the **** out of myself. The car was revving at just over 5000 RPM's at about 130 MPH. I thought that was amazing. And the car had no mods.

Gotta beg to differ. The Honda Michelin series up in Canada ran showroom stock Civics, with only upgraded wheels and tires and a roll cage. No engine mods. The Hondas were running so well, GM brought out the 1LE package on the Camaros/Trans Ams to keep them ahead. The fastest of the Hondas were lapping Mosport quicker than the back half of the Irocs and Trans Ams in the Players series.
Oh, and there is no car with almost 100,000 miles on it that does not need new bushings.

 

[fsjonsey]

Actually, I am comparing them to the OLD Buicks of the 70'a-80's. You know the ones where the only people that really bought them had blue hair.

No it is not a compliment.

My dad had an 87' Lesabre. That car had THREE separate recalls on the steering column, and ate transmissions for lunch. It went through two of them before the warranty ran out.

 

[Carmine]

First of all I am American born and raised. All you had to do is read the thread to figure that out.

I don't assume anything, but I might have guessed.

Second of all why would you compare your newly redesigned vehicle to another manufacturers in the manor [sic]that Chevrolet did. I thought it was dumb. And I am sure I am not the only one. That's why they stopped running the add.[sic]

I normally wouldn't do this, but since you're so keen on labeling people as stupid, the words I "assume" you intended to use are "manner" and "ad".

I can give you 62,000,000 reasons why I think so many Americans are clueless.

Why make this political?

We should be leading the world in many more areas then we are.

Are you involved with anything that makes this happen?

We spend to much time beating our chests, and professing how great we are. We invent so much, become complacent while we thump our chests, and then fall behind while some other Country picks up where we left off, and perfects what we invented. It's frustrating, and sad to see this happen.

Are there any other groups of people you'd care to stereotype today? Should I assume that by saying "we", you are guilty of this?

Perhaps your ideas about others picking up where we left off comes from the idea that much of the safety and emissions equipment (catalytic converters, EGR, airbags, etc.) we take for granted in 2008 was developed and first offered decades ago by the same company that builds the Chevy Malibu that started the thread.

And any of the above, or the self-loathing, has WHAT to do with the Chevy Malibu? :scratch2:

 

[Carmine]

My dad had an 87' Lesabre. That car had THREE separate recalls on the steering column, and ate transmissions for lunch. It went through two of them before the warranty ran out.

I believe that car would have been 3-years old when you were born.

This link turns up no recalls related to steering column:

http://www.automobilemag.com/am/1987/buick/lesabre/recalls.html

The drivetrain used in that car (3800 V6 and 4sp auto) has a very good reputation, and often turns up in "recommended" threads on this very board.

I'm not trying to be mean, but you should really admit these aren't your own conclusions.

 

[fsjonsey]

I believe that car would have been 3-years old when you were born.

This link turns up no recalls related to steering column:

http://www.automobilemag.com/am/1987/buick/lesabre/recalls.html

The drivetrain used in that car (3800 V6 and 4sp auto) has a very good reputation, and often turns up in "recommended" threads on this very board.

I'm not trying to be mean, but you should really admit these aren't your own conclusions.

Sorry, but it was inherited from my grandfather with less than 10,000 miles on it when I was a year old. The transmission was repaired once before we got it, as was the power steering pump, on a recall order. The car broke down twice on family trips, once due to a fuel sensor, and again due to a problem with the power steering pump. The transmission went again at under 50K miles, which we paid to replace. The car was free so it was worth it. A couple of years later, the steering column started locking up while the car was in motion, and thats when my father decided to get rid of it. The car was never driven long distances, other than the family trips we took to North Carolina in it twice. It still had less than 100K miles on it when he traded it in for a used 95' Geo Prism. I was ten when he got rid of the Buick. The Geo's been going ever since.

On the other hand, My 1962 Corvair still runs like a top, and can handle deep snow like nobody's business. GM has innovated in so many areas of automotive design that I can't even mention them here. That's why I love my corvair. First car with Unibody construction. The spyder had the First turbocharger on a mass market car. The design went on to influence BMW and other european manufacturers, as well as pressure ford into introducing the Mustang. I have nothing against GM, but am just recounting an experience we had with one bad car. In fact, I'm trying to get my parents to buy a GM car to replace our 2001 accord. Honda and Toyota aren't as reliable as they used to be compared to domestic makes. The Transmission on my Uncle's 2002 Camry failed at 83K.

 

[PioneerGuy85]

The new Malibu is better than the last one, but it's still FWD, and that is an automatic deal-breaker for me.

 

[arrow 68]

Gotta beg to differ. The Honda Michelin series up in Canada ran showroom stock Civics, with only upgraded wheels and tires and a roll cage. No engine mods. The Hondas were running so well, GM brought out the 1LE package on the Camaros/Trans Ams to keep them ahead. The fastest of the Hondas were lapping Mosport quicker than the back half of the Irocs and Trans Ams in the Players series.

Oh, and there is no car with almost 100,000 miles on it that does not need new bushings.

I am close. My Civic is a Japan model. Try and drive one of these over a hundred miles an hour for a sustained period of time. The ignition wires were replaced in the last 15xxx with Honda wires, and the plugs in the less then 5xxx. It's a good little car, but it is not the super car people think it is. And certainly not without a little help from mods. Take it out on 95 and see if you can keep up with traffic. It's a slug on four wheels. But I bought it because the condition was great, had the service history, low mileage, and a realistic price. And it was inspected. And it has a good reputation for low cost reliability. And good gas mileage. I sure wish it was as fast as you say it is. Even a certified Honda Mechanic that I know had the same model year SI, I have the DX. He said his car would loose power going up a hill like mine. He never modded his. He had other cars in mind for that. You would have loved his. He sold it for $5000. The Engine was completly stock. But it had this really neat blue flame paint job that his neighbor did for him. The guy that did the work is in his 70's, and is a pro. And the interior was really neat. He said the front seats were $1500. And the original engine ran fine and it had 255,000 on the clock. He did upgrade the head gasket at one point.
My car still does not idle properly on semi cold starts until the temperature is normal. I have replaced the top Fuel Injector, IAC Valve, Plugs, and Wires, and Thermostat. I think I need to replace the primary fuel injector. Also the dash makes a grinding noise in cold weather. I guess it's the speedometer cable needs to be greased. They are rock solid cars. And it's a non interference engine, but wait a minute. This thread is about a Malibu.

 

[arrow 68]

I don't assume anything, but I might have guessed.



I normally wouldn't do this, but since you're so keen on labeling people as stupid, the words I "assume" you intended to use are "manner" and "ad".



Why make this political?


Are you involved with anything that makes this happen?



Are there any other groups of people you'd care to stereotype today? Should I assume that by saying "we", you are guilty of this?

Perhaps your ideas about others picking up where we left off comes from the idea that much of the safety and emissions equipment (catalytic converters, EGR, airbags, etc.) we take for granted in 2008 was developed and first offered decades ago by the same company that builds the Chevy Malibu that started the thread.

And any of the above, or the self-loathing, has WHAT to do with the Chevy Malibu? :scratch2:

Why Mommy, why? Right. :yes:

 

[Adam]

Actually, I am comparing them to the OLD Buicks of the 70'a-80's. You know the ones where the only people that really bought them had blue hair.

No it is not a compliment.

OK, I was avoiding this thread, but why insult 1970s Buicks? I drive a 1972 Buick Centurion convertible, with a 455 ci big block, 4 barrel carb, dual exhaust, TH400 tranny, at 150k miles the engine is getting to the point where it needs work (carburetor needs a rebuild badly), but think about it: this car is 36 years old, has 150k on it, and the engine has never been apart, I had to replace the master cylinder and power booster, and do a brake job when I got it, otherwise I've been using a nearly original 38 year old car in LA traffic on a regular basis, and I don't think any of the cars they make today will be up to that 36 years from now.

As far as the blue hair, old lady comment, the specs on the Buick 455 for 1970: 370 hp@4600 RPM, 510 torque @2800 RPM stock, even at 4,500 lbs. these cars would blow the doors off of most what they make today, and they have a lot more style. And with the big power bench seat, tilt wheel, ps, cruise control, AC, etc... they're really nice to drive. And just for the record, the guy I bought the car from wasn't an old lady that wasn't concerned about performance and never gave it the gas, but a cool old retired pilot, he flew in WWII, I still have the "Onizuka air force base parking sticker 1979" on my windshield.

 

[fsjonsey]

OK, I was avoiding this thread, but why insult 1970s Buicks? I drive a 1972 Buick Centurion convertible, with a 455 ci big block, 4 barrel carb, dual exhaust, TH400 tranny, at 150k miles the engine is getting to the point where it needs work (carburetor needs a rebuild badly), but think about it: this car is 36 years old, has 150k on it, and the engine has never been apart, I had to replace the master cylinder and power booster, and do a brake job when I got it, otherwise I've been using a nearly original 38 year old car in LA traffic on a regular basis, and I don't think any of the cars they make today will be up to that 36 years from now.

As far as the blue hair, old lady comment, the specs on the Buick 455 for 1970: 370 hp@4600 RPM, 510 torque @2800 RPM stock, even at 4,500 lbs. these cars would blow the doors off of most what they make today, and they have a lot more style. And with the big power bench seat, tilt wheel, ps, cruise control, AC, etc... they're really nice to drive. And just for the record, the guy I bought the car from wasn't an old lady that wasn't concerned about performance and never gave it the gas, but a cool old retired pilot, he flew in WWII, I still have the "Onizuka air force base parking sticker 1979" on my windshield.

Sweet car.

 

[Adam]

Thanks. This is mine.
I don't have any experience with '77 and up Buicks, but I will say that through '76 they were great cars.

 

[Brach]

Thanks. This is mine.
I don't have any experience with '77 and up Buicks, but I will say that through '76 they were great cars.

That Centurion convertable is a totally cool car. Driving it through LA traffic is a totally cool thing to do.

Many older Buicks are just as special as any of the more commonly talked about classics like Corvettes or Eldorados.

I bet Jay Leno has some great Buicks.

Seems that most people won't like something unless somebody they admire, like a sports hero, etc., tells them to do so.

We shall be robots and shall not think for ourselves or we will be ridiculed!

 

[Brach]

I'm get'n a relative's '73 Malibu

It's light metallic blue with blue interior. It has the odd swivel seats with a console shifter.
Those seats look nice but they don't recline and it seems kinda silly to take so much extra time to turn the seat sideways just to get out of the car.
It does kinda look neat when the doors are closed and the seats face sideways.

 

[Adam]

I like those 73-77 Malibus. They made a little known performance version of those cars called the Laguna S-3, some of which I think came with the 454.

 

[merrylander]

I thought it was funny that the Impala's TV Add Campaign said that one media outlet said "It's Like A Super Accord." "Except it's a Chevy."
The American auto industry is as clueless as the average American.

Well whoever came out with that brilliant line needs to pull his head out and look around. When we bought our first one it was a case of my wife looking to replace her Monte Carlo. I sent her around to the dealership after I had taken a look at the Impala LS and she really liked the car. So we bought hers, then I had to put the Probe in the garage for a week to get the A/C refilled and checked for leaks. I borrowed her car and it was such a joy to drive that I gave the Probe to the Sally Ann and got my Impala LS. The part that shocked me was the gass mileage, it was not burning any more fuel than the Probe had. And I do like the evil grin on its face, probably got that when we blew the doors off an G35.

 

[bordeno]

Well whoever came out with that brilliant line needs to pull his head out and look around.

My in-laws have an Impala like yours, even older I think, 130,000 and no problems. And the car gets up and goes too.