Differences Between CD Players?
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MaxSeven
Word Skeptic
Brett a
~◦●○o0o○●◦~
If anything psychological is going on here, it's the psychological need to insist that differences in CDPs are only psychological.:screwy:
I've A/B cheap CDPs before (~$100 black boxes from Japan), just for fun, and found that they do sound subtly different from each other. One was not better, just a choice of what limitations and strengths you prefer to live with. Like everywhere else in this pursuit of excellent sound, it's a choice between compromises.
I own a Rotel RCD 1070. When I got it new in 2002, it was an important improvement over all the $30 yard sale rigs I had burned through prior. It is clearer, better resolving, with a more accurate 3D soundstage... it does everything better.
Until that time, I too thought that every CDp would sound the same. They all do the same thing, right? But this Rotel came to me as a wedding gift. I did not ask for it, did not research, did not pay the $700 it cost. I simply opened the box and hooked it up. It was clear on that day and continues to be six years later.
I'd recommend a Rotel RCD 1070 or 1072 to anyone looking for a simple, solid, tried and true dedicated redbook player. I think the 1070 are down in the sub-$400 range now.
eljr
Koyaanisqatsi
MaxSeven
Word Skeptic
I most certainly am pressing on this. I don't suggest that there aren't any differences in sound amongst CDP's. The only claim that I must insist on, is that, while there may indeed be differences, one cannot consistently distinguish amongst the test group. The differences noticed are in fact completely and utterly psychological and can change with the wind. One day, one might say a Wadia sounds like 'insert description', an hour later he or she may say that very same player sounds completely different. Or one could listen to an Audio Research player, and think they are listening to a Denon. It's entirely consequential to how the listener's ears are tuned at any given moment. This happens with loudspeakers all the time. So it isn't that there aren't differences in the sound of various CDP's, but differences in hearing. Therefore, the 'sound quality' matters not when it comes to CD players. It's totally about the build quality and aesthetics of the device. So for me, I would most definitely want a $5K CD player over a $300 one, not because of sonic differences, but because the more expensive one is more enjoyable to interact with and it looks, feels and is more accomplished (engineering wise) than the lesser unit.
I'm ok with anyone telling me I'm full of **** by the way. I can take it.
I'm ok with anyone telling me I'm full of **** by the way. I can take it.
I most certainly am pressing on this. I don't suggest that there aren't any differences in sound amongst CDP's. The only claim that I must insist on, is that, while there may indeed be differences, one cannot consistently distinguish amongst the test group. The differences noticed are in fact completely and utterly psychological and can change with the wind. One day, one might say a Wadia sounds like 'insert description', an hour later he or she may say that very same player sounds completely different. Or one could listen to an Audio Research player, and think they are listening to a Denon. It's entirely consequential to how the listener's ears are tuned at any given moment. This happens with loudspeakers all the time. So it isn't that there aren't differences in the sound of various CDP's, but differences in hearing. Therefore, the 'sound quality' matters not when it comes to CD players. It's totally about the build quality and aesthetics of the device. So for me, I would most definitely want a $5K CD player over a $300 one, not because of sonic differences, but because the more expensive one is more enjoyable to interact with and it looks, feels and is more accomplished (engineering wise) than the lesser unit.
I'm ok with anyone telling me I'm full of **** by the way. I can take it.
indeed, i stick by my DCD-1500 as it sounds good, (to me, anyway) and because i like the way it looks. moreover, i feel proud of the mods i have made on it; it's such a great, cohesive unit to work on. and i happen to have a tremendous soft spot for 1986 CDP designs, anyway. i actually don't really even give a damn how much better the modern chipsets really are; i'd take my unholy, unlistenable, uncool 1500 over some vacuum-tubed, state of the art, wonder-CDP-from-some-company-i've-never-even-heard-of-before any day!! what can i say? i'm commitable, no?:screwy:
MaxSeven
Word Skeptic
bluesky
Lunatic Member
I got an old 1986 Sony cd player I bought new that sounds really great and just keep on crankin out the tunes. Wish I had that kind of luck with amps!! All my amps have crashed except an old Sony amp I bought in 1988 or so, and it just keeps on crankin and still sounds really good too. I guess that's when Sony put out some good stuff. Since then Sony has not impressed me very much, especially cassette players and CD/DVD players, nothing but trouble brand new. My wife likes Sony, we got a new 5.1 surround sound and it's just TERRIBLE playing music. But...the old Sony CD player and regular amp just keeps going, and going, and going. Both do work and sound great.
I have 4 cd players,
Rega Apollo
Cambridge 540 C
Denon DCM 290
Technics SL-PD8
Now, if you were to say they all sound the same, I'd laugh at you. The Rega easily blows all the others out of the water. It's a much smoother, cleaner listen than the others. The Cambridge sounds pretty good too, though it can get a little edgey. The other two sound pretty similar actually (which is funny, the Technics has a 1bit DAC, the Denon has a 24bit DAC).
Also, the Cambridge and the Rega have the same DAC, yet the Rega beats it out in every department. That just goes to show that the DAC isn't the only thing making a CDP sound good.
Rega Apollo
Cambridge 540 C
Denon DCM 290
Technics SL-PD8
Now, if you were to say they all sound the same, I'd laugh at you. The Rega easily blows all the others out of the water. It's a much smoother, cleaner listen than the others. The Cambridge sounds pretty good too, though it can get a little edgey. The other two sound pretty similar actually (which is funny, the Technics has a 1bit DAC, the Denon has a 24bit DAC).
Also, the Cambridge and the Rega have the same DAC, yet the Rega beats it out in every department. That just goes to show that the DAC isn't the only thing making a CDP sound good.
jn229
Super Member
Still new to this forum, but I’ll jump in. IMO there is definitely differences in CDP. Ten years ago I had a Rotel that started to skip. I replaced it with a Micro Mega Stage 6. The difference was very audible, smoother more detailed, much more vinyl sounding.
Last year I bought an E-bay/China CDP. Kind a thinking there might be a bargain by cutting out an importer. Cost to my door in Ontario about 500.00. It does not out perform the Mega, but comes very close. Can’t really define were or how the Mega is better, lets just say more involving. The build quality on the ‘MHZS’ (some handle eh) is exceptional, cuing and layout are also good. All in all not a bad deal, although 500.00 on the use market maybe you could do better. Unlike other used components, CDP make me uncomfortable.
Anyway the reason I chirped in is, The ‘MHZS’ has tubes! Two 12ax7, been thinking maybe I’ll try some tube rolling……
Last year I bought an E-bay/China CDP. Kind a thinking there might be a bargain by cutting out an importer. Cost to my door in Ontario about 500.00. It does not out perform the Mega, but comes very close. Can’t really define were or how the Mega is better, lets just say more involving. The build quality on the ‘MHZS’ (some handle eh) is exceptional, cuing and layout are also good. All in all not a bad deal, although 500.00 on the use market maybe you could do better. Unlike other used components, CDP make me uncomfortable.
Anyway the reason I chirped in is, The ‘MHZS’ has tubes! Two 12ax7, been thinking maybe I’ll try some tube rolling……
Face
BROKEN
I recently compared a older Yamaha CPD, Technics CDP, Integra SACD player, and a Marantz SACD player.
The Yammy was terribly bright, and didn't sound great otherwise. The Technics was much more neutral, but was a little dull. The Marantz rocked them all in redbook, but SACD was lackluster. The Integra was better than the Yammy and Technics in redbook, but really shined in SACD playback. Hopefully I'll be getting another Marantz player here this week that's a little higher up the chain than the rest.
The Yammy was terribly bright, and didn't sound great otherwise. The Technics was much more neutral, but was a little dull. The Marantz rocked them all in redbook, but SACD was lackluster. The Integra was better than the Yammy and Technics in redbook, but really shined in SACD playback. Hopefully I'll be getting another Marantz player here this week that's a little higher up the chain than the rest.
Designdweeb
Super Member
Score!!!
YEAH!
I scored an Alpha 8 CD player -for $150 today, and even scraped together enough $$ to get a pair of Harmonic Precision interconnects, an additional $70. I'm starting to climb out of the yard sale find budget/ style of gear acquisition, and get some synergy going. I have other Arcam Alphas, an integrated amp and the tuner. The one remote I have works with all three pieces, a good thing.
After dinner, I burrowed into the nest of wires, and hooked it up, stacked on the tuner, which is on cedar 4 inch blocks above the amp.
I let it warm up for 2 hours, the seller advised 2 or 3 hours, watched HBO's 'Generation Kill' and 'The Kingdom,' then put on some familiar pieces, a few tracks of Mahler's 2nd, a few tracks of Beethoven, Enigma, Abbey Road, put on my Grado 325i cans, and heard details and layering (ambience or detail?) in the music I never heard before. Voices, nuances in the strings and guitars, as well as percussion details, some silly, like more tonality in the woodblocks, and the modulations in the attacks. IT really is clean and fresh, sort of like putting fresh herbs in your food instead of dried herbs.
This stuff is pushing what, 15 years old? Anyway, I really like this sound. I also have a NAD, a Denon, several Sonys, a Fisher and a Nakamichi, not including the DVD/Cd players. They ALL sound different.
I can't wait till I get the room carpentry finished ( LP cabinets, hahaha) and hook up the Vandersteens.
Adam
YEAH!
I scored an Alpha 8 CD player -for $150 today, and even scraped together enough $$ to get a pair of Harmonic Precision interconnects, an additional $70. I'm starting to climb out of the yard sale find budget/ style of gear acquisition, and get some synergy going. I have other Arcam Alphas, an integrated amp and the tuner. The one remote I have works with all three pieces, a good thing.
After dinner, I burrowed into the nest of wires, and hooked it up, stacked on the tuner, which is on cedar 4 inch blocks above the amp.
I let it warm up for 2 hours, the seller advised 2 or 3 hours, watched HBO's 'Generation Kill' and 'The Kingdom,' then put on some familiar pieces, a few tracks of Mahler's 2nd, a few tracks of Beethoven, Enigma, Abbey Road, put on my Grado 325i cans, and heard details and layering (ambience or detail?) in the music I never heard before. Voices, nuances in the strings and guitars, as well as percussion details, some silly, like more tonality in the woodblocks, and the modulations in the attacks. IT really is clean and fresh, sort of like putting fresh herbs in your food instead of dried herbs.
This stuff is pushing what, 15 years old? Anyway, I really like this sound. I also have a NAD, a Denon, several Sonys, a Fisher and a Nakamichi, not including the DVD/Cd players. They ALL sound different.
I can't wait till I get the room carpentry finished ( LP cabinets, hahaha) and hook up the Vandersteens.
Adam
Last edited:
kichijai
Well-Known Member
I've had a Sony CDP-C70 from 1988 and a Pioneer laserdisc player 1994 and a second-gen top of line Panasonic DVD 310 from 1998. None of them can match my JVC 1050CD player from 1992. I also had a Technics SLP300 CDP from 1986 which was fantastic I remember, very clean and dynamic, but couldn't compare it to the JVC.
Genuinely curious here, and understanding we're relating entirely different sensory and engineering phenomena, but all the same: why does no one debate that the digital data of a DVD-Video is highly dependent on its player for video quality (as in Denon 3910 vs. 1st-gen Coby or somesuch) but the audio information of a CD is always magically transported to our ears flawlessly whether through a $39 DVD player or a $26,000 transport/DAC setup? I've had a whole bunch of CD players over my relatively few years and always found the 1980s and 1990s Sony and Technics changers I've inherited or $5 garage sale found to exceed the performance of every modern budget player I've used, to include a recently departed Oppo. I'm currently warming up to the sound of a new Sony SCD-CE595 and checking out a "vintage" Technics DVD-A10 dvd/dvd-a/cd player for comparison's sake (and because it looks amazingly cool in my rack).
But in my humble, inexpert mind - cd players make a huge difference. I can sit with an old, humble Technics changer of indeterminate model number (it has MASH on the tray FWIW) for hours of happy listening, a feat untouched by my other modern attempts at CD/DVD/universal player ownership.
But in my humble, inexpert mind - cd players make a huge difference. I can sit with an old, humble Technics changer of indeterminate model number (it has MASH on the tray FWIW) for hours of happy listening, a feat untouched by my other modern attempts at CD/DVD/universal player ownership.
Face
BROKEN
I believe I have the same Technics changer here. Does yours have a smoked cover?
If you're looking for a decent CD/DVD/SACD player on the cheap, check out Marantz DV series players. You can find a used DV-7600 for around $200 if you look hard enough, and it'll blow that Technics away. Better highs, lows, and much better dynamics. I'd say the 7600 is 3/4 of my giant killer Marantz SA-8001.
If you're looking for a decent CD/DVD/SACD player on the cheap, check out Marantz DV series players. You can find a used DV-7600 for around $200 if you look hard enough, and it'll blow that Technics away. Better highs, lows, and much better dynamics. I'd say the 7600 is 3/4 of my giant killer Marantz SA-8001.
The smoked cover, as in top loading and drawerless like a TT? It's not that model, though my mom is still using one she bought in 1991 with a rack system. It was built in April 1997, but the model info has been smudged somehow. Anyway, it's very listenable.
I'm done with incremental upgrades for a little while. I still check A'gon, Craigslist, Goodwill, and eBay for a giant killer that slipped through the cracks, but I don't have the money for any more real purchases now. I see the Marantz players recommended a lot, though, and they'll be on my list when the time comes. For now, the SCD-CE595 plays SACDs well enough and the DVD-A10 handles DVD-Audio.
I'm done with incremental upgrades for a little while. I still check A'gon, Craigslist, Goodwill, and eBay for a giant killer that slipped through the cracks, but I don't have the money for any more real purchases now. I see the Marantz players recommended a lot, though, and they'll be on my list when the time comes. For now, the SCD-CE595 plays SACDs well enough and the DVD-A10 handles DVD-Audio.