DCM TF2000 Deal of the Decade - with pics!
- Thread starter 707kevin
- Start date
Here are some crossover photos from the tf2000
http://lot-o-nothin.com/audio/dcm-timeframe-tf2000-part-2-crossovers
http://lot-o-nothin.com/audio/dcm-timeframe-tf2000-part-2-crossovers
GTIanz
Active Member
Coos Bay/North Bend?
Grew up there....class of 93'
I look forward to following your progress.
and holy c$@& that is a mess of a crossover!
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frperdurabo
AK Member
I've been wrong before, but it looks like there's only one electrolytic cap in the crossover. This may be really simple job. If it's in parallel with the woofer (for a zobel circuit) it should be replaced if out of spec, but no point in upgrading to a film cap)
jhoyt
Incomprehensible space llama
Are you in Brookings? Not much south of there, except...the Wingate River, as I remember. That whole area is simply heaven on earth!
Congratulations on finding the DCM's. My experience from partially refurbishing a set of TF600's is that they are the most UNfriendly speakers I've ever worked on. Steve Eberbach sure knew how to make a silk purse (sound-wise) out of a sow's ear (contstruction-wise).
Congratulations on finding the DCM's. My experience from partially refurbishing a set of TF600's is that they are the most UNfriendly speakers I've ever worked on. Steve Eberbach sure knew how to make a silk purse (sound-wise) out of a sow's ear (contstruction-wise).
I'm in Brookings. The crossover scares me.
Two of them, one left, one hiding under a resistor on the right as well.
One of them most definitely is for the woofers. Haven't traced the mid and tweet paths yet. I closed up the cabinet to listen for a while so I can have a better before and after comparison.
Yep, Brookings. We've got the Chetco River in town, and the Winchuck river near the south border. Nice place to live for sure!
Nope, sorry.
Looks like all of the drivers match and are original as far as I can tell. I'll post up models numbers after I open the cabinet again. Forgot to write them down this morning. Weird that one of the mid speaker wires was twisted on the terminal, but not soldered like the rest. Took care of that this morning as well.
One Mid driver is traveling noticeably further than the other 3, so I'm not pushing the volume to high until I figure that out.
Just finished Porcupine Tree's Voyage 34 album, Pink Floyd Division Bell before that. A little Diana Krall earlier. Maybe I'll throw some Blu-ray Master and Commander next.
So loving these speakers.
They hit much harder and much lower than I thought. I've been listening for almost 3 hours and not getting tired of it.
SoundsAlike
Super Member
The only brand of speakers I've ever had that required damaging the cloaked cabinet to pull a driver
The saggy look is the old headliner material that covers the cabinets UNDER the speaker cloth. I don't have photos of these with the speaker cloth in place, but you can see some of it still there were I cut it off. The headliner material is a nylon fabric with 1/8 inch foam backing. The foam is completely rotted out and the nylon fabric hangs loose.
I have a few samples of replacement headliner material that I'll choose from to restore them, then I'll put something as close to the original speaker grill cloth over it all.
The screen over the tweeter is factory, a few layers of felt pads are placed around the tweeters as well, along with the heavy felt pads across the mid drivers.
I have a few samples of replacement headliner material that I'll choose from to restore them, then I'll put something as close to the original speaker grill cloth over it all.
The screen over the tweeter is factory, a few layers of felt pads are placed around the tweeters as well, along with the heavy felt pads across the mid drivers.
Yeah. It's borderline retarded, but they look good with the full wrap around cloth. It would be trivial to convert these to a removable front grill, but I just couldn't do that to them.
Driver Details
Driver details
Some discrepancy on MID driver model numbers maybe? I'm not sure.
Speaker #443 Drivers are
Woofers (both)
* 719639
* 4 ohm
* 23044
Mids (Both)
* 719641
* 22594
* 5 ohm
Tweeter
Vifa H25TG-07
--------------------------------
Speaker #442 is the same except for the MIDs:
Top Mid:
* 719631
* 22594
* 5 ohm
Bottom Mid (This is the one with significantly more excursion than the others as the volume comes up):
* 719626
* 22594
* 5 ohm
The middle number on all four mids is the same, so I don't know what to think.
There are no signs that any driver has been replaced. The factory GOOP is still in place, and the soldered leads don't look tampered with.
I'm considering swapping Mid drivers from speaker to speaker and seeing if the the problem stays with the driver or the crossover. That will take hours of work on these boxes though
Driver details
Some discrepancy on MID driver model numbers maybe? I'm not sure.
Speaker #443 Drivers are
Woofers (both)
* 719639
* 4 ohm
* 23044
Mids (Both)
* 719641
* 22594
* 5 ohm
Tweeter
Vifa H25TG-07
--------------------------------
Speaker #442 is the same except for the MIDs:
Top Mid:
* 719631
* 22594
* 5 ohm
Bottom Mid (This is the one with significantly more excursion than the others as the volume comes up):
* 719626
* 22594
* 5 ohm
The middle number on all four mids is the same, so I don't know what to think.
There are no signs that any driver has been replaced. The factory GOOP is still in place, and the soldered leads don't look tampered with.
I'm considering swapping Mid drivers from speaker to speaker and seeing if the the problem stays with the driver or the crossover. That will take hours of work on these boxes though
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Crossover Diagram
I think I've got this...
Crossover guys might spot a mistake right away. I wouldn't know the difference myself. Here is my best attempt to diagram the crossover.
Strange that R14 is different values on either Speaker. Everything else is identical. R14 is not in the Mids network, so it should not be the cause of the excursion problem I'm having on a mid driver, right?
The Tweeter network is the most complex, and hardest to trace since It has the most glue and close component spacing. Between the two crossovers I think I have it accurate though.
I used a free program called TinyCAD that does a pretty good job on electrical schematics, and was easy to use.
I think I've got this...
Crossover guys might spot a mistake right away. I wouldn't know the difference myself. Here is my best attempt to diagram the crossover.
Strange that R14 is different values on either Speaker. Everything else is identical. R14 is not in the Mids network, so it should not be the cause of the excursion problem I'm having on a mid driver, right?
The Tweeter network is the most complex, and hardest to trace since It has the most glue and close component spacing. Between the two crossovers I think I have it accurate though.
I used a free program called TinyCAD that does a pretty good job on electrical schematics, and was easy to use.
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BillWojo
Addicted Member
Very nice to document all of this. I don't have those monsters but I do have a set of the TF 600's, listening to them now. Also have a set of TF 400's in my basement. They were my first and when the 600's came along I had to have them.
Steve, the guy that designed these speakers was a genius. Nothing about the drivers or the construction of these speakers even hints at the awesome sound that they produce. You have already heard the monster sound stage and when you get them finished and debugged, you will love the way they sound. I had a chance to get a set of these about 3 hours from me but they are just to big.
Glad your doing a first class restore on them, they deserve it.
BillWojo
Steve, the guy that designed these speakers was a genius. Nothing about the drivers or the construction of these speakers even hints at the awesome sound that they produce. You have already heard the monster sound stage and when you get them finished and debugged, you will love the way they sound. I had a chance to get a set of these about 3 hours from me but they are just to big.
Glad your doing a first class restore on them, they deserve it.
BillWojo
Took 20 minutes to pull the first 8" woofer.
I believe they used so much adhesive (black goop) because the screws are only through 1/4" worth of particle board. The front baffle is only about 1/2" thick and the woofer is recessed nearly 1/4". It's almost like the screws are only there to hold until the adhesive dries....
What a mess!
I believe they used so much adhesive (black goop) because the screws are only through 1/4" worth of particle board. The front baffle is only about 1/2" thick and the woofer is recessed nearly 1/4". It's almost like the screws are only there to hold until the adhesive dries....
What a mess!
Catalysis
Member
First of all I want to say to the OP what a great project this is and I am following it all with terrific interest. BillWojo you very nicely sum up my own feelings about my own TF600's. Steve Eberbach was indeed a genius and these are by far the best speakers I've ever owned, for 40 bucks in a local private sale for goodness sake. My other speakers have included Kef 107/2's, Quad 989s and 63s and Celestion Kingstons. While each of those might have specific aspects of sound that beat the DCMs, it's the overall sound of the 600s that aces them all for me. Before settling in America a few years ago, I'd never even heard of DCM. Not sure if they ever exported but it was never a name that came up at shows or in the mags. I understand that Steve was a huge fan of Quad speakers and this, to me, sounds like their main influence, except with the dynamics and spl's that you'd find lacking in the vast majority of electrostatic designs. Quite how he made conventional drivers so holographic never fails to amaze. I'd love to own/just hear a pair of 2000s one day. If they sound like 600s with an even bigger sound then my goodness the OP has indeed struck gold.
The only downside is the build quality, especially the goopy attachment of the 2000 drivers. But I get the feeling everything was done for sonic benefits, even if the underlying build was a ugly duckling.
The only downside is the build quality, especially the goopy attachment of the 2000 drivers. But I get the feeling everything was done for sonic benefits, even if the underlying build was a ugly duckling.
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